Kranky Posted December 31, 2013 Share Here are some photos of utopia for all the commuters out there. http://aseasyasridin.../not-dangerous/ cycling is not an intrinsically dangerous activity. If we truly want to make it safe and attractive, we need to focus on changing the physical environment, not on the way people dress or behave. Let’s remember that in 2014.Sadly, I don't see the political drive for such a sensible policy being implement here, so stuck with the bright t-shirts, lights and helmets we are. We can dream though. Edited December 31, 2013 by Nick. emortal 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJR Posted December 31, 2013 Share Agreed. More cycle lanes to the people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capricorn Posted December 31, 2013 Share yes, mostly agreed, but the bit about safe because insulated from danger, aka away from motorised traffic is half complete. the other half is that the pace is generally slow, hence the lower risk of significant head injuries. but fully agree with DJR: more cycle lanes filled with reasonable cyclists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kranky Posted December 31, 2013 Share yes, mostly agreed, but the bit about safe because insulated from danger, aka away from motorised traffic is half complete. the other half is that the pace is generally slow, hence the lower risk of significant head injuries. Agreed, the speed of commuters can be significant in South Africa but with more non-sporting riders (those that only ride to get from A to B), routes separated from motorised traffic and a larger number of riders, I believe the pace will naturally slow down. Looking at the use of the lanes as depicted at the link, you can't speed too much without weaving past everyone like a complete wanker. No Strava segments on commuting routes It has been shown in other countries that infrastructure is key to the uptake of commuting cycling. Unfortunately, trying to convince decision makers to build infrastructure before the demand exists is tricky. New York has shown how people flocked to more people friendly streets and commuting routes (the cycling examples start at 9 min but watch it all):http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LujWrkYsl64 Edited December 31, 2013 by Nick. Capricorn and johanpre44 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capricorn Posted December 31, 2013 Share thing with infrastructure is the cost. and then who to spend it upon in terms of income demographics. In this country, it will be seen as pandering to the 'advantaged'.. u know that drama.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJR Posted December 31, 2013 Share thing with infrastructure is the cost. and then who to spend it upon in terms of income demographics. In this country, it will be seen as pandering to the 'advantaged'.. u know that drama.. Bike lanes like the Blouberg one cost fortunes to build, BUT not all bike lanes have to be expensive. Taking an existing street, cutting a 2m wide strip off it with bollards or a curb and painting "bike only" signs on it will cost very little. Imagine how many of Cape Towns streets could be made over this way. Imagine removing all the parking for cars from the Southern Suburbs Main Road and using it for a physically separated bike lane. Imagine all the bike lanes forming a logically connected network. What is needed is mostly political will to make the tough decisions when they are the right decisions. Bike lanes will be unpopular until it becomes clear how well they work. The only way to do that is to build them, then the drivers will turn into cyclists and they will come! Do I sound like an evangelist today, sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capricorn Posted December 31, 2013 Share again, all that, including the massive amount of money spent upgrading maps, road signs, labour etc, is which demographic most likely to be using cycling as their daily commute? Your example of blouberg is as appropiate as it is convenient. The poorest of us live where in relation to that example? Cycle lanes? The correct decision is then for whom? Its not an easy question to answer.Hell, the BRT already has taken massive flack for providing the BRT routes to the poorer communities as the Last Phase of the whole IRT plan. Lets face it, cycling lanes make sense to those who can afford cycling to begin with, and those ppl do not live in areas needing mass transport the most. I fear much political influence for future cycling lanes. I'm waiting for someone to toss out that sourgrapes line about life aint fair and all that. But let's dispense with the obvious and get down to the nittygritty of implementation. As a public service, the benefication derived from more cycling lanes in terms of who benefits mostly is clear, it will not be cheap, and it will be politically tainted simply because it will be tax funded. Now that I think about it, what someone suggested in another thread about cycling to school is a very interesting option, as it brings an immediate groundswell of cycling to bear on existing commuter infrastructure. Quasi-dedicated cycling routes can be demarcated much the same way the green routes in the cape CBD. Quasi because it will be time based: from 6 till 9 and 2 till 4 is peak cycling hours to and from school for example. i dunno. just thinking aloud. flame away. Edited December 31, 2013 by Capricorn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GaryvdM Posted December 31, 2013 Share thing with infrastructure is the cost. and then who to spend it upon in terms of income demographics. In this country, it will be seen as pandering to the 'advantaged'.. u know that drama.. Why not start in the disadvantaged areas. Build bike lanes in new townships, and from townships to places of work. I think one place that would be excellent to do this would be from Tembisa to Spartan/Sebenza (Along Zuurfountain/Moderfountain). There are all ready a fair number of cycling commuters who use this route. Make it safer and more pleasant, and I'm sure their numbers will grow. Capricorn, DJR, Robodog and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johanpre44 Posted December 31, 2013 Share Think there is a lot of people who cannot afford cars and can afford bicycles (even though the cheap Makro specials). Imagine how much safer the roads will be if some of the mass transport (especially the kind that takes out cyclists - sorry for the biased opinion) is replaced with cyclists. I bet a couple of months worth of taxi fares can buy that Makro special. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter69 Posted December 31, 2013 Share This mindset in South Africa ?. Not at all likely. Even if our bike lanes are expanded it is more than likely that the cyclists will sooner or later have to pay toll charges. Then there will be the twerps in their motor cars that will think that the bicycle lanes have been specially built for their sole use. But we surely can dream can't we ?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJR Posted December 31, 2013 Share ..............................But we surely can dream can't we ?. Dreaming is essential to make normal life bearable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJR Posted December 31, 2013 Share Why not start in the disadvantaged areas. Build bike lanes in new townships, and from townships to places of work. .................................. Absolutely! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kranky Posted December 31, 2013 Share thing with infrastructure is the cost. and then who to spend it upon in terms of income demographics. In this country, it will be seen as pandering to the 'advantaged'.. u know that drama.. So much money is spent on roads for cars that few can afford (even some of the owners struggle to pay for them each month). Bicycles are far more accessible to the average South Africa and much cheaper to maintain. We just need to start catering for the average person with suitable bikes like what Qhubeka offers. Why not start in the disadvantaged areas. Build bike lanes in new townships, and from townships to places of work. Definitely this. Edited December 31, 2013 by Nick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capricorn Posted December 31, 2013 Share So much money is spent on roads for cars that few can afford (even some of the owners struggle to pay for them each month). Bicycles are far more accessible to the average South Africa and much cheaper to maintain. We just need to start catering for the average person with suitable bikes like what Qhubeka offers. Definitely this. Well, in my opinion, that is the case because of a combination of factors, namely lack of safe and pervasive public transport. The pervasive bit speaks to the ability to reach place of work within a reasonable time period. A car might be expensive to buy and maintain, but the traditional role of bringing the jobsite within reach of so many, not to mention the afterhours liberty afforded by personal transport, is hard to ignore, even by those within the lower income groups. Changing those mindsets of the existing workforce is going to be mighty hard indeed, if not impossible. They'd rather go with public transport than rock-along-by-bicycle. INtroducing it to a younger generation however, will provide momentum for future planning wrt supporting infrastructure. But old generation and new, their needs will serve both groups simultaneously: take the masses to work via mass transport, and tag onto that infrastructural development, the means to commute by bicycle. This is of course, the plan with the IRT project. But in the interim, a divorcing the cycling commute away from the bigger picture creates an opportunity to mobilize the student/learner body. that said, a thought crossed my mind: how many public spaces are there for one to safely lock-up ones ride when commuting by bicycle to say, cape town? Its nice to see bikes for hire in the sea point area, and it's even nice to see folks hiring those bikes. But's private opportunism, not dedicated planning on behalf of the city fathers ito promoting safe cycling within the city and surrounds. It's a very strange situation considering we have already advanced the IRT project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xdoomx Posted January 3, 2014 Share Excellent thread! Thought I'd add this video and article to it"There's been much talk about #commuting by bicycle but almost none about shopping by #bicycle"http://momentummag.c...g-can-take-off/ http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=442fvIFEgOo Dare to dream and imagine the ideals, work towards them, and they will happen. As usual SA gets everything 5 years later than the rest of the world, but it WILL get here eventually. Ok, maybe 10 years in this case Having commuted in NYC & Paris I totally get the vision and how things should be working. Durban is getting a lot of good groundwork done with their NMT (Non Motorised Transport) plan which includes over 40km of marked bicycle paths, some separated, some shared, but it's a good start (http://www.iol.co.za...urban-1.1572807) Edited January 3, 2014 by xdoomx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mongoose! Posted January 3, 2014 Share Will I be allowed to ride my road racer / Zipp wheels at 40+km/u on these lanes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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