Stans rims - opinions please

[rock]

Olympics or 355's.........??

 

for a sub 65kg rider (with shoes, helmet and waterbotte )

 

355's a bit stronger but a bit heavier right?

[xak1]

E-mailed Stan on this.  Here is his answer - I am heavier at about 80kg.

 

It's not the flex of either rim. It's your weight. Heavier riders must run a wider rim to stabilize the tires better at lower air pressures. I would recommend the ZTR 355 rim or possibly the ZTR Race 7000 series wheel set with a slightly larger spoke on the drive side.
But the race rims will not last forever. I also make a 06 Race rim that won the cape epic with Sauser.

[wonduhboy]

 

for a sub 65kg rider (with shoes' date=' helmet and waterbotte http://qloy.com/indexq=aHR0cDovL3d3dy50aGVodWJzYS5jby56YS9zbWlsZXlzL3NtaWxleTIuZ2lm)

 

 

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My opinion is you should eat somethinghttp://qloy.com/smileys/smiley2.gif

[xak1]

I am very happy with 355's.  Rims weighed as follows on my own accurate scale - including rim strip, valve, DT Swiss 240 hubs and 2/1.8 DT Revolution spokes x 32 on each wheel:

 

Front: 680g

Rear: 780g

 

Very happy with them - wider profile has definitely given me more stability on rough stuff.

[rock]

thanks, I'm leaning toward the 355 as I see they do have an 'all black' version too look better when running discs.....and they're a bit cheaper

 

now hubs........?? part of me is leaning towards Am Classic purely for the weight, but everyione moans about the bearings - are they really that bad??

 

[xak1]

I looked at both, but decided on the DT 240's - they are more expensive and weigh about 30g more, but they are very reliable.  I have picked up quite a lot of negatives on the Am Classics (check www.mtbr.com).

[rock]

DT240's are a LOT more......think I would rather then go for Hope's.....as they're super reliable, not the lightest but not the heaviest and priced in the middle...........

[xak1]

Hope's are good - will probably rather go for them than Am Classics.  XTR's are also good and affordable - although not cartridge bearings (this is actually not a problem, as they have very good seals).

[Johan Bornman]

E-mailed Stan on this.  Here is his answer - I am heavier at about 80kg.

 

It's not the flex of either rim. It's your weight. Heavier riders must run a wider rim to stabilize the tires better at lower air pressures. I would recommend the ZTR 355 rim or possibly the ZTR Race 7000 series wheel set with a slightly larger spoke on the drive side.
But the race rims will not last forever. I also make a 06 Race rim that won the cape epic with Sauser.

 

Oopsie! Don't buy a second hand car, or rim for that matter from this guy. He's talking talking through his valve hole.

 

Amongst all the wonders in his reply, I wonder the most about what a "slightly larger spoke" could be.

 

 

[montyzuma]

Well  a significant number of the top riders in the world buy their wheels from him. How many use yours Johan? Is it just instinctive to diss someone before finding out specifics?

[quickdraw]

First thing that came to mind when I read it - larger spoke = thicker spoke?

 

Could be wrong but that seems to be the logical deduction

[Racer X]

check out www.justridingalong.co.uk

They have access to all the ZTR rims; 355, Olympic sub 345, flow, arch etc. They also get the Race models, 300 grams, the Race 7000 is not available OEM yet, thats the 285 grams one.

 

I go for the Olympic ZTR sub 345 gram one, on Hope Pro 2 with revoltions.

 

That exact build is available on www.clee-cycles.co.uk

 

comes in at 1440 grams with alloy nipples.

[rock]

had a look there a few weeks back, but they will charge a lot for shipping.....

 

twowheelstrading.co.za are also dealing them in SA acording to their site.....

[Johan Bornman]

Well  a significant number of the top riders in the world buy their wheels from him. How many use yours Johan? Is it just instinctive to diss someone before finding out specifics?

 

None, I'm afraid. I've only sold 800-odd. The market for sensible wheels is waning fast.

 

I happen to know the specifics of Stan's wheels well. I've built a few wheels with them when they were still available in ZA. At one stage they were the only 28-spoke rims you could get for MTBs.

 

I've also sawn a few to pieces and analysed them. The are made from one of the aluminium 6000 series alloys. They make two big claims to fame - a patented (patent perhaps still pending) bead hook and light weight.

 

In the first instance, this particular patent solves no known problem. Regular rims runs well with tubeless or tubeless conversion tyres. I don't buy the claim that they cause less pinch flats. Anyone who wants to analyse this just has to look at the profile and think about it a bit.

 

Secondly, their light weight comes at a sacrifice. The sacrifice is durability. The only way to make an aluminium item lighter is to make it thinner by using less material and, to eliminate stuff. The stuff they eliminated is eyelets. The combination of no eylets, deep anodising and a thin spoke bed is a disaster zone. As Stan himself says "those rims wont last forever."

 

I've seen exactly the same problems with American Classic rims. In aluminium, there is a minimum weight after which things become flimsy.

 

The man has made a great name for himself and I think his tubeless conversion goo is great. I think his rims are sub-standard.

 

I've seen many, many "innovations" in rim technology and I also see their graveyards every day. What amazes me is that users are happy to put up with these shortcomings. I had a customer this week that was quite happy to pay the R1 000 odd for a new Ksyrium rim that split down the middle due to a poor extrusion.

 

He thought the 24 000 kms he got out of the rim was fair. Fair is in the eye of the beholder, I suppose.

 

As for Stan's claims about stability and bigger spokes, well, what can I say. Someone here attempted to translate "bigger spoke". Thicker spokes in themselves have a lot of problems most wheel companies don't seem to understand. Fulcrum for one.

 

However, you don't have to understand how a wheel works to make rims, wheels or market them. It's not against the law. And if you follow a tried-and-tested recipe you may even make good enough wheels.

 

I've recently had the opportunity to disassemble and rebuild Shimano's new XTR wheels. As a bonus I got to saw open the ruined rim. In my view, Shimano has gone back to honesty with this wheel. The rim is reinforced in the right places in the right way. The modifications they made to the spokes are for the right reasons. Yet the wheel is simple. It is eay to repair, the nipples are at the rim where they should be and it will be durable. Shimano got rid of the silly sidewall-hooked spokes, hub-based nipples and other BS.

 

They even thought of the wheelbuilder and built a flat section into the 1.5mm spoke so that you can hold it and prevent wind-up.

 

Stan's may be good in sponsoring the right people, but for them durability and longevitiy is not an issue.

 

Maybe not for you either.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[GoLefty!!]

Rock,

 

 

the 355 rim is a stronger rim. It's a bit heavier than the Race or Olympic but it is also more durable, ime bya factor of two. That also makes its cheaper.

The narrower width of the Olympic makes it weak. It buckles easily under riders of average weight. You need to be a ligher weight fairy for those to last anything longer than a couple of years.

 

Interestingly, the Shimano WH-M975 XTR wheels I have now does not feel like it's 250gr heavier for the pair. It's way stronger than the Stan's rims and it uses the std UST bead socket which is reliable and robust.

 Stans rims do allow the tyre to be fitted more easily, especially tight fitting UST tyres.

 

Of the Stans range the 355 would be my first Choice. The Arch is another rim that is pretty strong and thus far durable.

[rock]

wow - TWT want 10K for olympics on AC hubs......sure they're built by a yank, but my LBS had AC hbs on 355's for R5500......

 

I do like the XTR wheels, must admit, whats the price on them now?