Apparently we deserve to be knocked over

[jmaccelari]

 

Yeah and those same laws say we may not stand and pedal wtf! I think the laws need some serious rethinking. Also who is going to ride for hours single file not. It deprives us from a social privilege. It discludes us from the right to social interaction. Yes if the traffic is heavy or the road is narrow' date=' ride single file at all time, but in other cases where its open and safe people just won't ride singe file. Thats a FACT.

Anyhow why is the whole argument about single file if all, but maybe a select few, accidents occurred when guys where riding behind each other on the left hand side. This leads me to believe accidents happen because of unaware/uninformed, negligent, drunk motorists or cyclist not visually identified.

[/quote']

The laws are under review, and there are two major amendments I have heard of:

- cyclists may ride two abreast;

- it will be illegal to pass within 1-2m (I'm not too sure of the actual distance).

 

I do not know how these amendments are progressing. That's why we need a strong

cycling organisation lobbying for cyclists - something that CSA has been failing miserably at.

 

 

[Sammajoor]

Until people do not have a radical mind change, this problem WILL be with us forever.

 

We are the most considerate people out, UNTIL we get behind the wheel of a vehicle.  Then we undergo a personality change and become the biggest @assholes out.

 

Till this attitude changes, no amendments are going to help

 

[porky]

You believe in the inherent good in people? That doesn't seem to show in any of your other posts' date=' particularly the ones on doping!?

[/quote']

 

I was going to reply....................but I edited it.............comments as juvenile and ridiculous as this one dont deserve the dignity of a reply.! 

[porky]

I was referring those comments he made in the line of the whole peleton is on "juice".

 

 

Refer me to that post.!

 

Check your facts before you point fingers. 

[RockCoach]

Just to give everyone here a heads up.

 

CarToday saw a mass migration to a new forum late last night. It was not only due to the cyclist vs motorist thread (which was deleted) but has been coming for a while now. The powers that be have been dictatorial in their deletion of threads without explanation. The guys and girls have just had enough. The mods threw in the towel after being treated like children for the hundredth time.

 

Regarding the thread that broke the camel's back -

Although there was a lot of inflamatory stuff posted by both sides, I do feel that there was some excellent points made and quite a bit of common ground was reached. If you look at it closely it was really a minority who were just stirring. I don't think we will ever find total consensus but where had we ever had a forum before where both sides could at least put their point of view across.

 

For those wishing to continue the debate - you will find the new bb here: http://www.no10.nl/ctbb/

At least until a new domain name is decided. There isn't a waiting process for registrations...

 

Use it/don't use it.

 

 

 

[Slave]

For my part in being one of the minority wooden spoons, I appologise for bringing any disrepute too this forum. Whilst I thought it was fun at the time, it just took a tiny bit of intelect to realise it was in fact childish in the extreme. This is my public appology to all my fellow hubbers.

 

This morning as I lay in bed snorking my coffee, it occured to me that the best thing we can do about this is organise a Race. Protests are nothing more than a way of holding the economy to ransom and has far reachin effects on people who are not really involved in the us vs them debacle.

 

So, Captain Slow, this is my idea (and I really would like some opinions on this one from all)

 

We organise a Race for Signs. The proceeds to be used to have signs errected (which kinda ties in with your efforts and is possibly a way to raise funds.

 

The entry form, to be signed by all entrants will carry a copy of the rules as posted in another (since delted) thread.

 

I envisage that we can get sponsorship if we plan it correctly. I am hoping for input from some of the bigger players (Bike importers, Cycle Lab, Energade or Powerade, Pick n Pay, that sort of thing.)

 

The route can be planned but my thoughts tend to be from say Nasrec, along the back of SBR to Heidelberg and then back to Nasrec but this is just an idea, open to suggestion and change.

 

Your thoughts and comments please.

 

(perhaps this needs to be in a thread of it's own. I'm not sure. Mods please move it if deemed necessary.)

Slave2Love2009-02-17 00:20:11

[markStockton]

 

 

For those wishing to continue the debate - you will find the new bb here: http://www.no10.nl/ctbb/

At least until a new domain name is decided. There isn't a waiting process for registrations...

 

Use it/don't use it.

 

 

 

 

It doesn't look like their new site is working to well either.

 

Return to index page

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[Daniel XTR]

Just to give everyone here a heads up.

CarToday saw a mass migration to a new forum late last night. It was not only due to the cyclist vs motorist thread (which was deleted) but has been coming for a while now. The powers that be have been dictatorial in their deletion of threads without explanation. The guys and girls have just had enough. The mods threw in the towel after being treated like children for the hundredth time.

Regarding the thread that broke the camel's back -
Although there was a lot of inflamatory stuff posted by both sides' date=' I do feel that there was some excellent points made and quite a bit of common ground was reached. If you look at it closely it was really a minority who were just stirring. I don't think we will ever find total consensus but where had we ever had a forum before where both sides could at least put their point of view across.

For those wishing to continue the debate - you will find the new bb here: http://www.no10.nl/ctbb/
At least until a new domain name is decided. There isn't a waiting process for registrations...

Use it/don't use it.

[/quote']

 

Slick/SL

 

i think we did reach common ground, and immaturity on both ends in some places was not called for. As far as your CTBB goes good luck on the move, i ma sure your new platform with the same old members will be more of the same, in a good way for you guys i am sure.

[Moab]

For my part in being one of the minority wooden spoons' date=' I appologise for bringing any disrepute too this forum. Whilst I thought it was fun at the time, it just took a tiny bit of intelect to realise it was in fact childish in the extreme. This is my public appology to all my fellow hubbers.

 

This morning as I lay in bed snorking my coffee, it occured to me that the best thing we can do about this is organise a Race. Protests are nothing more than a way of holding the economy to ransom and has far reachin effects on people who are not really involved in the us vs them debacle.

 

So, Captain Slow, this is my idea (and I really would like some opinions on this one from all)

 

We organise a Race for Signs. The proceeds to be used to have signs errected (which kinda ties in with your efforts and is possibly a way to raise funds.

 

The entry form, to be signed by all entrants will carry a copy of the rules as posted in another (since delted) thread.

 

I envisage that we can get sponsorship if we plan it correctly. I am hoping for input from some of the bigger players (Bike importers, Cycle Lab, Energade or Powerade, Pick n Pay, that sort of thing.)

 

The route can be planned but my thoughts tend to be from say Nasrec, along the back of SBR to Heidelberg and then back to Nasrec but this is just an idea, open to suggestion and change.

 

Your thoughts and comments please.

 

(perhaps this needs to be in a thread of it's own. I'm not sure. Mods please move it if deemed necessary.)

[/quote']

 

Could we not consider using a route where riders have fallen? Like include the nice cycling area of sandton (like sandton drive as a nice downhill - or uphill if you are feeling mean)?

[Slave]

Thing is Di, there is a lot of ill feeling around right now and ultimately, I would like the race to be highly visible to motorists as well as being a platform to raise funds for signs and highlight the rules to cyclists.

 

So, if we include high population density areas like Sandton, will we not increase the frustration levelsofmotorists in general? Even partial road closure gets their blood pressure  up. Given this, I though it might be better to have it in a quiter area. Then again, it is open to suggestion and thanks for yours. 

[TNT1]

My two cents, a race is even more pathetic than a "protest". Daft and pointless in producing  a result in changing attitudes. The biggest race in the world enjoys full road closure,  goes right through the middle of Cape Town, and that's exactly where the majority of riders are getting knocked off and killed right now. 

[Daniel XTR]

want protest,

 

do silent protest wear black armbands at the Argus this year. Get enough people into it and you will create a stir

[TNT1]

 

want protest' date='

 

do silent protest wear black armbands at the Argus this year. Get enough people into it and you will create a stir

[/quote']

 

That's actually not a bad idea. But you gotta get the press and TV involved. They need to be commenting on it during broadcasts of the show. Speak to some of the pro teams here for the Giro and get their buy in too. That will get the right attention and focus.

 

[Daniel XTR]

Some one else can handle that project,

just the idea, i do encourage it, but dont have the time at the moment to dedicate to a project such as this.

 

perhaps one of the biger clubs or groups *hint hint* jneed to step up to the table here.

[TNT1]

Yeah. Go find my thread about standing up and being counted. 

[Icycling]

Something I wrote this morning to my fellow committee members. Bye the why the motorist / bike problem is all over the world, some countries just manage it better!

 

 

 

"I think what I am saying is correct - the last 3 deaths of cyclist have been where the road is quite wide.

 

 

 

1. Simonstown - that road although no yellow lines is wide enought for 2 cars to drive next to each other. Their are other circumstance around his case.

 

 

 

2. Ou Kaapse Weg - yellow lines.

 

 

 

3. This past weekend again road wide enought for yellow lines - I am not that familiar with this road so I may be wrong here.

 

 

 

Why?

 

 

 

Where we think as cyclist it should be safer to ride as the road is wider it seems not to be the case - coincidence?

 

 

 

If we consider the Dutch road management system they are alway slowing car down. In the small town on a 2 lane road they put islands (sometimes with speed bumps) so cars cannot go past each other but have to allow 1 car at a time. On the freeway they (create their own traffic jam) have overhead boards flashing speeds for example in a 120km/h speed limit they have electronic boards flashing 90km/h then 70 km/h followed by 50km/h and all motorist slow down thinking their may be a problem ahead.

 

 

 

It seems to me that their is a strong possibility that motorist naturally just become complacent when the road is wider - consider sms's on their cell ph etc as their margin of error for driving has just got that much wider. But then an obstacle like a cyclist is in the road and well we seen what has happened!

 

 

 

Is fighting for wider roads the right thing for cyclist to be doing? Or would it not be better for cyclist to be fighting for islands on roads to reduce motorist speed and keeping their concentration focused?"