Richard 1973

Reading Phinney and Volek and Peter Attia, they agree that being fat adapted is like a switch, either on or off. if you consume too much carb or too much protein in one meal or one day you get kicked out of ketosis and it takes 2 weeks to get the fat burning going again. With that in mind I have been at very low carb levels for three months and it was only after 2.5 months that my performance really started to feel great. I think I wrote this in an earlier post. But it will be interesting to see how the TKD perspective works for you.

Anyone doing the Burger on Sunday on low-carb? I would love to hear what your training has been like, fuel up to and then results? Just Curious.

Looks like you are sorted, nicely done. How are you performing on the bike? Are you riding water only, and what are your results like now?

Well I try and put the effort in on the spinning class :-) I read and heard on various podscasts (Probably didn't fully understand) but in "the art and science of low carbohydrate performance" that through a process of gluconeogenesis we can oxidise / convert 2-3 grams of fat per minute to glucose (but on reflection maybe glucosneogenesis creates ketones and fatty acids (FFA) that we use in muscle? Open to correction. Andreas Eenfeldt's dietry advice is what i'm eating, but you are right he is definetly not a athlete, Peter Attia would be a better example at eatingacademy.com

Tuesday and Thursday 1 - 2 spinning classes in a row, Saturday and Sunday Road riding usually with the team Saturday would be 2 hours Table view - Top of kloofnek and back. sunday would be 4 - 5 hours route varies, but DC training so we try and included 1 - 2000 m climbing . Intensity varies Longer rides easier, shorter rides could be flat out, last Sunday was an exception, we were tapering check my posts on twitter @RichardMcGeorge Recovery is astonishing, I first noticed it after the 1 toner the next day I felt completely recovered although I didnt exercise until the tuesday, then I did a double spinning class high intensity and felt amazing. From what I have read it seems we are more than capable of converting fat to glucose in the liver at a rate of up to 3grams per minute. more than enough for any exercise we need to do on a bicycle. I dont eat any carbs except what is available in the LCHF foods I eat, certainly no sugar or refined carbs. I have a few pics on Twitter of some of the food I eat and will be adding more daily as I go along. good resource is www.dietdoctor.com and lifezone.se

I'll give my perspective for what it's worth :-) I've been lowish carb since Feb2012, I've been very low carb since July 2012. less than 50g per day, I've posted pictures and info on twitter @RichardMcGeorge for anyone interested. After 2 weeks I was able to ride without eating anything during the ride and drinking only water, I felt ok and completed many training rides up to 5 hours in this state. Recently I rode the One Toner the same and I improved my time from last year by 40min, I had my blood sugar measured straight after the ride and it was 3.5 mmol(good), I felt good and concluded my brain had adapted well to using ketones as fuel. I felt pretty good. BUT I can say that over the last two weeks things have taken a dramatic turn for the better. All of a sudden I have been feeling out of this world good, climbing is fantstic, TT rides awesome, everything is just effortless, obviously I am getting fitter and losing weight, but something happened at around the 12 week mark. Like a switch got flipped and the lights came on (in terms of riding with no food). On the health side I've had my blood tested and liver and kidney function are normal, triglycerides are low, hdl high, ldl normal, fasting glucose normal. Next test end of Nov after DC I want to get my HBA1c tested and some random blood glucose tests just to see. If you are doing low carb and are strict with it my recommendation would be keep measuring yourself and give it at least 12 weeks. Check you on the DC (If we don't get stoned!)

There is no real prescription, simply personal preference. Because the races start so early and I don't normally eat breakfast till late I just prefer not to eat before a ride. The idea behind it is that your fuel tank once fat adapted is enough to fuel virtually any amount of exercise without eating. So I can delay eating food until after the exercise without impacting on my performance (At least that is my experience so far). I have happily finished a 6 hour training ride with no food. I have also happily finished rides with almonds and biltong. Once your body converts fat to carbohydrate efficiently there are no symptoms of low blood sugar levels. energy is constant brain function normal good.

Well, I was going to comment, but everything has been said. I quite like this forum. I rode the westcoast express today. Posted my fastest ave speed for a flat ride since 2006 34.7 km/h. No breakfast, no food on ride, and 1 bottle of water. Every week seems to be getting better. Weight is also down to lowest in 6 years waist measurement too.

Not at all, just interested in the benefits of Low carb high fat lifestyle particularly relating to my cycling.

Way to early for breakfast. :-) I was given a hand meter, but the price of the strips was HUGE, so I took a chance and asked the medics if they would test and they said no problem. :-)

Well, I did the One Tonner today, 156km, no breakfast, Water only (3 bottles) finished 5H30 (40min improvement over last year). I felt good the whole ride, no dips in energy. I checked blood glucose after ride 3.5mM (Medics were happy to help), I wasn't hungry until late afternoon, Once adapted, hunger falls away. Note full adaption period may take up to 12 weeks, but initial phase only 2-3 weeks. IMHO well worth it.

I had an un-refreshed page up from last night. :-) couldn't find the delete key after I posted it.

Adaption takes 3-4 weeks, Read the Art and Science of Low Carbohydrate Performance - Phinney anf Volek Often it's more fat that you need and less protein, they give formulas to help get you started, the benefits are huge, stable blood sugar, reduced inflamation especially after exercise, quicker recuperation. Ability to ride hours without refuel.

As Rob Wolff would say, try it and see if you feel better, look better and perform better, if not it's not for you.

I would have to see the results of a few randomised, double blind control trials. But you have my attention. :-)

What amazes me everytime is how many poeple chirp in to support TN. Awesome!

I am the same with my "common sense" eating, the only thing different perhaps is that I get 60-70% of my calories from healthy fats, animal fats (skin on chicken, fat on meat) Nuts (almonds), avocados, cheese and cream cheese and olive oil. Once I added those fats, no more problem with weight and no hunger. I just needed to understand that fats especially saturated fats are good for me. I took TN's turn around as a positive thing in that when you are presented with evidence that disproves a common theory, then dump the theory immediately and form a new theory based on the evidence. For me his acknowledgement "gave" me permission to investigate what this was all about, before he said it I didn't pay any attention to the LCHF/Paleo/Banting/Atkins world.

Sounds good to me. I have to agree with you.

http://livinlavidalowcarb.com/blog/the-llvlc-show-episode-588-south-african-running-legend-tim-noakes-embraces-high-fat-low-carb-living/14565

Yeah, I heard TN say Bruce is running a 5km in just over 15 min close to where he was when he was winning the comrades. Have you guys listened to the Tim Noakes interview on the Jimmy Moore podcast?

No there is a new one. :-) http://www.amazon.com/Art-Science-Low-Carbohydrate-Performance/dp/0983490716/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1348088329&sr=1-1&keywords=art+and+science+of+low+carbohydrate+performance

Yip, too much protein (more than 150g per day) increases insulin release and pushes glucose into the fat stores. reference Volek and phinney - Art and science of low carb performance

I feel like i am fat adapted now, been pretty good with low carb eating. Last weekend we (friends and I) headed out to Paarl about 110km , easy training ride 4H30 in 33 deg celcius temp, ate two boiled eggs, cheese and two pieces of droewors for breakfast, ate nothing on the ride, drank only water 750ml (200ml per hour) and felt fine, during the day after the ride i drank to thirst and went through about 2.5 liters. The next day (Sunday) we rode back clocking up another 94km, similar conditions and same food, I did eat 4 pieces of Droewors on the ride. Drank similar water. I guess the point is my blood sugar was good though out, definitely didn't hit any walls, and drinking to thirst meant re-hydrating could wait (mostly) until the end. I found it amusing how everyone else needed to eat constantly and drinking coke and energy drinks. I am the most unfit of the team/friends at the moment, but that is changing. I am starting to get fitter so am interested to see how my body keeps going. The ultimate aim is to complete the Double Century in November, the team is aiming for sub 7. So we will see.

200g of carbs seems high, I would blame that for the 4% body fat increase, insulin pushing glucose into fat stores etc.

So what is a common sense approach?