Pathetic bridge needs removal at Tokai

[Guest Agteros]

 

riding is meant 2 be fun' date=' for everyone, whether they are novices or professionals.

i think the bridge is good, its adds variety 2 the trail, even though it does get in the way! if your a begginer ride the bridge, if you want a challenge go ride the 2 trails above DH 1...

this is a 21 page argument about a few planks. just get out and ride, after all we mtbers and we awsome!

[/quote']

 

Nopes not awesome, MTB riders have w-a-a-y more hang-ups than roadies. Roadies just go out and ridee... trucks? taxis? carbon frames? old bikes? cold weather?lycra? normal shorts? t-shirts? Legs shaved or not? none of that matters! They just go out and ride!!!

 

But MTB'ers? sheesh they act like a bunch of 6 year olds with all their stupid little pedantic rules to fit in....

 

You may not shave you legs else you are not a MTBer

MTBers do not wear Lycra - baggies all the way

Riding surface? We are upset of a few planks near the start, coz we are lazy and do not want to cycle to the top...

Roadie races start earlier than MTBers who can only get going at 08:00 if the you are lucky!

 

Awesome? I do not think so! Real awesomeness is reserved for those who shut up, go out and ride their bikes!

 

Just don't tie your baggies in a knot, coz you gonna sukkel to cycle!

 

[nicsname]

Incase you havn't noticed this is about a bridge in the forest...not some tar hump somewhere that you ride so your wrists dont get sore.

i will tell you why MTB is awsome! it's awsome because its not a competition, there are no taxis, or buses or cyclists who give everyone a bad name. Sharing the forest with baboons, cobras and eagles, all while looking at an awsome view is why we ride. Testing yourself on single track amongst the trees, with ur mates,  with just the sound of your bike to contend with is awsome.

 

criticism only ever comes from the outside.

you need to keep quite and ride

[MintSauce]

I'm almost afraid to restart this thread, but I reckon I should add this.

 

 

 

I had a cup of coffee and a bit of a catchup with Meurant this morning.

 

 

 

I raised my concerns regarding parts of the trail being dumbed down and

he adressed every specific area that I mentioned getting down to

specifics as to why it was done.

 

 

 

What it basically boils down to is that in most cases the work being

done was to prevent errosion and keep the trails looking neat. Those weren't his exact words, but my interpretation. As

he pointed out, when the environmental managers walk up the trail and

see a tech section with 4 different lines through it, it looks a mess.

For this reason, some areas were neatened up. I can understand this

becoming a problem specifically on the DH and technical trails seeing

as these obstacles naturally will develop several lines.

 

 

 

Do I like it...? No....not really.....I love the technical lines. But

at the same time, the powers that be need to be satisfied that the

trails are kept in good condition and errosion prevented because if

they're not happy, we'll lose our trails all together.

 

 

 

So, for the privilege of riding at Tokai forest, I for one am prepared

to forsake some nice sections in order to keep the forest open in the

long run.

 

 

 

W.R.T. the bridge in question, he pointed out as some others have, that

the trail was originally constructed as a green route to allow easy

access to singletrck for beginner riders at the bottom of the mountain. As such all parts of the route HAVE

to fit within the green rating. I reckon if the landowners wanted a harder

route, they would've never built it there to begin with.

 

Also, to be honest, there are many sections at Tokai that give me far more pleasure to ride than that single river crossing. So again, is it really that big a deal to sacrifice it for the sake of the greater good? I think not.

 

As for certain comments made about our rights to the forest because we pay to ride there, he raised some very thought-provoking ideas(for me anyway).

 

Here are my thoughts on this....not Meurant's

 

We're paying R20 per ride(or annual Wildcard fees) to ride there. These fees go to an  organisation that doesn't make a profit. Noone is putting this money into their pockets.

 

Of all the parks in SA there are in fact very, very few that actually make money. Most of them from a business point of view, run at a loss. In other words, the government is subsidising our recreational activities.

 

Perhaps we need to rethink how we see our usage of these areas. In a first world country things might be different, but in a country where there are far more pressing needs, do we really have the right to insist on our rights to these areas...? I'm not saying it's not our right, because as citizens the natural spoils of this country are ours to be enjoyed.

 

But perhaps it would be better to view it as a privilege and be a bit more thankful that we can still use them at all...?

 

 

 

 

[Iwan Kemp]

Thanks for sharing Minty. Have been to Tokai a couple of times since this topic got going, and boy oh boy it's an awesome place to ride. I've made peace with the bridge given the info people shared WRT erosion and how it was 20 years ago and all the rest.

I really do wish people will take better care of single track. Dragging wheels, not sticking to the trail, dumping stuff all over the show.

 

My last ride there was Sunday in the rain. I stopped a couple of times just to take in the beauty of the area.

[Bullbar]

Been riding Tokai for many years! Was a bit dissapointed by the bidge, but WTF i dont really care! I know why its there! I am more interested in some points made earlier about not knowing what work is beind done where, and what are the future trails plans etc. And i am a member of some club called Amarider (not sure why though) since i pay my bucks for the Wild Card!

 

Still cudo's to the trailbuilders! Its not easy work with limited budget! So all those crap talkers should volunteer a few weekends and earn the right to bitch and moan!

 

In any case i want to see the Viagra slicking, big talking bozo's ride that bridge after it has developed the green slime of death covering that will inevitably appear very soon! It will be the tiny riders that screem murder for the bridge to go after experiencing the unique phenomenon of moering off a slippery bridge! And in this case they will have an extre half meter to go before blikseming into the gentle stream below!

 

But, my take is that after the first few rains, the debris will build up under the bridge, the pressure will be too much for the Troll and it will dissapear on its own accord in any way!

 

 

 

[Iwan Kemp]

Hi Mintsauce, how about asking Meurant to communicate a bit more. We hardly ever hear from AMA or him. Have emailed him a couple of times asking when trail building will be done as I'd love to join, but never hear back from him.

[MintSauce]

 

Hi Mintsauce' date=' how about asking Meurant to communicate a bit more. We hardly ever hear from AMA or him. Have emailed him a couple of times asking when trail building will be done as I'd love to join, but never hear back from him.[/quote']

 

 

I'll definitely ask him when I see him again.

 

W.r.t. Tokai specifically I gather from Meurant that Cobus is the guy most in the know.

 

He left his email address earlier in the thread. Let's drop him a mail and ask him to keep us in the loop about trail maintenance days.

 

I've tried to join the Warthogs list this morning as Lefty mentioned that it gets posted there, but I'm not having much luck in that department for some reason?

 

 

 

[Tumbleweed]

But perhaps it would be better to view it as a privilege and be a bit more thankful that we can still use them at all...?

[MintSauce]

 

I really do wish people will take better care of single track. Dragging wheels' date=' not sticking to the trail, dumping stuff all over the show.

[/quote']

 

This in particular is a pet hate of mine! I remember an incident in JHK where I stopped just before a switchback to let a rider coming from the opposite direction through.

 

About 5 meters before the switchback he rode off the trail and cut an entire section of trail out! WTF...?! What's the point...? Saving 2 seconds...? Why cut a beautiful, flowing corner to ride where there is no trail...?

 

Some people are just too thick!

 

Fruita in the US is regarded as one of the singletrack meccas of the world. Here's what their local trail builder has to say:

 

Advocacy

How to: Keep Singletrack Single... Fruita Ethics!

 

Fruita Singletrack Ethics    -     for singletrack lovers everywhere...

I've tried to say this a million ways and have decided to just offer

up a few positive tips to those who want to join or lead the art of

using a mountain bike to actually make trails better, instead of

contributing to the MTB nemisis of the ever widening trail. Here's some

thoughts for those of us who want to preserve the narrow and flowing

trails we ride and love. Thanks for reading and Thank You even more for

spreading the love of singletrack.

• Learn the Singletrack Yield; the rule of

  ?Yield to everyone? isnt right! Too often riders who meet just ride OFF

  TRAIL around each other. That is NOT a Yield at all; that's ?Im too

  much in a hurry to be slowed by you?. The rule is most always; allow

  the uphill rider to pass. (or best of all use directional trail travel

  when possible) How? STOP your bike - still in the

  trail... step a foot out of the trail off to the side (without crushing

  that plant or cactus) and LEAN your bike and/or slide it a bit to the

  side. The rider you are YEILDING TOO then can pass without leaving the track.

  AWESOME!      If we pass each other; thats 2 bikes wide and thus is NOT

  SINGLETRACK after we do. (Trails wide enough for this are called

  "double track" or ?roads?) Keep Singletrack Single is our rule... Thanks for being a part of that passion for narrow beautiful trails.

• NO Shortcuts!

  - we all know that we dont cut switchbacks (I think we do) but we also

  need to spread the word that just because we ?see a trail over there?

  doesnt mean we need to ?ride over there right now?. Trails all have a

  start/entrance and and end/exit; they may have several but they do not

  need an entrance and exit every few yards. Please don't ?cut over? to

  the trail from your camp site or from that road you parked on or from

  anywhere except the Trailhead. I can promise you; if you ride up the

  road you will find the entrance; then you can roll DOWN the sweet

  singletrack and help it continue a long life as "sweet singletrack" as

  well as preserve the experience of those who are on track.

• Cheaters never prosper / No new TrAXES! -

  we all run across things we can't or don't feel like riding. If we

  didn't; then we would be the single greatest rider in the sport. Never

  ?lower? the trail to your skill level by altering the line or stacking

  rocks or cutting down trees or plants or making a "ride around"

  (sometimes "designed ride arounds exist and thats fine). Someone can

  ride it; I know it seems like too much but it's not. Ask your friend to

  spot you and give it a try maybe, or just walk it,

  NEVER re-design a trail that you didn't help design and build in the

  first place. If you really think it needs fixing? Stop in the local

  trail advocate shop and mention it. That will be appreciated; kicking

  out "off trail tracks" will be appreciated by all and prevent

  others thinking it's OK to do the same. Creating a new ?by pass? or

  ?ramp? on someones favorite rock move will be despised and be re-built

  back to normal and thus wastes everyones time. Cutting down or back a

  tree is just vandelism of nature; NEVER kill plants for your own

  convenience, our day on the trail certainly doesnt out weigh the value

  of a 400 year old juniper? The beauty of a mountain bike is we can

  travel through pristine places and leave no impact or damage at all

  behind. Just a sweet ribbon of Ten inch singletrack flowing off into

  the distance.   "Learn to ride Ten Inches wide"        Thank You and feel free to spread the word.

• When in doubt... RESPECT

  it... all of it. We love here and you came here because it's awesome. I

  travel becasue I want to see more awesome places. To be the one who

  comes to ?awesome? and leaves it ?less awesome? says something about me

  that I would never want to hear said.    Leave it as good or better

  than you found it...

These are the Trails and the Places we Love! I'm glad you love them as I do. Thanks for the help - Keep Singletrack Single - Love Life - Share the Love - Enjoy the ride

from http://www.otefruita.com/advocacy/

 

 

 

 

[Velouria]

Thanks Minty...

[Mellow]

Yes, cool post. How do we educate all about this ?? Maybe PPA and CSA can add this to their next email..

[GoLefty!!]

Thanks Minty for posting the jist of your chats with Meurant about this issue. Cobus is most in the know the ST development in Tokai.

 

Together with Bennet and the team he is co-ordinating the effort to keep things on track, excuse the pun.

 

If you can't get hold of him PM me and I'll take it up with him.

I have raised the lack of communication issue with him several times and he is working on personality issues to address this 

 

Change takes time,.......... unless you go to Nando's, where you can get more change

 

 

 

 

 

[GoLefty!!]

Yes' date=' cool post. How do we educate all about this ?? Maybe PPA and CSA can add this to their next email.. [/quote']

 

 

change starts at Nando's orwithin yourself.

First you must make a contract with yourself that the behaviours asked above are good for you and all. f you don;t buy into then your chums won't

Once you start to behave in the appropriate way, others will follow.

Youcan take those misbehaving miscriants aside and give them a talking to but show them the way it shouldbe.

 

Yesterday I was up in Tokai and ridng up some singletrack. Some riders simply rideas fast as they can on the Descents without regards for others. these selfish people will onlychange if they see they are the odd ones out and that their behaviour is not acceptable.

[Iwan Kemp]

Advocacy

How to: Keep Singletrack Single... Fruita Ethics!

 

Fruita Singletrack Ethics    -     for singletrack lovers everywhere...

I've tried to say this a million ways and have decided to just offer up a few positive tips to those who want to join or lead the art of using a mountain bike to actually make trails better' date=' instead of contributing to the MTB nemisis of the ever widening trail. Here's some thoughts for those of us who want to preserve the narrow and flowing trails we ride and love. Thanks for reading and Thank You even more for spreading the love of singletrack.

Learn the Singletrack Yield; the rule of ?Yield to everyone? isnt right! Too often riders who meet just ride OFF TRAIL around each other. That is NOT a Yield at all; that's ?Im too much in a hurry to be slowed by you?. The rule is most always; allow the uphill rider to pass. (or best of all use directional trail travel when possible) How? STOP your bike - still in the trail... step a foot out of the trail off to the side (without crushing that plant or cactus) and LEAN your bike and/or slide it a bit to the side. The rider you are YEILDING TOO then can pass without leaving the track. AWESOME!      If we pass each other; thats 2 bikes wide and thus is NOT SINGLETRACK after we do. (Trails wide enough for this are called "double track" or ?roads?) Keep Singletrack Single is our rule... Thanks for being a part of that passion for narrow beautiful trails.

NO Shortcuts! - we all know that we dont cut switchbacks (I think we do) but we also need to spread the word that just because we ?see a trail over there? doesnt mean we need to ?ride over there right now?. Trails all have a start/entrance and and end/exit; they may have several but they do not need an entrance and exit every few yards. Please don't ?cut over? to the trail from your camp site or from that road you parked on or from anywhere except the Trailhead. I can promise you; if you ride up the road you will find the entrance; then you can roll DOWN the sweet singletrack and help it continue a long life as "sweet singletrack" as well as preserve the experience of those who are on track.

Cheaters never prosper / No new TrAXES! - we all run across things we can't or don't feel like riding. If we didn't; then we would be the single greatest rider in the sport. Never ?lower? the trail to your skill level by altering the line or stacking rocks or cutting down trees or plants or making a "ride around" (sometimes "designed ride arounds exist and thats fine). Someone can ride it; I know it seems like too much but it's not. Ask your friend to spot you and give it a try maybe, or just walk it, NEVER re-design a trail that you didn't help design and build in the first place. If you really think it needs fixing? Stop in the local trail advocate shop and mention it. That will be appreciated; kicking out "off trail tracks" will be appreciated by all and prevent others thinking it's OK to do the same. Creating a new ?by pass? or ?ramp? on someones favorite rock move will be despised and be re-built back to normal and thus wastes everyones time. Cutting down or back a tree is just vandelism of nature; NEVER kill plants for your own convenience, our day on the trail certainly doesnt out weigh the value of a 400 year old juniper? The beauty of a mountain bike is we can travel through pristine places and leave no impact or damage at all behind. Just a sweet ribbon of Ten inch singletrack flowing off into the distance.   "Learn to ride Ten Inches wide"        Thank You and feel free to spread the word.

When in doubt... RESPECT it... all of it. We love here and you came here because it's awesome. I travel becasue I want to see more awesome places. To be the one who comes to ?awesome? and leaves it ?less awesome? says something about me that I would never want to hear said.    Leave it as good or better than you found it...

These are the Trails and the Places we Love! I'm glad you love them as I do. Thanks for the help - Keep Singletrack Single - Love Life - Share the Love - Enjoy the ride

from http://www.otefruita.com/advocacy/

[/quote']

HR: Please publish stuff like this in your mag. People need to know and learn.

[GoLefty!!]

Great Idea Crow,

 

but I think it's not justing palcing it in the Magazine, Every bicycle should have it screen printed to the top of the bike like that silly disclaimer on the down tube.

Provide a booklet with the bike around responsible trail usage. Some people do actually read these things