lechatnoir Posted April 4, 2017 Share Been following this thread with mild interest (at the outrage mostly), and I'll stick my head out and say that even if the service offering is worse the next time, and the cost is higher, it'll STILL sell out just as fast. Seems like a nice business to be in actually - offer the bare minimum and charge a premium Grease_Monkey and GaryvdM 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V12man Posted April 4, 2017 Share I think they were sponsored, but still on a budget as they were also auctioning a few items on FB to raise funds. I think the issue wasn't about buying drinks, it was that there was nothing available to buy if they wanted to. For me the, the riders are VIPs and not the fatcats that just come for the party.NOT sponsored - self funded - with help from friends (and "sponsors") to cover the shortfall - the life of a pro athlete is not always easy financially. There were a couple of issues - I can't put words in Grants mouth and he has finished commenting on the issue - I have tried to put them in order of annoyance - perhaps my bias somewhat, but sharing a table gives you a view. 1 - limiting riders to 1 bottle of water (after running out the day before)2 - non availability of some drinks3 - difference between front tables and "normal" tables The video has been removed - mostly due to the contovery it has caused (completely justifiable) and I am sure some pushback he has experienced as well - from many sources. What he missed out on was the altercation I had with a security guard about taking water off a front table when there was NO water to be had - this is also similar to the altercation we (partner and I) had with a security guard about bringing a bottle of wine to the dinner table a couple of years before (when there was free wine on the front tables) when this was not allowed by the organizers - this policy has subsequently changed after some pressure, and the disparity between tables also needs to change. Patchelicious, dev null, HairyLegs and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLuvsMtb Posted April 4, 2017 Share So in summary:1: Let the sponsors have their moments, we normal rider benefit from it.2: If the facilities at a race are not up to standard, make sure the organizers know about.I fully agree on both points. It all just seems like attention-whoring to post a video on social media before properly engaging with organizers and sponsors. I don't think his own sponsors were looking for this type of exposure and if I was one of them, I'd just quietly withdraw and align myself with riders who are on good footing with the management team at the Epic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted April 4, 2017 Share NOT sponsored - self funded - with help from friends (and "sponsors") to cover the shortfall - the life of a pro athlete is not always easy financially. There were a couple of issues - I can't put words in Grants mouth and he has finished commenting on the issue - I have tried to put them in order of annoyance - perhaps my bias somewhat, but sharing a table gives you a view. 1 - limiting riders to 1 bottle of water (after running out the day before)2 - non availability of some drinks3 - difference between front tables and "normal" tables The video has been removed - mostly due to the contovery it has caused (completely justifiable) and I am sure some pushback he has experienced as well - from many sources. What he missed out on was the altercation I had with a security guard about taking water off a front table when there was NO water to be had - this is also similar to the altercation we (partner and I) had with a security guard about bringing a bottle of wine to the dinner table a couple of years before (when there was free wine on the front tables) when this was not allowed by the organizers - this policy has subsequently changed after some pressure, and the disparity between tables also needs to change. I just want to clarify my stance, as I can see that my question might come across as snide. My question about whether he himself was sponsored or not, was not to point out anything about Grant himself. It was purely to illustrate that sponsors are needed, especially when it comes to "semi pro" athletes, and that surely they of all people must see the upside of having sponsors involved. On your point 3 I agree. Whilst I believe that VIP areas have their benefit for events as businesses, the disparity needs to be kept in check and be as tasteful as possible. Edited April 4, 2017 by Patchelicious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V12man Posted April 4, 2017 Share I fully agree on both points. It all just seems like attention-whoring to post a video on social media before properly engaging with organizers and sponsors. I don't think his own sponsors were looking for this type of exposure and if I was one of them, I'd just quietly withdraw and align myself with riders who are on good footing with the management team at the Epic.Is your name Cyril? I will remind you: "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil, is for good men to do nothing" Edmund Burke Grant is, and remains, one of the good guys. I am out of this... Hairy and AdamA 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotSoBigBen Posted April 4, 2017 Share Been following this thread with mild interest (at the outrage mostly), and I'll stick my head out and say that even if the service offering is worse the next time, and the cost is higher, it'll STILL sell out just as fast. Seems like a nice business to be in actually - offer the bare minimum and charge a premium I'm afraid the days of companies (ALL) thinking otherwise are long gone ... salaries are treated exactly the same way, pay the minimum expect the maximum effort and then some Profits drive everything despite those that think that passion and service drive anything! MTBeer and sometime 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted April 4, 2017 Share Been following this thread with mild interest (at the outrage mostly), and I'll stick my head out and say that even if the service offering is worse the next time, and the cost is higher, it'll STILL sell out just as fast. Seems like a nice business to be in actually - offer the bare minimum and charge a premium Luckily its a free market, and if the gap between cost and value gets too big, it creates a void for others to fill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toxic Posted April 4, 2017 Share Berg and Bush is the same.. chill zone open to all..snacks, juice, coffee, flavoured milk available all day..The Cape Epic use to be like this few years ago. I've done 2013 and 2016. I've noticed a big difference between these 2 years. The food in marquee tent where shocking in 2016. It really caters only for the pro / very rich amateur riders. We where an average team with average bikes and felt out of place in this event. Not so sure I will do it again.... Edited April 4, 2017 by Toxic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CleatsnCleavage Posted April 4, 2017 Share Husband did the Epic this year and when i showed him the video he said there were bars outside the dining tents where you could buy softdrinks, beer and wine. So not sure if grant missed those. Agree though that at the price you pay, unlimited bottle water - at teh very least - should be available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lechatnoir Posted April 4, 2017 Share I'm afraid the days of companies (ALL) thinking otherwise are long gone ... salaries are treated exactly the same way, pay the minimum expect the maximum effort and then some Profits drive everything despite those that think that passion and service drive anything! And this, dear people, is going to tech people to vote with their feet and wallets. Regarding the Epic, my legs voted for me... Grease_Monkey and MTBeer 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grease_Monkey Posted April 4, 2017 Share Luckily its a free market, and if the gap between cost and value gets too big, it creates a void for others to fill. Agree completely. I for one think the Epic is ridiculously overpriced. Do I want to do one? - Yes; can I afford to? - No. I will probably end up doing a Joberg2C next year. It's as simple as you say - people's wallets will do the talking - and by the looks of things there are more than enough who are willing to pay for the Epic experience. Until the event feels the hurt in their pocket the riders will get less, and will pay more. Vaalhaai 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shebeen Posted April 4, 2017 Share Been following this thread with mild interest (at the outrage mostly), and I'll stick my head out and say that even if the service offering is worse the next time, and the cost is higher, it'll STILL sell out just as fast. Seems like a nice business to be in actually - offer the bare minimum and charge a premium ja, but. Epic sits in a pretty unique situation currently.The business got sold, for an undisclosed some of money to Wanda.Kevbo is still in the mix, but not an owner anymore. He must be incentivised to really make it work, beyond just sentimentality. I'm guessing he sold it for a mega shirtload of cash last year (and hopefully kept a lot of the USD/EUR in the isle of man). So the new owners do actually need to see a serious return on investment. BUT, it won't just come from the main event. There will be a whole tour, it will be like ironman(which they also own) where stupid sums of money get spent on stupid levels of hyped events and a whole ecosystem is grown. But the main event needs to be the main event. They would like to think that this is the TOUR DE FRANCE of mtb, but it isnt. Joe public can rock up with his R70k and ride it with his optional boep for a day or seven. TdF is the pinnacle of road season and there's this huge conveyor belt of pro cyclists that have this as their ultimate goal. ACE has about 6/7 teams who are pro marathon mtbers, who actually try and win it. The 2017 dudes came here for 'training' and won it when all the chips fell into place. They only had live coverage of the race for the first time this year, and only online. ACE would love to have 200 pro mtbers lined up and no jo public with their R70k entry and optional boep. but that is not about to happen anytime soon. They need to tread between growing it into a massive pro event, whilst not pi$$$ing off joe public who wants to be there with his R70k entry and optional boep. and feel like he gets value for his R70k entry. I think Grant falls nicely into this. he could probably be a pro marathon oke, maybe get a top20/30 if he only did that for the year. But he's a semi pro. and being on both sides of the fence, he's saying that ACE are dropping the ball in not catering for the joe publics with their R70k entry and optional boeps. I hope someone in management is pissed off by this, because if they don't get the pro mtb TDF thing going, they'll still need joe public with his R70k entry and optional boep. And all credit to Grant for making his name gat for putting this out. oh, and he does really need a good feed! MTBeer, Headshot and Skylark 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SCD Posted April 4, 2017 Share I was sitting in at an interview of Cadel and George in the ABSA tent a few days in. Cadel was asked, from his position of former TdF winner, what he thinks of EPIC being the TdF of Mtb. He appeared very uncomfortable when he replied that the EPIC should not attempt to be something it is not. He said it is a worldclass event in its own right and category but it cannot be compared to TdF... A W K W A R D ... I bet this interview will never to be found online. It highlights just how the EPIC marketing has been carried away... *** They would like to think that this is the TOUR DE FRANCE of mtb, but it isnt. Joe public can rock up with his R70k and ride it with his optional boep for a day or seven. TdF is the pinnacle of road season and there's this huge conveyor belt of pro cyclists that have this as their ultimate goal. ACE has about 6/7 teams who are pro marathon mtbers, who actually try and win it. The 2017 dudes came here for 'training' and won it when all the chips fell into place. They only had live coverage of the race for the first time this year, and only online. ACE would love to have 200 pro mtbers lined up and no jo public with their R70k entry and optional boep. but that is not about to happen anytime soon. They need to tread between growing it into a massive pro event, whilst not pi$$$ing off joe public who wants to be there with his R70k entry and optional boep. and feel like he gets value for his R70k entry. *** Hairy, Captain Fastbastard Mayhem, Gen and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted April 4, 2017 Share Phrase of the day 'Optional boep' ???? BaGearA and Hairy 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FCH Posted April 4, 2017 Share a random number of R120 bar was accidently mentioned by someone who knows someone.... ja, but. Epic sits in a pretty unique situation currently.The business got sold, for an undisclosed some of money to Wanda.Kevbo is still in the mix, but not an owner anymore. He must be incentivised to really make it work, beyond just sentimentality. I'm guessing he sold it for a mega shirtload of cash last year (and hopefully kept a lot of the USD/EUR in the isle of man). So the new owners do actually need to see a serious return on investment. BUT, it won't just come from the main event. There will be a whole tour, it will be like ironman(which they also own) where stupid sums of money get spent on stupid levels of hyped events and a whole ecosystem is grown. But the main event needs to be the main event. They would like to think that this is the TOUR DE FRANCE of mtb, but it isnt. Joe public can rock up with his R70k and ride it with his optional boep for a day or seven. TdF is the pinnacle of road season and there's this huge conveyor belt of pro cyclists that have this as their ultimate goal. ACE has about 6/7 teams who are pro marathon mtbers, who actually try and win it. The 2017 dudes came here for 'training' and won it when all the chips fell into place. They only had live coverage of the race for the first time this year, and only online. ACE would love to have 200 pro mtbers lined up and no jo public with their R70k entry and optional boep. but that is not about to happen anytime soon. They need to tread between growing it into a massive pro event, whilst not pi$$$ing off joe public who wants to be there with his R70k entry and optional boep. and feel like he gets value for his R70k entry. I think Grant falls nicely into this. he could probably be a pro marathon oke, maybe get a top20/30 if he only did that for the year. But he's a semi pro. and being on both sides of the fence, he's saying that ACE are dropping the ball in not catering for the joe publics with their R70k entry and optional boeps. I hope someone in management is pissed off by this, because if they don't get the pro mtb TDF thing going, they'll still need joe public with his R70k entry and optional boep. And all credit to Grant for making his name gat for putting this out. oh, and he does really need a good feed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patchelicious Posted April 4, 2017 Share a random number of R120 bar was accidently mentioned by someone who knows someone.... Less than $10m, not that much really considering. That wouldn't be a once off payment, there would be tranches based on profits and targets, hence him still being involved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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