Groggery

Rode CL and the extra riders from FL, GL, HL and other lower groups definitely made their presence felt in the first 7 km with 2 crashes caused directly by them. I was just behind the second one (the guy hit the wheel in front of him and looked like he went down hard) - fortunately the guy next to me and myself avoided it by riding across the grass verge onto the other side of the N17 (a la Lance Armstrong). Hope all those people who started in an earlier group when they weren't supposed to do in fact get DQ'd ...

I'm not trying to be a bigot. And simply because I refer only to roadies as "pigs", doesn't mean I am saying that MTBers aren't "pigs". Don't need to be a professor of logic to work that one out! My point is that if we all just carry on riding next to someone when they have thrown their empty sachet into the road/bush without saying anything, aren't we exactly the same as they are?

I don't deny the generalisation, and call me a "bigot" if you like. I stand by my generalisation. I have done 4 road races since the beginning of the year and in each race have seen, on average, at least 5 people littering. Not ONCE have I seen anyone: 1) Stop to go back and get their empty sachet when they have dropped it: 2) Apologise when they are called on their behaviour; 3) Call any other person to account when the other person has littered; or 4) Come to my defence when offenders get aggro with me. I haven't ridden in any MTB races, triathlons. duathlons. downhill races or any other races, so can't comment on what happens in them. Roadies are pigs. That is my view based on my experience, and I think (given that experience) my generalisation is a fair one. A generalisation, by its nature, always has exceptions, but I haven't seen any anyway. Call me a bigot if you want.

If, next time one person sees another littering, that other person is called to account as a result of this thread, I will have achieved something. This kind of comment doesn't help the situation (and, if you're too busy looking at the mountain to understand what I'm writing, the situation is littering). Grow up Luke.

The generalisation is what the public will invariably make. And I make the generalisation because I think it's appropriate in any event - I didn't see 5600 people while I was riding my race - I must have seen 200; and of those 200 six or seven were direct offenders, and I saw no-one else raise the problem with the offenders. I think my generalisation that "Roadies are pigs" is pretty fair.

Re the guy who did the 2h25 from FL - I worked out that, based on his pace in other races, he simply skipped the loop past the Rhino & Lion Park and then rejoined the race on Beyers Naude (i.e. instead of going straight at the circle, he swung a right and thereby chopped at least 45 mins off his ride). There were marshalls there - were they blind?

I know this has been discussed ad infinitem on this forum, but the problem seems to be getting worse. It astonishes me how bad roadies are at simply putting their used gu (and other nutritional product) sachets into their pockets while out on a training ride or in a race. During the Berge en Dale on Saturday, I must have seen six or seven people simply tossing their used sachets aside (not even trying to hide the fact). I always make a comment (such as "who's going to pick that up"?) to the offender if I can get close enough to do so, and I must say that I'm getting pretty tired of having abuse hurled at me as a result. I won't stop commenting though. I did a cradle loop this morning and there were used sachets every 5 m of the ride. And I think it's just a cop out if you (the reader of this post) simply say "I never do it, but I really don't ewant to provoke any confrontation so I don't say anything to other offenders". If that's your attitude, you are just as guilty - where is your integrity? These pigs (and all who just turn a blind eye) are giving us all a bad name. If you are an offender (and by "offender" I mean anyone who chucks their $h1t onto the road/into the bushes as well as anyone who simply turns a blind eye), maybe you should consider another sport. [Flame suit on]

Payback time allright - I live in the Cradle and have been travelling all over the world for the past three weeks to get to races (and will again be travelling next weekend). Thank goodness this one won't mean me having to wake up before the sparrows fart ...

I think its a bigger problem with how seedings are done. A few years back I managed a ridiculously fast time at the Bakwena, with the result that I was almost always in the A group (which was not always the best idea). In these circumstances (i.e. if you KNOW that you really shouldn't be riding with the big dogs in the A group) I think it's simply common courtesy to the big dogs to drop back a group. Obviously, however, you always want to be in the best group you can be ... If the seedings are done properly (and seeding indices calculated properly, which wasn't the case with me after that Bakwena), you shouldn't feel the need to drop back a group.

Thanks Geraldm!!! Look forward to a great race next Sunday!!!

Agree - have never had any problems with the seeding before, and I also also often drop back a group as well. My point (and maybe I'm misguided) is that it doesn't look like the seedings will be done in the same way that they have been in the past (simply asking people what their seeding index is, using only championchip timed events and the results of this race for the past two years doesn't seem very credible).

That's all fine and dandy, but I didn't do it last year and in 2010 only managed a 3h40 after sitting on the side of the road for 45 minutes with a puncture. In 2009 (and I'm stronger than I was then) I did a 2h44. My only Championchip results I have for the past year are for the Kremetart (my first race after major knee surgery, so a very bad seeding) and the Fast One a few weeks back (which was also a bit of a disaster as a result of a mechanical). If the organisers want to cut costs, that's great, but I do think that safety is all important, and proper seeding in a fast race like this is essential for safety. Are the organisers trying to cut costs by not simply getting proper seedings?

Just entered - noticed that they ask you to enter your national seeding index, and if you don't know it or don't have one, you'l be seeded according to Championchip timed events only. Looks like the groups are going to be a mess - I can just see people with seeding indices of 35 entering 15 with their entry so that they can start in the A group. This could be ugly!

Always a good, fast (but challenging) race. My experience is that it has always been well marshalled, well managed and well attended. A last chance to really clear the pipes out before the Argus.

STILL no results from Racetec ... this is the worst I've ever experienced from them (in 2010, even the Argus results were up by Monday morning). Maybe they forgot to turn the timing equipment on? I hope they do get them out (I recall someone saying that they did the Kremetart a few years back and they ended up not even being able to provide results ...)