supplement advice

[b_andrews4]

Hi all

 

While training for the suncoast triathlon in march I'm finding that I'm waking up really hungry in the mornings after eating a pretty substantial meal for dinner. I've been told that I should look into taking a casein proteing shake from evox as it is slow releasing? But is it going to make me put on weight? I don't really want to be more than I am at the moment at +- 80kgs.

 

Advice??

[ebenvn]

I would rather recommend Optimum Nutrition. They are expensive, but you know you get the best...

 

It only feeds your muscles and should not add weight. Casein protein is a slow release which will "trickle feed" your system during the night. Another tip is to eat half a tub of low fat cottage. Does the same

[rob7x]

Any straight 100% protein will not make you put on weight. The 100% synergy whey from Evox is very good (in my opinion, i have used almost all the diff proteins on the market) and has casein in it for slow releasing, Optimum is excellent but I cant justify paying the price for it.

[b-unit]

Why is optimum better? Because it cost more and comes from the US where the guys can claim what on earth they want on the label?

[dommisse]

Any straight 100% protein will not make you put on weight. The 100% synergy whey from Evox is very good (in my opinion, i have used almost all the diff proteins on the market) and has casein in it for slow releasing, Optimum is excellent but I cant justify paying the price for it.

 

Why do you say this - surely protein has kilo-joules that potentially can make you put on weight - what am I missing?

[andydude]

I don't know much, but in my simple mind, your body has been recovering and using nutrients in your sleep and that, with you basically fasting for eight hours, will surely make you hungry? I don't think you have to be alarmed. Just eat breakfast?

 

And for me the old equation still holds where energy in > energy out = weight gain. Maybe not 100% that simple, but pretty close. So even taking in 100% protein can add weight since protein is another source of energy.

[b-unit]

If you eat the same calorie value in protein vs sugar there is a major difference because of how it absorbs in your body. Eg. the effect it has on insulin.

 

Dairy (like cottage cheese) also has a big effect on insulin and I wouldn't suggest it for your goal.

[dommisse]

If you eat the same calorie value in protein vs sugar there is a major difference because of how it absorbs in your body. Eg. the effect it has on insulin.

 

Dairy (like cottage cheese) also has a big effect on insulin and I wouldn't suggest it for your goal.

 

disagree on this - too many new proofs that the whole 6 small meals and low GI only makes a difference in that you feel fuller for longer - and that if you eat same amount of Kj of low Gi and higher Gi the weight gain will be same. Protein DOES make you feel fuller quicker and this is why you eat less on a protein diet.....

 

" Eat Many Small Meals Rather Than Three Big Meals

Many small meals, as opposed to three main meals, is supposed to enhance weight loss by making you feel full for longer. In a technical sense, this is supposed to prevent blood glucose from dipping low in between meals, which may cause you to become hungry and overeat during the next main meal.

 

Like many of the myths about fat loss, there is strong acceptance of this premise on many health and fitness sites. Weight trainers and body builders tend to be strong supporters of this idea. The problem is, there is no substantial evidence that it works. Even though a few early studies reported benefits, more recent evaluation has not found solid evidence to support this idea.

In fact, increased meal frequency may lower the “thermic effect of food,” which is the energy required to digest food. This would theoretically result in just the opposite of the outcome anticipated by the “small meal” supporters, showing a comparative increase in weight.

Even so, this idea is not as outlandish as some of the others, and more research may make the picture clearer. For now, though, you should not consider smaller, more frequent meals for weight loss as providing an advantage."

Edited February 16, 2012 by dommisse

[Zula]

Hi all

 

While training for the suncoast triathlon in march I'm finding that I'm waking up really hungry in the mornings after eating a pretty substantial meal for dinner. I've been told that I should look into taking a casein proteing shake from evox as it is slow releasing? But is it going to make me put on weight? I don't really want to be more than I am at the moment at +- 80kgs.

 

Advice??

 

My simplestic view

1. After not eating for roughly 8 hours you will be hungry hence the term break-fast. I am always hungry when I wake up by the way.
   
2. If you feel like you have stable levels of energy during the day at work or while training then you are eating enough and correctly
   
3. If you dont need to eat a factory produced supplement then dont. We as consumers have no idea what they put into that stuff.
   
4. That being said, the only brand I would trust for nutrition over and above 32gi would be Evox. Its quality ingridients imported from the 1st world and made on sight in JHB. Not like some of the other major brand that grace the shelves of dischem with all their marketing propoganda leading people to believe that its actually better.
   
5. And finally, if you really hungry, just eat more! Surely a bit more steak is tastier than a protein shake?
   

 

My 2 cents. Not a fan of supplements. Think that 95% of it is nothing but marketing and hype.

[b-unit]

Dommisse, the way in which something like sugar gives an insulin spike is not really debatable... It is a fact. The effect this has on health and fat burning is also a fact.

 

Please send me some links of credible info that states otherwise.

[ebenvn]

Why is optimum better? Because it cost more and comes from the US where the guys can claim what on earth they want on the label?

 

No, becasue it has better research and production facilities. I dont have a problem with Evox, but you can't compare the 2. Start looking at sugars etc and you will see the difference

[b-unit]

No, becasue it has better research and production facilities. I dont have a problem with Evox, but you can't compare the 2. Start looking at sugars etc and you will see the difference

 

I'm not arguing that it is better than evox. I would just like to why "you know you get the best". Are their blenders better quality stainless steel or do their products have better micro counts? The raw materials usually come from the same few international manufacturers. Their casein product does taste awesome by the way. I just fail to see why they "are the best". Good product and awesome work from their marketing department would be my guess.

[dommisse]

Dommisse, the way in which something like sugar gives an insulin spike is not really debatable... It is a fact. The effect this has on health and fat burning is also a fact.

 

Please send me some links of credible info that states otherwise.

 

read this article - facts is such an overused word - today's facts are disproved tomorrow :-)

 

http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-242-304--13443-F,00.html

 

"THE MYTH:

TO LOSE WEIGHT, CUT CARBS OR FAT

 

THE TRUTH:

Most get-thin-fast plans revolve around the idea that restricting your intake of one particular nutrient, usually carbs or fat, is the best way to lose weight. But the results of a 2009 New England Journal of Medicine study suggest otherwise. For two years, participants followed one of four calorie-restricted diets with varying amounts of carbs, protein, and fat. After 24 months, all participants lost about the same amount of weight (just nine pounds). "This study proves that calories are the most important factor for weight loss," says Tara Gidus, R.D., a Florida-based sports dietitian and marathoner. "To lose weight, you need to take in fewer calories than you burn—regardless of what percentage of carbs, protein, or fat you're eating." Gimmicky diets just distract us from this simple truth. Here's how runners can learn to reduce their total caloric intake to kick start weight loss—and still have energy to run their best."

[MDW]

Hi all

 

While training for the suncoast triathlon in march I'm finding that I'm waking up really hungry in the mornings after eating a pretty substantial meal for dinner. I've been told that I should look into taking a casein proteing shake from evox as it is slow releasing? But is it going to make me put on weight? I don't really want to be more than I am at the moment at +- 80kgs.

 

Advice??

B this is just up my alley, I am a nutrition expert its what I do, and I deal with plenty of athletes from amateur up to Olympic level.

All I can do is smile when you say you wake up hungry. Friend do u know how many people I deal with that don't have an appetite in the morning and battle to eat. Its normal you wake up hungry which is great. So firstly don't stress. Secondly don't even think of replacing natural foods with supplements to try and change the way your body feels and acts. When your body talks it talks for a reason and you need to listen to it, not try and suppress its form of expression.

Not sure how old you are but REE if you are between 30-40 oh apologies your Resting Energy Expenditure, is most likely around the 1575 calorie mark, ok its weight dependant I dont know that either but I am working on 60kg's which will give you around 1575 calories u r burning off at total rest. Now throw in exercise and I am not sure what kind of exercise effort you put in daily or weekly, but for most endurance athletes u r looking around an activity factor of 1.6-2.4 , unless you are trying to lose weight u would lower your factor to ensure you consume less calories than you are burning off. Taking into the lowest account you would need to be consuming around 2520 calories up to 3780 on the upper scale of exercise level, if you give me more information I can give you an idea. So that's firstly ensuring you are consuming the appropriate amount of calories per a day in order to meet your energy expenditure requirements.

Secondly, all this protein talk, you really dont need much more than 1.6grams per a kg of body weight per a day, in excess its dangerous, 1.6 is actually a very high level of training for an endurance athlete, I work on that value but I train around 17-30hours a week. So someone who is doing say around 10-15hours a week even 1.2grams is fine. Protein is not something that the body just uses in one meal it should be spread over the day and you should try to consume the appropriate amounts but nothing in excessive amounts.

Finally, as an athlete I eat 6-7 meals without any exercise, I eat 8-12 meals with exercise every single day. I firmly believe in fuelling before and after for sure, and depending on the duration and intensity of exercise I might opt to fuel during. Nutrition is something that comes with getting to know your body and understanding what is required to fuel it so you remain healthy, strong, and energetic. By the way my dinners meals are my smallest my breakfast is my largest I saw you mentioned your dinner was large, not a good idea at all, most people get that totally wrong.

Just take care, stick to natural and if you are not sure about direction as we are all unique, no two people are the same in nutrition requirements, its best to consult a nutritionist and get proper guidelines and advice that you will be able to stick to for life.

 

One thing I also wanted to mention is why 100% protein what is it you r trying to achieve from the protein, you guys are cyclist NOT body builders, an endurance athletes needs more importantly an element of carbohydrates with the protein particularly after exercise WHY? simple you need to get those glycogen levels up and blood glucose levels stable otherwise you will go hypoglycemic and land up eating unnecessary calories due to hunger cravings during the day. A body builder is a different kettle of fish, I wont knock brands I believe personally ON is great but I firmly believe its for body builders etc, not endurance athletes. You need to understand the purpose of the product what it contains and exactly how and why you are going to use it.

 

all the best

M

Edited February 18, 2012 by MDW

[b_andrews4]

Thanks for the epic reply! I'm 24 and training twice a day on Mondays and Wednesdays and once a day on Tuesday, Thursday and sometimes a Friday with my brick sessions being on Sundays. I have been taking USN Recover Max and USN Glutamine and have found that its made a big difference to my recovery time. But from what you say I understand that I should be eating a bit more as I definetely haven't been chowing 6 or 7 meals a day!