Monark Posted November 17, 2015 Posted November 17, 2015 Right, now that I have put some mileage on the Vermarc PRR's I can comment on the feel and quality. I ride both MTB and road/cyclocross (my Cotic goes wherever it wants to - I just hold on!). I am about 177cm tall and weigh 80kgs. I am by no means a pro. I just love riding a bike. I ride about 4500km a year. I ride in Assos and love them. I own the Cento's which are the long distance bibs. I have been looking for similar bib shorts to train in and thus wanted something a little more affordable. There is a massive amount of information on the internet, it seems as if people make a living from reviewing and testing bibs! What I found is that the PRR's kept on being scored in the top five or so bibs tested. More importantly, they were scored higher Assos on many occassions. To drop R2500 on a pair of bibs to test them is a big gamble but how wrong could the internet testers be? gulp.... Service from the SA supplier was seamless (see what I did there...) and you get your bibs in no time at all. Great service. My one tip is to pay close attention to the sizing chart. The first thing that you notice is the number of panels and the different types of fabric used to make the PRR's. It is astonishing and the carbon effect material is a nice touch. The overall construction feels very 'premium' indeed. The leg grippers are nice and thick and not too tight. The overall fit is quite 'racey' and there is definitely a compression element to the way the PRR's gently squeeze your thighs. There is virtually no branding on the bibs so they are also nice an discreet. In a direct shootout with the Cento's the two massive differences are the PRR's lack of nice thick shoulder straps and the lack of the Assos "Cuckoo Penthouse" (if you own Cento's you will know what I am on about). The PRR's have a traditional thin-ish shoulder strap which can be a tad uncomfortable when in the saddle for over 4 hours or so. That being said, I honestly never felt the shoulder strap dig into my skin once nor were the shoulder straps uncomfortable. That thick Assos strap is still the best I have ever experienced. Those two minor issues aside, for me a pair of bibs is all about the chamois and overall fit. The fit of the PRR is amazing, dare I say even better than Assos. Chamois wise, there is nearly nothing in it. The Cento is Assos's long distance bib so I am comparing apples with apples. Yes the Assos chamois is maybe 1mm thicker but it is less dense/softer. The PRR chamois feels as if it is made from slightly more dense material. The PRR chamois is thick and from the first pedal stroke I found it to be immensely comfortable. I am incredibly impressed with the PRR's, I will gladly wear them on any 100km mtb ride that is thrown at me. The only small gripe I have is that the material on the outside of the left thigh gripper seems to be slightly scuffed. I have bike bags on both bikes and can only presume its from the bibs rubbing on them. Nothing major but I have picked it up during the course of my testing. I think that I am a convert and that Assos may have lost a customer....
Bicyclegear Posted November 17, 2015 Posted November 17, 2015 Right, now that I have put some mileage on the Vermarc PRR's I can comment on the feel and quality. I ride both MTB and road/cyclocross (my Cotic goes wherever it wants to - I just hold on!). I am about 177cm tall and weigh 80kgs. I am by no means a pro. I just love riding a bike. I ride about 4500km a year. I ride in Assos and love them. I own the Cento's which are the long distance bibs. I have been looking for similar bib shorts to train in and thus wanted something a little more affordable. There is a massive amount of information on the internet, it seems as if people make a living from reviewing and testing bibs! What I found is that the PRR's kept on being scored in the top five or so bibs tested. More importantly, they were scored higher Assos on many occassions. To drop R2500 on a pair of bibs to test them is a big gamble but how wrong could the internet testers be? gulp.... Service from the SA supplier was seamless (see what I did there...) and you get your bibs in no time at all. Great service. My one tip is to pay close attention to the sizing chart. The first thing that you notice is the number of panels and the different types of fabric used to make the PRR's. It is astonishing and the carbon effect material is a nice touch. The overall construction feels very 'premium' indeed. The leg grippers are nice and thick and not too tight. The overall fit is quite 'racey' and there is definitely a compression element to the way the PRR's gently squeeze your thighs. There is virtually no branding on the bibs so they are also nice an discreet. In a direct shootout with the Cento's the two massive differences are the PRR's lack of nice thick shoulder straps and the lack of the Assos "Cuckoo Penthouse" (if you own Cento's you will know what I am on about). The PRR's have a traditional thin-ish shoulder strap which can be a tad uncomfortable when in the saddle for over 4 hours or so. That being said, I honestly never felt the shoulder strap dig into my skin once nor were the shoulder straps uncomfortable. That thick Assos strap is still the best I have ever experienced. Those two minor issues aside, for me a pair of bibs is all about the chamois and overall fit. The fit of the PRR is amazing, dare I say even better than Assos. Chamois wise, there is nearly nothing in it. The Cento is Assos's long distance bib so I am comparing apples with apples. Yes the Assos chamois is maybe 1mm thicker but it is less dense/softer. The PRR chamois feels as if it is made from slightly more dense material. The PRR chamois is thick and from the first pedal stroke I found it to be immensely comfortable. I am incredibly impressed with the PRR's, I will gladly wear them on any 100km mtb ride that is thrown at me. The only small gripe I have is that the material on the outside of the left thigh gripper seems to be slightly scuffed. I have bike bags on both bikes and can only presume its from the bibs rubbing on them. Nothing major but I have picked it up during the course of my testing. I think that I am a convert and that Assos may have lost a customer....Thank you very much for taking the time and effort to independently test out our Vermarc PRR bibs and give comment.
Cycle Factory Posted November 17, 2015 Posted November 17, 2015 I was lucky to be able to "test drive" the new Fox Ascent le Savant lycra kit. Here's my "review", hope you find it informative. Review done with1) Santa Cruz Chameleon hard tail 26" bike, fitted with the Specialized Toupe 142mm saddle2) GIANT TCR road bike fitted with a Fabric Scoop Flat saddle (142mm)Pre-Fit impressions:In the 15 yrs I’ve been cycling I've used many brands of cycle apparel: Anatomic, Craft, Nalini, Santini, Vermarc, Panda, Castelli, Assos…the list goes on. One thing I’ve learned is that one’s initial impression shouldn't be based on the packaging. Fox is one of those companies who do like to save on fancy packaging & focus more on the actual product……Fox gear comes packaged in their standard high quality plastic bag, but you can see it was packed with loving care.Fitting Session:Based on the material used, the stitching, design, cut and chamois quality (which I'll review in more detail later) I could see & feel that this was going to be a "new" Fox apparel experience.Like most cyclists I wear a smaller size jersey than bib and I went with a medium shirt and large bib. I pulled on the bib and immediately noticed the ease with which the Fox designed leg "grippers" slide on and give the feel of not having a bib around your legs. Once adjusted into position they never moved or gave me any discomfort during my rides. I found the same from the "race fit" jersey design which also features the Fox designed "grippers" around the arms - it felt like I was wearing a loose sleeveless shirt.The Fit - the bib's chamois is mounted lower in front then the Assos I'm used to, very similar too Craft's designs. The rest of the chamois was also perfectly placed, so that the thickest part of the chamois was always under my sit bones, which is where it’s needed. The chamois design & thickness is very similar to Craft's high-end bibs. The cut of the bib is excellent with large side panels & flat stitching, so no fraying on the skin. The jersey is a very comfortable "racing” fit. It’s also very light.There’s a clever zipper pocket inside the rear right hand pocket with a cool cable through-hole for you headphone cable.The zipper and general stitching is of high quality and the detailing of the Fox logo on the rear rubber "gripper" on the shirt…showing some Fox Class! Ride Session:The Bib - My first ride was on my Giant TCR road bike which is fitted with the Fabric Scoop flat saddle. I found that once I was on the bike and started pedaling, everything felt in place……that would be the family jewels and chamois seated under my sit bones. I never needed to adjust or move around. I did notice a difference in the chamois thickness compared to my to Assos bibs I generally ride with, but the thinner Fox chamois was actually very comfortable. At the 50km point, there was still no discomfort from sweat or any pressure, and the Fox designed leg grippers where still keeping everything on the "tan line" that every serious roadie sports…..lol !The Jersey - it's pockets are remarkably deep, which is great for loading food, a rain jacket and naturally, your mobile phone….for which Fox has designed the inside zipper pocket with the headphone access slot neatly positioned right above the pocket. I kept looking at my arms since it felt like I had no sleeves on. After 50km's the moisture wicking material Fox uses was still doing an excellent job. I did miss the little sunglasses cloth which Fox has on their other jerseys (Livewire & Ranger ranges).On my Santa Cruz out on the trails, I had equal joy. Getting out of the saddle, sitting down & then sliding back on the saddle during climbs: I found the chamois remained in place & the leg and arm grippers kept the tan line in check, all the while keeping me very cool!Conclusion -I must admit that Fox has really stepped up to the plate as far as design, fit & quality goes with this new Le Savant Ascent lycra kit. I think the design & color may be somewhat over the top for some riders, but then again I did seem to get more head turning from fellow cyclists & motorists during my test rides. If you are a "Fox-anatic", then you'll get it & if you just like cycling "under the radar", you won't.Jersey: 7/10 great fit, light weight and quick drying.Bib short: 8/10 comfortable chamois, great fit and high quality material used.
Vanzyl Posted November 17, 2015 Posted November 17, 2015 I was lucky to be able to "test drive" the new Fox Ascent le Savant lycra kit. Here's my "review", hope you find it informative. Review done with1) Santa Cruz Chameleon hard tail 26" bike, fitted with the Specialized Toupe 142mm saddle2) GIANT TCR road bike fitted with a Fabric Scoop Flat saddle (142mm) Pre-Fit impressions:In the 15 yrs I’ve been cycling I've used many brands of cycle apparel: Anatomic, Craft, Nalini, Santini, Vermarc, Panda, Castelli, Assos…the list goes on. One thing I’ve learned is that one’s initial impression shouldn't be based on the packaging. Fox is one of those companies who do like to save on fancy packaging & focus more on the actual product……Fox gear comes packaged in their standard high quality plastic bag, but you can see it was packed with loving care. Fitting Session:Based on the material used, the stitching, design, cut and chamois quality (which I'll review in more detail later) I could see & feel that this was going to be a "new" Fox apparel experience. Like most cyclists I wear a smaller size jersey than bib and I went with a medium shirt and large bib. I pulled on the bib and immediately noticed the ease with which the Fox designed leg "grippers" slide on and give the feel of not having a bib around your legs. Once adjusted into position they never moved or gave me any discomfort during my rides. I found the same from the "race fit" jersey design which also features the Fox designed "grippers" around the arms - it felt like I was wearing a loose sleeveless shirt.The Fit - the bib's chamois is mounted lower in front then the Assos I'm used to, very similar too Craft's designs. The rest of the chamois was also perfectly placed, so that the thickest part of the chamois was always under my sit bones, which is where it’s needed. The chamois design & thickness is very similar to Craft's high-end bibs. The cut of the bib is excellent with large side panels & flat stitching, so no fraying on the skin. The jersey is a very comfortable "racing” fit. It’s also very light.There’s a clever zipper pocket inside the rear right hand pocket with a cool cable through-hole for you headphone cable.The zipper and general stitching is of high quality and the detailing of the Fox logo on the rear rubber "gripper" on the shirt…showing some Fox Class! Ride Session:The Bib - My first ride was on my Giant TCR road bike which is fitted with the Fabric Scoop flat saddle. I found that once I was on the bike and started pedaling, everything felt in place……that would be the family jewels and chamois seated under my sit bones. I never needed to adjust or move around. I did notice a difference in the chamois thickness compared to my to Assos bibs I generally ride with, but the thinner Fox chamois was actually very comfortable. At the 50km point, there was still no discomfort from sweat or any pressure, and the Fox designed leg grippers where still keeping everything on the "tan line" that every serious roadie sports…..lol ! The Jersey - it's pockets are remarkably deep, which is great for loading food, a rain jacket and naturally, your mobile phone….for which Fox has designed the inside zipper pocket with the headphone access slot neatly positioned right above the pocket. I kept looking at my arms since it felt like I had no sleeves on. After 50km's the moisture wicking material Fox uses was still doing an excellent job. I did miss the little sunglasses cloth which Fox has on their other jerseys (Livewire & Ranger ranges). On my Santa Cruz out on the trails, I had equal joy. Getting out of the saddle, sitting down & then sliding back on the saddle during climbs: I found the chamois remained in place & the leg and arm grippers kept the tan line in check, all the while keeping me very cool! Conclusion -I must admit that Fox has really stepped up to the plate as far as design, fit & quality goes with this new Le Savant Ascent lycra kit. I think the design & color may be somewhat over the top for some riders, but then again I did seem to get more head turning from fellow cyclists & motorists during my test rides. If you are a "Fox-anatic", then you'll get it & if you just like cycling "under the radar", you won't. Jersey: 7/10 great fit, light weight and quick drying.Bib short: 8/10 comfortable chamois, great fit and high quality material used. So you still going to have the same problem as the craft shorts with your junk sticking out on top of the chamois. great shorts maybe but that price is ridiculous, many other big players at that price to choose from!
Monark Posted November 17, 2015 Posted November 17, 2015 Agreed, I looked at Fox, Craft, Santini and Giordana and settled on the PRR simply due to the great reviews they receive in Europe. My junk may not be as concealed as it is in the Cuckoo Penthouse but it is happy in the PRR's.
Rapunzel Posted November 17, 2015 Posted November 17, 2015 VYE (made by Blue Flag Manufacturing in kensington) made up 2 pairs of plan black bib shorts for W2W. Got to say the quality is impressive, chamois is just the right thickness and the cut is great (wore it straight out of the bag on day 2 and they were really comfy). They make predominantly custom kit but will make plain to order. The bibs cost R1000 including vat and quality is comparable to my Giordana silverlines.
Monark Posted November 18, 2015 Posted November 18, 2015 bicyclegear.co.za stock the PRR's.... well worth the R2500 if you do mileage.
Thomo Posted November 19, 2015 Posted November 19, 2015 The only small gripe I have is that the material on the outside of the left thigh gripper seems to be slightly scuffed. I have bike bags on both bikes and can only presume its from the bibs rubbing on them. Nothing major but I have picked it up during the course of my testing. Bags with velcro straps have a tendency to do that without you realising until it's too late."Clip-on" bags solve that problem.
partydave Posted November 20, 2015 Posted November 20, 2015 I got some Voler bibs in the classifieds for a nickel a while ago. I've put a lot of mileage on them and absolutely love them. I'll replace them with another set if they need replacing one day, but this seems unlikely if I look at how well they have held up
eccc whippet Posted November 30, 2015 Author Posted November 30, 2015 Was at a lbs on the weekend...out of interest was looking at the bibs...something i found interesting...it looks like FOX and CANNONDALE use the same chamois as the old assos high mileage bib at a fraction of the cost...R999.
Lukep Posted November 30, 2015 Posted November 30, 2015 Assos T Cento- best bib I have used.I was skeptical about Assos in general because I have the Assos S5 Mile and I didnt find these to be very comfortable so I thought there was a lot of hype around Assos. I got some advise from Cyclesharp https://www.cyclesharp.co.za/ and found out that I was wearing a size too big in the Assos range. Got me some T centos in the correct size and havent looked back by far the best bib I have ever worn. At the same time I bought the T cento I got the Assos Neo pro and in my opinion the Neo pro is a close second to the T cento. I own 2 pairs of the PRR Vermacs which in my book would be third place.
eccc whippet Posted December 5, 2015 Author Posted December 5, 2015 If you are heavier the than 95 kg and around 6 ft/1.8m...you should fit assos tir size....I see hotspot cycles have some assos specials...the Mille for R999
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