Armstrong's Ex-mech Comments After Giving Evidence to Novitzky

[Lucky Luke.]

One of the most objective articles I've read on the matter.

 

http://www.health24....-4596,60723.asp

 

Good article, nice summary.

[Harry Potter]

Excellent article. now the question, how clean are our top cyclists in SA?

[gtr1]

Is it about USPS or Armstrong?????

 

It's about the bike...

[liebenw]

so much has been said on this subject, however this morning I read this interesting article. I think the Armstrong issue is seen through a different lens than most of the discussions on this sit so far.

 

My link

Edited January 24, 2011 by liebenw

[Tumbleweed]

It's about the bike(s)...

 

…that were sold to fund the alleged doping programme.

[scotty]

I can find zero proof of this, merely allegations

 

In 1999, Armstrong tested positive for a corticosteroid, also banned unless the cyclist has medical permission to use it. This medical certificate was quickly created and back-dated, allowing Armstrong to escape sanction.

 

He said, you said

 

Former team-mate and 2006 Tour de France winner Floyd Landis made explosive accusations

 

Allegations that Armstrong was paying the UCI, the sport’s governing body, through donations allegedly used to fight doping. This has led to speculation of bribes and cover-ups of positive test results and more lenient treatment by doping controls. Certainly, there can be no doubt that cycling is complicit in many of its doping problems.

 

A former mechanic Mike Andersen has testified to discovering steroid hormones in Armstrong’s bathroom, and being asked to cover for Armstrong by destroying traces of doping products and lying to testers about Armstrong’s whereabouts.

 

Not quite, he was cleared as the testing methods were not done in accordance to the labs own procedures. Cleared by UCI.

 

Paris laboratory reported that research testing of samples from the 1999 Tour de France revealed that Armstrong had been using EPO when he won his first Tour. The test for EPO was only created in 2000

 

Allegations Yes, Evidence, not quite yet

 

What has emerged cannot be dismissed. There is a growing mountain of evidence and allegations, some no doubt fuelled by ulterior motives, but all requiring a look.

[fandacious]

I can find zero proof of this, merely allegations

 

In 1999, Armstrong tested positive for a corticosteroid, also banned unless the cyclist has medical permission to use it. This medical certificate was quickly created and back-dated, allowing Armstrong to escape sanction.

 

He said, you said

 

Former team-mate and 2006 Tour de France winner Floyd Landis made explosive accusations

 

Allegations that Armstrong was paying the UCI, the sport’s governing body, through donations allegedly used to fight doping. This has led to speculation of bribes and cover-ups of positive test results and more lenient treatment by doping controls. Certainly, there can be no doubt that cycling is complicit in many of its doping problems.

 

A former mechanic Mike Andersen has testified to discovering steroid hormones in Armstrong’s bathroom, and being asked to cover for Armstrong by destroying traces of doping products and lying to testers about Armstrong’s whereabouts.

 

Not quite, he was cleared as the testing methods were not done in accordance to the labs own procedures. Cleared by UCI.

 

Paris laboratory reported that research testing of samples from the 1999 Tour de France revealed that Armstrong had been using EPO when he won his first Tour. The test for EPO was only created in 2000

 

Allegations Yes, Evidence, not quite yet

 

What has emerged cannot be dismissed. There is a growing mountain of evidence and allegations, some no doubt fuelled by ulterior motives, but all requiring a look.

 

Scotty, as much as you love the man, at some point you have to realize there must be some truth behind all these accusations.

 

fact : It is known that his TUE was backdated

 

 

What would his mechanic possibly have to gain by ratting LA out?

 

But your desperate scrabbling at excuses is certainly entertaining, so by all means - carry on

[scotty]

Scotty, as much as you love the man, at some point you have to realize there must be some truth behind all these accusations.

 

fact : It is known that his TUE was backdated

 

 

What would his mechanic possibly have to gain by ratting LA out?

 

But your desperate scrabbling at excuses is certainly entertaining, so by all means - carry on

 

Ta Fandacius,

 

 

Do you have the link where it was determined as fact that only after his results were queried was a prescription written.

 

I cant comment on what motivation the mechanic had, but to ponder.

 

Why would Lance leave evidence around so that it can easily found. As an alledged doper he has always been extremely careful How did Lance know that the mechanic would not take it and inform the correct officials, he could have made a fortune on it.

 

In todays spy vs spy era, how is it that there are no taped recordings with Armstrong, fingerprints on vials, video footage etc to implicate him directly in doping.

[fandacious]

Ta Fandacius,

 

 

Do you have the link where it was determined as fact that only after his results were queried was a prescription written.

 

A google result turns up plenty entries: http://www.health24....-4596,60723.asp

 

"In 1999, Armstrong tested positive for a corticosteroid, also banned unless the cyclist has medical permission to use it. This medical certificate was quickly created and back-dated, allowing Armstrong to escape sanction."

Let me ask you this - Do you think he won 7 tours clean? There is no doubt in your mind that he won 7 tours without any drugs?

Edited January 24, 2011 by fandacious

[scotty]

A google result turns up plenty entries: http://www.health24....-4596,60723.asp

 

"In 1999, Armstrong tested positive for a corticosteroid, also banned unless the cyclist has medical permission to use it. This medical certificate was quickly created and back-dated, allowing Armstrong to escape sanction."

Let me ask you this - Do you think he won 7 tours clean? There is no doubt in your mind that he won 7 tours without any drugs?

 

Nope still nothing, even Wikipedia under "Allegations of Doping" have nothing stating any foul play regards backdating.

 

Whether i think he was clean or not is not the issue. I am looking for evidence he is dirty and as such should be shamed and outed.

Edited January 24, 2011 by scotty

[fandacious]

Nope still nothing, even Wikepedia under "Allegations of Doping" have nothing stating any foul play regards backdating.

 

Whether i think he was clean or not is not the issue. I am looking for evidence he is dirty and as such should be shamed and outed.

 

There's plenty of evidence - you're just choosing to ignore it

[scotty]

Ah that explains it

[fandacious]

Ah that explains it

 

I'd still be interested to know your personal view though - do you think he's clean or not, considering how we have become aware over the last few years of how rife doping is amongst pros?

[DaLoCo]

There's plenty of evidence - you're just choosing to ignore it

 

If there was hard evidence this would have been wrapped up already. I suspect thye are now trying to find the fraud in the system, which will definitely benefit the sport.

 

I also think this Nowitski dude is on a political tangent here. If he can land Armstrong it will open a few doors for him.

 

If Armstrong is found guilty, he needs a kick in the nut, if not, then we will be back to speculation.

[fandacious]

If there was hard evidence this would have been wrapped up already. I suspect thye are now trying to find the fraud in the system, which will definitely benefit the sport.

 

I also think this Nowitski dude is on a political tangent here. If he can land Armstrong it will open a few doors for him.

 

If Armstrong is found guilty, he needs a kick in the nut, if not, then we will be back to speculation.

 

possibly...

 

that said - do you think JZ was guilty of corruption and fraud? even though there was no "evidence" ?

 

Its easy to make these things appear "grey". In fact, its what LA does best. However, it is possible to make them simple. This is what Novitsky is good at...

[Lucky Luke.]

Here's a couple of summaries to mull over, just conjecture of course, probably not a word of truth in any of it

 

Six of Armstrong's urine samples from the 1999 Tour were retrospectively tested and found to contain artificial EPO.

 

Four people have said that in the 1996 he admitted to using a wide range of doping products.

 

His personal assistent, Mike Anderson, found steroids in Armstrong's bathroom and helped Armstrong avoid OCC tests.

 

A team Postal soigneur, Emma O'Reilly, picked up doping products for Armstrong. She also helped him hide injection marks with make up.

 

Another Postal soigneur listened to Bruyneel brief the team about their hematocrits right before the 1999 Tour. All the riders were just under the 50% rule.

 

As related by Stephen Swart, in 1995 Motorola's riders made an agreement that everyone on the Tour squad would use EPO. Armstrong was the one that was pushing everyone to do it.

 

The IM messaging between Andreu and Vaughters show that Armstrong was pushing everyone on Postal to dope. He would tell the riders that everyone does it.

 

In a phone conversation with Greg Lemond, Armstrong said that using EPO was no big deal and everyone does EPO.

 

After denying to the press that he had a therapeutic use exemption (TUE) to use any drug in the 1999 Tour, Armstrong tested positive for a corticosteroid. The team, as related by Emma O'Reilly, created a backdated TUE that was accepted by the UCI. Sylvia Shenk, when she was running for president of the UCI, revealed that later in 1999, Armstrong made an under the table payment to the UCI of five hundred thousand dollars.

 

 

This is just the stuff around the 1999 EPO positives:

 

1) The samples were tested anonymously. The lab had no knowledge of who each sample belonged to. I will defer to Ashenden on the validity of the testing procedure.

 

2) The identity of the samples' owners was only known by the UCI. The lab had no access to the doping forms then and they still do not.

 

3) Armstrong's samples were identified a long time after the testing was completed by a journalist who obtained Armstrong's doping forms from the UCI with Armstrong's permission.

 

4) Six of the positive samples turned out to be Armstrong's.

 

5) The pattern of the tested samples matches what would be expected as a rider injects EPO and the over the course of a few days it becomes harder to detect.

 

6) Armstrong was recently offered the chance to have the samples retested, including a DNA test to show that they were really his. He refused.

 

7) Postal's soigneur Emma O'Reilly was asked by Armstrong to dispose of syringes and other doping paraphernalia before the 1999 TdF. She also delivered drugs to Armstrong.

 

8) O'Reilly helped Armstrong cover up injection marks with make-up.

 

9) Another Postal soigneur, Ron Jongen, listened to Johan Bruyneel talking on the eve of the 1999 TdF about how all the riders' hematocrits were just under the 50% limit.

 

9) The chance of a person in the general population being at or near a 50% hematocrit is roughly 2%. Trained endurance athletes have an even smaller chance of being at 50%. Take 2/100 and raise it to the ninth power. The chance of nine riders having Hcts near 50% is close to the chance of winning the lottery.

 

10) On team Motorola, Armstrong encouraged his teammates to use EPO. He entered into an agreement with the other riders that all riders on the 1995 TdF squad would use EPO.

 

11) Armstrong encouraged members of Postal, like Andreu and Vaughters, to dope. He told his teammates that it was normal and everyone else was doing it.

 

12) When Armstrong joined Postal, he brought on board Johan Bruyneel, a man who was nicknamed the Hog because of the vast quantities of drugs he consumed while on team ONCE.

 

13) Team ONCE had a teamwide doping program since before 1998.

 

14) Dr. Prentice Steffan, who had refused to help Tyler Hamilton and Marty Jemisen dope, was removed from Team Postal.

 

15) Bruyneel brought doctors from Team Once to replace Steffan.

 

16) Armstrong had a long term relationship with Dr. Ferrari, an expert in the use of EPO.

 

17) Armstrong kept his relationship secret. It was only discovered when an Italian police investigation of Ferrari revealed that Armstrong was periodically travelling to Italy to see Dr. Ferrari.

 

18) When the rider Simeoni testified that Dr. Ferrari had helped him dope, Armstrong maintained the peloton's policy of omerta by punishing Simeoni during a race.

 

19) After he prevented Simeoni from being included in a break, Armstrong was seen to make a "zip the lips" gesture to other riders. Armstrong's teammates spit on Simeoni as he rolled past.

 

20) In a phone call to Greg Lemond about the revelations that he had been seeing Dr. Ferrari, Armstrong said that using EPO was no big deal and everyone did it.

 

21) In the 1999 TdF, Armstrong told Christophe Bassons, who was revealed to be the one clean athlete on Team Festina and had been speaking out about doping, to stop talking about doping. He encouraged Bassons to leave the sport.

 

22) As a way to explain his sudden rise, Armstrong constructed and maintained a lie that he had lost large amounts of weight. This was shown to be untrue during the SCA case.

 

http://www.cyclingforums.com/forum/thread/380533/is-it-true-lance-armstrong-was-cheating/15