Jaco-fiets Posted January 8, 2013 Share can u give examples of these. Examples of whey brands i would buy is Nutritech and SSN. With glutamine you go for the cheapest. You can buy glutamine from warrenchem specialities at 50% less than any supplement store. Dextrose is difficult. You will have to ask around. The smallest volume you can buy from warrenchem is 25kg. It is dirt cheap though per kg. If you want examples for ratios i would say immediatly after race take 25g whey (which should contain at least 20g protein from a proper brand) with 60g dextrose and 5g glutamine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted January 9, 2013 Share Examples of whey brands i would buy is Nutritech and SSN. With glutamine you go for the cheapest. You can buy glutamine from warrenchem specialities at 50% less than any supplement store. Dextrose is difficult. You will have to ask around. The smallest volume you can buy from warrenchem is 25kg. It is dirt cheap though per kg. If you want examples for ratios i would say immediatly after race take 25g whey (which should contain at least 20g protein from a proper brand) with 60g dextrose and 5g glutamine Jaco, I would be careful of what your blood sugar is going to do after ingesting 60 grams of dextrose in 1 go ...That is a lot and could lead to a nasty spike , which is not healthy . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaco-fiets Posted January 9, 2013 Share Jaco, I would be careful of what your blood sugar is going to do after ingesting 60 grams of dextrose in 1 go ...That is a lot and could lead to a nasty spike , which is not healthy . Does seem high. Researched have shown that the best ratio for carbs to protein for recovery is 4:1. If you feel that 60grams of carbs is too much then adjust it to 40 or 50 and change protein accordingly. Allot of bodybuilders use around 60g dextrose in their post workout shakes to replenish muscle glycogen. The insulin spike does help to shuttle nutrients into the muscle cells Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted January 9, 2013 Share Does seem high. Researched have shown that the best ratio for carbs to protein for recovery is 4:1. If you feel that 60grams of carbs is too much then adjust it to 40 or 50 and change protein accordingly. Allot of bodybuilders use around 60g dextrose in their post workout shakes to replenish muscle glycogen. The insulin spike does help to shuttle nutrients into the muscle cells I would not agree with your last sentence. Care to give scientific evidence references for that ? IMO high Blood Glucose (BG) spikes are to be avoided. It has been proven that cells, especially pancreas Beta-cells get killed by high BG spikes . Not good . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaco-fiets Posted January 9, 2013 Share I would not agree with your last sentence. Care to give scientific evidence references for that ? IMO high Blood Glucose (BG) spikes are to be avoided. It has been proven that cells, especially pancreas Beta-cells get killed by high BG spikes . Not good . I do not have anything i can quote right now but i am sure that most supplement companies use this arguement and refers to research backing it. I am not going to defend it, just stating what i have read in the past. I might be wrong. I feel the same way you do about carbs, believe me. I will however incorporate them only around my training and races. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted January 9, 2013 Share I do not have anything i can quote right now but i am sure that most supplement companies use this arguement and refers to research backing it. I am not going to defend it, just stating what i have read in the past. I might be wrong. I feel the same way you do about carbs, believe me. I will however incorporate them only around my training and races. I am not against eating more carbs after heavy training to reload muscle glycogen levels if you are into high intensity training. It needs to be done sensibly though, with intake regulated by how well your body can metabolise the carbs and how your BG respond afterwards. People pay a lot of money to have their bikes setup properly or pay for other advice, but then don't do a simple BG test to see how their BG levels react after ingesting certain levels of sugar/carbs. Difficult to understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaco-fiets Posted January 9, 2013 Share Insulin spike shuttling nutrients into muscle cells seems to be a common concept. Just googled it quickly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted January 9, 2013 Share Being " a common concept " does not make it true ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Older Posted January 9, 2013 Share When in ketoses, stay in ketoses. Leave the carbs altogether. I have been eating low carb +- 30g per day now for ten months. On <3 hours rides I take only water and droe wors and peanuts. On longer rides I will take 12 grams of 32GI every 2 hours. I have done the one tonner and the DC this year with +- 6grams of carbs per hour. Tim Noakes also recommended to me to drink coconut milk to keep blood sugar levels decent. I have not done this yet. After a ride have an nice piece of steak or boerewors. For breakfast or when I am feeling like it I make a one minute microwave muffin. Slice it and top it with your favorite low carb topping. Egg, Ham, Cheese, Bovril, Tomato, Use it to make a hamburger etc. half a cup ground linseedHalf teaspoon baking powderHalf packet sweetenerPinch of salt1 eggteaspoon olive oilMix everything together in a cup and 1 minute in microwave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaco-fiets Posted January 9, 2013 Share When in ketoses, stay in ketoses. Leave the carbs altogether. I have been eating low carb +- 30g per day now for ten months. On <3 hours rides I take only water and droe wors and peanuts. On longer rides I will take 12 grams of 32GI every 2 hours. I have done the one tonner and the DC this year with +- 6grams of carbs per hour. Tim Noakes also recommended to me to drink coconut milk to keep blood sugar levels decent. I have not done this yet. After a ride have an nice piece of steak or boerewors. For breakfast or when I am feeling like it I make a one minute microwave muffin. Slice it and top it with your favorite low carb topping. Egg, Ham, Cheese, Bovril, Tomato, Use it to make a hamburger etc. half a cup ground linseedHalf teaspoon baking powderHalf packet sweetenerPinch of salt1 eggteaspoon olive oilMix everything together in a cup and 1 minute in microwave. What was your time in the One Tonner? How does this compare to your previous times while consuming more carbs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted January 9, 2013 Share When in ketoses, stay in ketoses. Leave the carbs altogether. I have been eating low carb +- 30g per day now for ten months. On <3 hours rides I take only water and droe wors and peanuts. On longer rides I will take 12 grams of 32GI every 2 hours. I have done the one tonner and the DC this year with +- 6grams of carbs per hour. Tim Noakes also recommended to me to drink coconut milk to keep blood sugar levels decent. I have not done this yet. After a ride have an nice piece of steak or boerewors. For breakfast or when I am feeling like it I make a one minute microwave muffin. Slice it and top it with your favorite low carb topping. Egg, Ham, Cheese, Bovril, Tomato, Use it to make a hamburger etc. half a cup ground linseedHalf teaspoon baking powderHalf packet sweetenerPinch of salt1 eggteaspoon olive oilMix everything together in a cup and 1 minute in microwave. sounds great, I'll have to taste this ! Are you aware that the 32GI contains half fructose which is essentially useless and not good for your health ? Why don't you rather use pure dextrose as carb source ? It is way cheaper too ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaco-fiets Posted January 9, 2013 Share sounds great, I'll have to taste this ! Are you aware that the 32GI contains half fructose which is essentially useless and not good for your health ? Why don't you rather use pure dextrose as carb source ? It is way cheaper too ! Think its a GI thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted January 9, 2013 Share Think its a GI thing If you mean by that, Glycemic Index, and that he uses 32GI to lower his GI of his drink ?He can do that by mixing only 6 grams pure dextrose in his 2 hour bottle and get the same GI or BloodGlucose response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaco-fiets Posted January 9, 2013 Share If you mean by that, Glycemic Index, and that he uses 32GI to lower his GI of his drink ?He can do that by mixing only 6 grams pure dextrose in his 2 hour bottle and get the same GI or BloodGlucose response. Technically isomaltulose has a lower GI than dextrose so the uptake should be slower isn't it? That is the entire drive behind the brand. Please explain to me your reasoning because there seems to be some principles here i am not aware of Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted January 9, 2013 Share Isomaltulose (chemical name: 6-0-a-D-glucopyranosyl-D-fructose), also known by the trade name Palatinose, is a disaccharide that is commercially manufactured enzymatically from sucrose via bacterial fermentation. It is a natural constituent of honey and sugar cane and has a very natural sweet taste. It has been used as a sugar substitute in Japan since 1985. It is particularly suitable as a non-cariogenic sucrose replacement.[1]Isomaltulose is fully absorbed in the small intestine as glucose and fructose. Like sucrose, it is fully digested and provides the same caloric value of approximately 4 cal/g.It is low-glycaemic and low-insulinemic. The effect of isomaltulose is that the glucose enters the blood at a slow rate, avoiding high peaks and sudden drops in glucose levels and therefore insulin levels as well. This leads to a more balanced and prolonged energy supply in the form of glucose.[2]Being low-insulinemic, isomaltulose also supports improved fat oxidation during physical activity as high insulin levels hinder the use of lipids as an energy source. As such, isomaltulose can increase the amount of fat used as energy, thus enhancing performance endurance.[3]Isomaltulose is tolerated like sucrose and not suitable for people with a pre-existing intolerance to fructose and those who are unable to digest sucrose.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isomaltulose You must remember, you can lower the GI index of anything by adding fructose to it. You can achieve a healthier (without the fructose) lower GI of glucose (dextrose) by consuming your total amount of dextrose in a race, not at once, but in small doses of it over the whole time frame of the race / training. You will not spike your BG levels that way. 32GI is just clever marketing of lower GI for an expensive product. It still contains fructose, which is bad ! Jaco-fiets 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M L Posted January 10, 2013 Share Just read a few pages again after reading up on some links, very good info, thanks guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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