Come on guys... Seriously, why the hard headed approach for "Dishwashing Liquid for everything"..? I get it that we're all annoyed with Marketing mumbo jumbo, especially suppliers selling the same thing with different names for different pricing. But Dishwashing Liquid is exactly that.! Dish Washing Liquid.! That's what they call it and that's the purpose for which they market and sell it. They don't advertise it as a general purpose cleaner, do they.? So why use it as such.? We've moved on as a civilisation and have specific products that are better for some things than other things. I also get the "I don't need to wash my bike" story but I don't really understand it.! Why have only an 80% clean bike.? I confess that when I do a relatively short (mid week) ride where my bike gets only a bit dusty and one or two splashes of mud, I will come home and just gently spray it off with a gentle hose whilst rubbing the frame, rims, etc gently with the soft inside of my riding gloves. But I will always give the drivetrain a either a wipe down or a clean - with the cost of chains and 12 speed cassette's these days, you don't want to cause dirt to reduce your product lifespan by 50%.! But this doesn't leave my pride and joy looking like it did when it was new.! Hence a proper wash after the weekend riding or at most every second week. Drive train gets wiped down with a diluted degreaser sprayed onto a cloth or when cleaned, sprayed directly onto the drivetrain. I use ECOLOGIC and have been doing so for a few years already. It's cheap as chips, non-toxic, non-corrosive, non-abrasive and works a charm on everything bike, car and in and around the house. Let's look at the numbers : ecoLogic is R230 for a very concentrated 5L bottle - I use a ratio of 1:100 for washing bikes, cars and floors in the house. So 30ml to 3L water in a bucket - so R 1.38 per wash cycle. I also premix into a spray bottle at a ratio of 1:6.5 (100ml to 650ml Water into a 750ml spray bottle), so R 4.60 and about 30-40ml of this to spray the drivetrain, so 25c per wash. With a total of R 1.63 to wash by bike and make it look like new. Is it really worth holding fast to dishwashing liquid.? I do agree that other 'pre diluted' bike wash brands on the shelf are absurdly priced where the cost per wash will be about R30 - R40. It works so well and is so cost effective and a registered disinfectant that ecoLogic has now replaced 90% of all other cleaning products in our home and we're saving a fortune.! Yes, we do still use dishwashing liquid for the dishes and Stasoft / Omo etc for the clothes but a tiny bit of ecoLogic also works wonders to clean soap-sud grime out the pipes of washing machines. I've spoken to the guys at Stealth Health (my wife) who are a distributors of, amongst other things, ecoLogic and asked her to arrange free samples but this is too costly if she has to also cover delivery. So she's agreed to offer 10% discount voucher to this group (& friends thereof) for all orders including 5L ecoLogic placed between now and the end of FEB. She will also throw into each order the following (with a value of R124 - FREE) : 2 x sachets of Herbal Iceman to massage your aching muscles after a workout (as used by Chiro's),2 x 15ml spray wands of Viromist+70 sanitiser that has 70% Alcohol, Chlorhexidene and Aloe Vera 2 x 15ml spray wands of Viropet (with Chlorhexidene and Aloe Vera) but only 10% alcohol - ideal for allergies and skin irritations for pets and humans - helps immensely with the current grass allergies when mountain biking and to spray on cuts and scratches after a ride as an antiseptic. Also available as Viromist (Standard) at same pricing. Visit www.stealthhealth.co.za and use coupon code BikehubFEB21 at checkout to get R50 voucher and the free goodies (you don't need to add these to your cart - they will be included with the delivery). Enjoy.!