Tandem(what make)

[tikki]

You should get a warrenty on those spokes, we ve have so many raleigh s with spokes rusting and breaking with out them guys even riding the bikes yet ! Low quality spokes!

[RaceChick]

You should get a warrenty on those spokes' date=' we ve have so many raleigh s with spokes rusting and breaking with out them guys even riding the bikes yet ! Low quality spokes![/quote']

 

 

 

 

 

Would it not be cheaper to replace spokes than to replace

 

forks and groupset.

[WorcesterWheelers]

Thanx' date=' will try the trust thing. It is just so difficult to let go.[/quote']

 

Don't worry.

 

The very 1st time I got on a tandem, I sat on the back, and as we took the 1st turn, I nearly bent the handlebars while trying to turn the bike.....

[limosine]

You should get a warrenty on those spokes' date=' we ve have so many raleigh s with spokes rusting and breaking with out them guys even riding the bikes yet ! Low quality spokes![/quote']

 

tikki---i ordered a cannondale---not a raleigh !!!!!

[decibach db]

Check it out and do PM me... let my know what Tandem you got.

 

 

Dankie decibach ek sal dit doen. Ek het vandag vir my 'n tandem bestel(cannondale).Hulle wag vir 'n besending van oorsee af. sal dit seker eers oor 'n maand kry. Ek sal jou verseker laat weet.

 

Groete

 

 

 

Great fiets.

 

 

 

Baie geluk....

 

 

 

Jy sal nooit spyt wees nie.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[decibach db]

You should get a warrenty on those spokes' date=' we ve have so many raleigh s with spokes rusting and breaking with out them guys even riding the bikes yet ! Low quality spokes![/quote']

 

 

tikki---i ordered a cannondale---not a raleigh !!!!!

 

 

 

Nou kan Tikki niks meer Tik nie.

 

 

 

Want jy kan nie 'n Raleigh Tandem met 'n Cannondale Tandem vergelyk nie.

[decibach db]

My question(Q-ring) is for dedibach---or anybody that wants to help

Vespa' date=' the last some one asked the thread ended up with about 30 pages of fighting but amongs others it is a slightly elipticle shaped gear that eliminates any dead spot

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Does it work - those who have one swear blind by it - those whose next bike does not have one are unhappy, those who dont have one should ..........get one

[/quote']

 

 

 

MDK is that carbon cranks?

 

 

[tikki]

Im Glad, you wont go wrong, i ve build more cannondale tandams over the last ten years than i can count,They are great i might even get one and the end of the year or keen on something custom---- for single track racing!

[limosine]

Nou kan Tikki niks meer Tik nie.

Want jy kan nie 'n Raleigh Tandem met 'n Cannondale Tandem vergelyk nie.

 

Ek het niks teen Raleigh nie. My fiets is per toeval 'n Raleihg RC 7000(carbon) en eks mal daaroor. Sal dit vir geen ander fiets verruil......ek dink net by tandems is die cannondale dalk(my opinie) 'n beter keuse.------maar die prys is ook meer ---so mens kan nie die 2 tandems werklik vergelyk nie

[mdk555]

MDK is that carbon cranks?

 and so is the fork

[tikki]

Yes,Decibach

 

After 12 years in the bike industry, im sure i know i bit more about bike trade than you think, but thanks for info already known! Enjoy your day!

[decibach db]

Yes' date='Decibach

 

 

After 12 years in the bike industry, im sure i know i bit more about bike trade than you think, but thanks for info already known! Enjoy your day!

[/quote']

 

 

 

 

 

Sorry. Meant it humorous. I Apologize for offending you.

[mdk555]

Yes' date='Decibach

After 12 years in the bike industry, im sure i know i bit more about bike trade than you think, but thanks for info already known! Enjoy your day!

[/quote']


Sorry. Meant it humorous. I Apologize for offending you.

and I bet that was a double apology

[decibach db]

Yes' date='Decibach

 

 

After 12 years in the bike industry, im sure i know i bit more about bike trade than you think, but thanks for info already known! Enjoy your day!

[/quote'] Sorry. Meant it humorous. I Apologize for offending you.

and I bet that was a double apology

 

 

 

having a stoker - one knows how to apologize.

[Johan Bornman]

 

 

Cut - cut - cut reams of vitriol - cut - cut...

 

Again I take your "knowledge" rather circumspectly.

Most of the force is down the line of the wheel' date=' I agree, but there must be some
lateral force (a bike leaning down is still subject to gravity). Also "stiffness" is
a concern when standing and "throwing" the bike from side-to-side - again a lateral
force is involved.

If the lateral movement of the wheel is of no importance, then why is the ONLY experiment you quote ad nauseum looking at lateral movement! Unfortunately the
author does not state the amount of lateral deflection measured, only that the
difference between ties and untied is negligible.

 

[/quote']

 

I think if you read my quote it said that there is no lateral force exerted on a bicycle wheel when cornering. Bringing "throwing" in at this late stage does not negate your original statement.

 

When a bike is cornering, it is in a gravity-free state where the centripital force is balanced by gravitational pull. The force is therefore purely in the radial plane of the wheel. Draw a force diagram and convince yourself.

 

Yes, there is a bit of lateral force excerted on a bike, not when "throwing" though (in that situation the bike zig-zags and in effect steers left and right, with perfect radial forces excerted) but when deliberately leaning the bike to one side. It is a useful method for checking for wound-up spokes after a new build. Throwing the bike around in a flailing sprint doesn't produce the same untwisting of spokes that a definite lean does, which means the lateral forces are small.

 

So instead of (once again) accusing me of being absolutely ignorant when I'm
trying to figure out what's going on and ignoring your biases (which is what I
think is really upsetting you' date=' here), why don't you go figure out how a wheel _really_
works. Touche.

Then come back to me...
[/quote']

 

Perhaps you have something to share? How does it REALLY work? Tell us please.

 

I'm not prepared to accept your opinion just because your face has appeared on telly.
The broken spoke experiment is (as I stated) reasonably simple. You offered to help' date='
or are you backing out?

[/quote']

 

No need to accept my opinion for any reason, let's not get personal and debate the facts. Tell me again what you want to achieve with your experiment, what your hypothesis is and how you expect to go about it. I'll gladly help.

And if that is not "empirical" enough' date=' why not find a very, very well-used wheel and see if you can find any evidence of spokes moving in relation to each other, by examining the crossing for evidence of fretting.

I'm off to the patent office to go and register a rivet that binds Ksyrium (flat) spokes. Next season it will be all the rage. I already have the marketing value proposition....SpokeRiv: Stiffer, lighter*, stronger.  

* lighter than tying and soldering. 

[/quote']

 

Again you reduce your argument to ridiculing any viewpoint contrary to yours - short
on facts again!

 

It was a bit of humour. I think flat spokes have lots of scope for rivets...should stabilising them at the cross make any sense' date=' of course. But do yourself a favour and look for that old wheel and examine the crosses. Tell us what you see.

 

So we are reduced to opinions (i.e. guesses).

My guesses are:
- cornering (or standing): since the forces are sideways, they will be fairly evenly
  distributed amongst the spokes, so my guess is that no effect will be seen - even
  with a tandem;

You'll find that the spoke tension on a wheel loaded as you describe doesn't change like you describe. The wheel deforms in a saddle shape (The Americans call it a prezel) with left and right tensions markedly different (top left will equal bottom right and vice versa) in the up and down planes whilst the fore-aft plane spokes remain at their resting tension. A huge effect is seen, even without a tandem.

 

- broken spoke: since metal provides both tensile and compressive strength' date='
  my guess is that a soldered broken spoke will be provided with some support
  and would reduce the amount of distortion at the rim. I have no clue to the amount
  of reduction.

[/quote']

You'll find that spokes provide no compressive support in a tensioned, wire-spoked wheel as used on bicycles. They may as well be made from Kevlar strings (as in a Spinergy). A loaded wheel sees reduced tension at the load affected zone directly above the road surface. The other spokes remain in constant or resting tension until their turn at the bottom comes, when their tension is reduced. The reduction of tension is a function of rim (beam) strength and the number of spokes and equals the weight on that wheel. 

 

Further, a tied spoke won't reduce distortion when a spoke breaks. Draw a force diagram and get your mind around it. Alternatively, lets cut that spoke and measure distortion. It's quite easy in a wheel jig.

 

It will also hold the spoke in position so it doesn't knock around. We can debate
whether this is a good thing or not.

 

Broken  spokes simply don't knock around' date=' no matter how often you say so. In a radially-spoked lwheel it may touch here and there and alert you to something amiss, but there's no drama. But I guess you have to ride enough to break spokes to experience that.

 

I have not even thought about the effect or rotational inertia which is coupled from
the rim to the hub via the spokes. This might under turning have some sort of twisting
effect - especially on a tandem with 28C tyres and a heavier rim, since it has to
translate the change in momentum to moving a 150-200kg mass.

 

Perhaps you want to rephrase those two sentences, I can't figure out what you're trying to say.

 

Can you discuss this rationally or are you just going to throw your toys out the cot
again?

You be the judge of that.

[Guest Big H]

Now that you have removed some spokes will the wheel not be out of balance?????