Rant: Bad Deals

[Eldron]

2 hours ago, Bomberman said:

Not sure if you are looking for something more trail orientated but this looks nogal nice.

 

https://bikehub.co.za/classifieds/item/dual-suspension-bikes/486307/niner-jet-9-full-carbon-29er-l-1x12

One of the best XCM bikes I have ever ridden. Amazing bike!

[Eldron]

2 minutes ago, Ntec Coaching said:

I have had similar experiences when I was trying to sell my bike. But I don't think it's right the way you are acting cause you lost the deal on my bike and other deals. I am a honest and kind person but I was messed around so much I just went for the first person to show me the money. It also isn't right that you gave me one star because you lost the deal and I'm sure I'm not the first. You have possibly ruined my buying and selling legitimacy because you were mad so next time just count back from 10 and look for a new deal. 

Report the rating to Admin. The rules are you can only rate someone is a deal is concluded. They can remove it.

[RomP]

One can talk about this till the end of days. ......Its simple IMO...many sellers and buyers on this Forum have not been taught the meaning of the word " INTERGITY" Unfortunately not everyone has had a decent upbringing, especially if someone wants to make a quick buck. 

[Mountain Bru]

20 hours ago, Mountain Bru said:

If you have a look at the terms of use here: https://forum.bikehub.co.za/docs/terms_of_use/

It says this:
"Ratings and feedback should only be submitted in the event that an agreement to transact was made. We reserve the right to remove feedback which relates to negotiations or communications where there was no agreement and/or a transaction did not take place."

 

 

1 hour ago, Eldron said:

Report the rating to Admin. The rules are you can only rate someone is a deal is concluded. They can remove it.

I wish the admins would clarify what the real story is and when it's appropriate to rate each other. 

But based on the content on this thread, I would say the feedback should be removed. 

Edited July 14, 2021 by Mountain Bru

[BaGearA]

I posted the answer to this on page 2 , yet here we are on page 10 

 

 

Sterkte ..

[Mountain Bru]

I see admin said this on page 2 (before BaGearA dropped the real truth bombs)

 

On 7/11/2021 at 6:25 PM, Matt said:

1. What constitutes an agreement
In many of the disputes we encounter the "agreement" between buyer and seller doesn't exist or in the absence of clear terms is viewed very  by either party. Not to say that is the cause of your experiences, but vague or unclear communication is often at the root of disputes of this nature. e.g. Where a buyer thinks they're first in line or the seller is not entertaining any other offer, but the seller never explicitly agreed to these terms.
 

My summary of that response is:
1. What constitutes an agreement? 

Yes it causes a lot of problems when people disagree on what constitutes an agreement. Bad communication causes this.

I still have no idea what constitutes an agreement in the eyes of the admins, but at least I know that it's caused by bad communication, and that it causes a lot of problems when people disagree about it ????‍♂️. 

[Nico van Loggerenberg]

My friends, what a ride this thread has been! We've learned, we've loved, we've lost, we made spelling mistakes. Some new friends were made along the way - and perhaps some enemies. We've been schooled in law, ethics, and economics, by the greatest scholars on the hub. We've attracted the attention of the mods, and been blessed by their insouciance. We've gone hunting for new deals, new opportunities, new rides, far beyond our wildest imaginations. We've learned that there are some on the hub who believe cash in hand is king, and some who believe that their word is their bond. We attracted the interest, ire, and ridicule of hub legends, somehow tempted away from the Classifieds Comments threads, casting their rods in our tiny pool. We had visitors, taking their time to complain about our complaints and wasting their time to say we shouldn't waste our time. There were moments of angst, where we wondered - was I the bad guy all along, and not helping Frodo carry the ring like I thought I was? Was I... Boromir?

 

We've learned that whenever dealing on the hub, one must communicate clearly. You should also, ideally, consult the various lawyers, law experts, and law adjacent individuals on the most suitable punishment clauses should the deal go awry. You should do your priors and make sure the hubber you're buying from is in impeccable standing, yet also, pay an immediate deposit and never waver or dilly dally - this is a sign of weakness and sure to ensure you lose your great deal. If a deal goes bad, the official position is that your only weapon is the rating system - yet we also learned that it is never to be used, not even when the seller agrees that 'yes we had a deal'. We bantered and bickered about bicycles while the country burned, and we were scolded for doing so, and yet, we persisted, insistent that our honour and desire to be correct on the internet was more important than any civil unrest. 

 

In short, we lived, truly, harrowingly, with the near death ecstasy only a cyclist who daily cheats death and flirts with taxis can understand. I salute you all, and hope I can do deals in the future with roughly 34% of you. 

[Sid the Sloth]

2 hours ago, Nico van Loggerenberg said:

My friends, what a ride this thread has been! We've learned, we've loved, we've lost, we made spelling mistakes. Some new friends were made along the way - and perhaps some enemies. We've been schooled in law, ethics, and economics, by the greatest scholars on the hub. We've attracted the attention of the mods, and been blessed by their insouciance. We've gone hunting for new deals, new opportunities, new rides, far beyond our wildest imaginations. We've learned that there are some on the hub who believe cash in hand is king, and some who believe that their word is their bond. We attracted the interest, ire, and ridicule of hub legends, somehow tempted away from the Classifieds Comments threads, casting their rods in our tiny pool. We had visitors, taking their time to complain about our complaints and wasting their time to say we shouldn't waste our time. There were moments of angst, where we wondered - was I the bad guy all along, and not helping Frodo carry the ring like I thought I was? Was I... Boromir?

 

We've learned that whenever dealing on the hub, one must communicate clearly. You should also, ideally, consult the various lawyers, law experts, and law adjacent individuals on the most suitable punishment clauses should the deal go awry. You should do your priors and make sure the hubber you're buying from is in impeccable standing, yet also, pay an immediate deposit and never waver or dilly dally - this is a sign of weakness and sure to ensure you lose your great deal. If a deal goes bad, the official position is that your only weapon is the rating system - yet we also learned that it is never to be used, not even when the seller agrees that 'yes we had a deal'. We bantered and bickered about bicycles while the country burned, and we were scolded for doing so, and yet, we persisted, insistent that our honour and desire to be correct on the internet was more important than any civil unrest. 

 

In short, we lived, truly, harrowingly, with the near death ecstasy only a cyclist who daily cheats death and flirts with taxis can understand. I salute you all, and hope I can do deals in the future with roughly 34% of you. 

Two things have put me firmly on your side today: This beautiful piece of writing, and me locating my dream bike that I was second in line for, the guy not being happy with it, offering him what he paid for it minus the extras he sold, and being told I should add about 5-10k to that amount.

[bertusras]

13 hours ago, Sid the Sloth said:

This beautiful piece of writing

He's an architect, after all ????‍♂️

[stefmeister]

15 hours ago, Nico van Loggerenberg said:

My friends, what a ride this thread has been! We've learned, we've loved, we've lost, we made spelling mistakes. Some new friends were made along the way - and perhaps some enemies. We've been schooled in law, ethics, and economics, by the greatest scholars on the hub. We've attracted the attention of the mods, and been blessed by their insouciance. We've gone hunting for new deals, new opportunities, new rides, far beyond our wildest imaginations. We've learned that there are some on the hub who believe cash in hand is king, and some who believe that their word is their bond. We attracted the interest, ire, and ridicule of hub legends, somehow tempted away from the Classifieds Comments threads, casting their rods in our tiny pool. We had visitors, taking their time to complain about our complaints and wasting their time to say we shouldn't waste our time. There were moments of angst, where we wondered - was I the bad guy all along, and not helping Frodo carry the ring like I thought I was? Was I... Boromir?

 

We've learned that whenever dealing on the hub, one must communicate clearly. You should also, ideally, consult the various lawyers, law experts, and law adjacent individuals on the most suitable punishment clauses should the deal go awry. You should do your priors and make sure the hubber you're buying from is in impeccable standing, yet also, pay an immediate deposit and never waver or dilly dally - this is a sign of weakness and sure to ensure you lose your great deal. If a deal goes bad, the official position is that your only weapon is the rating system - yet we also learned that it is never to be used, not even when the seller agrees that 'yes we had a deal'. We bantered and bickered about bicycles while the country burned, and we were scolded for doing so, and yet, we persisted, insistent that our honour and desire to be correct on the internet was more important than any civil unrest. 

 

In short, we lived, truly, harrowingly, with the near death ecstasy only a cyclist who daily cheats death and flirts with taxis can understand. I salute you all, and hope I can do deals in the future with roughly 34% of you. 

I've no idea what you're on about, but that profile pic,

 

[ChrisF]

2 hours ago, bertusras said:

He's an architect, after all ????‍♂️

 

Aaaaaa, THAT explains it ...  

[aquaratza]

On 7/15/2021 at 12:13 PM, stefmeister said:

I've no idea what you're on about, but that profile pic,

I thought the profile pic was a joke initially but nope, it's for real. I guess if you've got it, flaunt it lol

Edited July 16, 2021 by aquaratza
Added Andy Warhol

[Jewbacca]

So are you Nico V L the photographer or the ASIB one, or the architecture student or the one who went to Witfontein high?

 

 

[Bicycle Yard WESTERN CAPE]

On 7/12/2021 at 2:39 PM, AdamA said:

@Nico van Loggerenberg what would you have done in this situation as the Buyer?

Seller Posts ad: Bargain Bike for R10,000
Buyer Responds : I would like to take the bike, can I pick it up this afternoon
Seller: Sure we have a deal
Buyer: Great

1 hour later

Seller: I have someone else interested, they are at my front door with cash... are you still coming this afternoon?
Buyer: Yes I am, Please hold it for me
Seller: I can, but then you need to do an immediate payment for R5000 or cash send. if you are not committed then I am going to sell it to this guy. I can't risk loosing the sale.
Buyer: We had a deal!
Seller: I have a genuine deal standing in front of me, you might not show this afternoon.

Would you pay the deposit or not?

 

This is where the Rating system/length of membership would give you the confidence of definitely either paying or negotiating the amount of deposit in this case for assurance. Or coming to terms with the fact that the oak might be scamming you, if he is scamming you he might even accept R500 because they don't really care about how much they steal as long as they can.

If the oak wants a deal and is serious I can't imagine him going lower than 25% of the deal price for your and his commitment.

[Bicycle Yard WESTERN CAPE]

On 7/12/2021 at 4:03 PM, AdamA said:

I know I will be !!!

I

 

[Bicycle Yard WESTERN CAPE]

On 7/12/2021 at 6:17 PM, Nico van Loggerenberg said:

I've been very relaxed since I phoned the seller directly after this happened and shat him out for a good long while. I didn't start this thread to change the minds of people who worship at the altar of the market, but to raise a tiny bit of awareness, and I'm glad to have engaged with Matt, even if it was essentially "It sucks but we don't really want to change it" 

 

Other than that, I've said my peace on this. If you don't understand the fundamental requirement of open, clear, and truthful communication, good luck to you. As I said before, first come first served is fine, if that is made clear. This is about communication, and sticking to your word when you make a promise. 

Wishing all the knuckledraggers many frustrating buying and selling purchases. May your hernias ever increase and cash in hand remain king! 

Maybe Matt can put a option in to the adds that you can mark It as a Strict first come first serve.

 

But that would be a chosen by the seller and put under the Search filters. So you can decide what people you wish to deal with.

And maybe to commit to the 'term' you should pay 200 bucks into the account and once a buyer clears that you committed to your 'first come first serve' conduct the hub can release the funds. 

 

but yes unfortunately a open market can't be forced to do these things because that would just result in collateral damage to the hub's business.