X01 & X0 Crossmix possible?

[SCD]

Hi guys,

 

Since some time I am looking into the options for a 1x10 conversion and settled for going for the ONEUP 42t on my XT cassette. I would need to buy a new clutch deraillor as well.

 

I think I read most of the XX1 and 1x10 pages and one issue seems to be either accepted or left unresolved: the non-XX1 deraillors are not meant to work with the 42t sprockets. When adjusted to clear the 42t sprocket the offset of the jockey wheel to the other sprockets is quite large and not ideal, leading to a drop in shifting performance.

 

I know that the X01 or XX1 deraillors are supposingly not compatible to any 10spd system but: (if this has been answered elsewhere I missed it. Please forgive me I this case and throw in your experience/knowledge anyway).

 

1) is a 11spd cassette not the same total width as a 10spd cassette? With a smaller incremental spacing between the sprockets?

2) are the 10spd and 11spd shifters and grip shifters not very similar, just with a different increment on the shifting ratchet mechanism? But actuating the same length of cable over the full range?

3) if 1 and 2 is true then the X01 deraillor should work with a 10spd shifter on a 10spd cassette?

4) Since some of you are already riding 1x10 with various adaptations of 41t or 42t conversions how does the XT Shadow Plus deraillor perform?

 

Now I wouldn't trust any SRAM documentation on the answer to these questions. The only way to find out would be to try it out. Anybody out there tried this?

 

I know that there is the option to just stick to combinations like 34t/36t front with the 36t at the back and toughen up, but this topic should more focus on the technical issue than rider strength.

 

Cheers

S

[River Rat]

I'm keen to see how this works out. I'm thinking of going with the 42 and 28/40 upfront so here's a free bump.

[Carbon Junky]

Since your topic title is for the Sram groupo, I'll give you my thoughts to it and what I found in my research. Firstly, 10 and 11 speed rear derailers are NOT the same. Keep in mind that there is only a limited space for a cogset and if they kept the spacing the same as 10 speed, then there won't be enough space for another cog. Ok its a bit wider than a 10 speed cog in total if you put all the gears net to each other, but the spacing between gears are definitely smaller than 10 speed. Then secondly, I've only done research on Srams cranks and I don't know if Shimano even does the single blade crank yet. Srams crank was invented for both the 1x10 and 1x11 setups in mind. This being said, you will need to get the type 2 derailer. Some have mentioned in the topic that I started 'X01 front and X0 rear' that you need a shadow derailer on the rear of you want to go shimano on the back. I'm assuming that you meant you wanted to add the 42 tooth cog, this is for rear? This is where you have to go check what the derailer is capable of. Each derailer has a max cog tooth. On road we go up to a 32t for srams long cage. I'll check on srams mountain parts, but I don't know about shimanos. Best advice will be to stick to the manufacturer that already has this technologies available like sram before losing a lot of money

[SCD]

Hi Jaco

Since your topic title is for the Sram groupo, I'll give you my thoughts to it and what I found in my research. Firstly, 10 and 11 speed rear derailers are NOT the same. Keep in mind that there is only a limited space for a cogset and if they kept the spacing the same as 10 speed, then there won't be enough space for another cog. Ok its a bit wider than a 10 speed cog in total if you put all the gears net to each other, but the spacing between gears are definitely smaller than 10 speed. Then secondly, I've only done research on Srams cranks and I don't know if Shimano even does the single blade crank yet. Srams crank was invented for both the 1x10 and 1x11 setups in mind. This being said, you will need to get the type 2 derailer. Some have mentioned in the topic that I started 'X01 front and X0 rear' that you need a shadow derailer on the rear of you want to go shimano on the back. I'm assuming that you meant you wanted to add the 42 tooth cog, this is for rear? This is where you have to go check what the derailer is capable of. Each derailer has a max cog tooth. On road we go up to a 32t for srams long cage. I'll check on srams mountain parts, but I don't know about shimanos. Best advice will be to stick to the manufacturer that already has this technologies available like sram before losing a lot of money

 

Hi Jaco,

thanks for your thoughts. I know that the 11spd and 10spd SRAM deraillors are very different and I also know that SRAM and Shimano deraillors and shifters cannot be mixed.

 

Question (4) in this context adds some confusion. (4) is a standalone question asking about anybody's experience with a home-made 42t cassette (ie General Lee or One-up conversions) and the XT Shadow Plus deraillor. To the best of my knowledge no 10spd (no Shimano and no SRAM) deraillor is officially suitable for 42t but it is used as such anyway.

 

Back the main topic. Can I run the X01 deraillor with a 10x SRAM shifter on a 10x cassette?

The shifter is responsible for the positioning of the deraillor. This is done by a ratchet based mechanism pulling the cable and the deraillor responding with a defined movement. The indexing is dialled in to correspond to the sprocket spacing. So do the X0 and X01 deraillor have the same pull ratio? Discussions in other forums seem not to find a conclusion on this. SRAM uses "Equal Actuation" (EA) for X0 and "X-Actuation" for X01. They describe EA really well, especially the 1:1 pull ratio part. The information to XA is really thin, nothing is said to the pull ratios.

Bottom line: if X01 also uses a 1:1 pull ratio then it should work.

Anybody played with this yet?

[Carbon Junky]

Ok here it is. Its totally different from the exact actuation technology. I do know that the road versions 11 speed and 10 speed derailers are the same in shifting movement, but as far as mountain goes, its different. The 11 speeds have a whole new concept in design to ensure ghost shifting is elliminated. Best advice is to find someone that has the 11 speed setup and play around with the 10 speed derailer on the 11 speed cog and shifter. If it does work, you'll be a legend on the hub