htone

And not one chirp about the level of the volume on the amp in the background ??? You are getting slack....

@thatsme - I think that's how a few of us are feeling and perhaps what we are doing wrong is to say "LCHF does not work" in stead of saying "I did not work"... ? In my case I definitely think it is a combination of not eating right (even eating too little), STRESS and a general lack of exercise or activity due to (my reasoning) and unforgiving winter. So here's the cool part - let us collectively feed back as to what works to get the weight off and what doesn't ? My guess is still that HIIT type training will be the catalyst - I just need to motivate my lazy ass to start that again.... Keep talking !

Now I have seen everything ! Good one !!!

I think it was the milk too, but I also did not really spread my protein intake and tended to consume it in two "lumps" which obviously didn't help. Much of what happened seems to be because I just became lazy....

Ok running on a nice and fast internet connection from work, so will copy Wheat first, once that is done, I will recopy Food Inc (they may disappear from the Google drive for a while).

Sorry, HMT, I missed this. I can try to reload them overnight, may be corrupt due to all the interruptions when I originally uploaded them. Anyone else had probs with these ?

I have had almost a week of no milk or cream and I dropped 1.5kg.... dang ! This is a bit of a disappointment in a way since my treat was cream and nomu and protein powder.... My shake now consists of coconut oil, flaxseed oil (ja, ja... PUFA's) and butter with nomu, protein powder and water. Started cycling again, but that could not have made a difference as the volume has been really low, so I am thinking tapson's explanation of GLUT4 kind of explains what was happening - even in the absence of exercise, my insulin response was not triggered "enough". I could not detect an increase in BG from "normal" amounts of milk and cream, but when I did my "cream treat", which is about 300ml cream, 100ml milk and 50g of whey protein, I managed to get my BG above 7.2, which would explain why my weight loss has been stalling. I have been running way below my required caloric intake for some time now, so I am certain that some of it was my body hanging on to everything I consumed, but that could only be maintained for so long, so the key seems to be (again) to keep that insulin level as low as possible. Ingestion of milk and cream over a long period (in my case) may have resulted in enough of a metabolic signal to stop fat burning but not enough to spike my BG - if that makes sense ? I have also introduced a small lunch of eggs, cheese and homemade mayo from today as I have been working really long days with the resultant late afternoon hunger pangs and light headache looming, so I will report back on how that works for me. The self-experimentation continues and after a year exactly of running on LCHF I am still learning something new every day.

Does not sound right, PAK, so I will have it looked at if I was you. Two things to keep in mind that will affect BG readings - make sure your hands are washed and clean before testing, even minute amounts of sweat or other foreign matter can affect the readings, and DO NOT squeeze your finger hard, as this has always resulted in a higher reading for me. Perhaps take the meter to where you bought it and have them test your BG and then immediately test yourself to compare. The Roche rep came out to me once and brought calibration fluid to make sure the meter was accurate and I have never had issues. The readings do vary when taken close together, but not by the numbers you are quoting.

Great infographic on MDA: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/the-primal-blueprint-21-day-challenge-infographic/#axzz2fL9oV4hk

Yep, that's quite good ! Let us know how the experiment develops !

Someone asked me the same question the other day. Below is my answer - this is regards the documentary movies, not the LCHF type interviews on the drive: Depends on what you are interested in. "Food Inc" is a must see on my list, not about LCHF, but about what is happening to the food chain.... "In search of the Perfect Human diet" is about Paleo / LCHF and is a good watch too. Start with those then take it from there. If you have kids - then make sure you watch "Generation Rx" at some point !

If you can get hold of one of the reps of e.g. Roche in your area you will probably be able to pick up a meter cheap or even for free - remember they make their money on the test strips, not the meter ! Dischem do appear to be quite expensive so if you have a smaller or independent pharmacy nearby, compare prices first. The other option is to order off the internet - just buy something that you can get the strips for in your pharmacy.

Not exactly LCHF, but I know many of us on here have or are taking meds for our "metabolic syndrome". Here's a list of the four most dangerous prescription drugs... http://www.goodlivingwarehouse.com/4-most-dangerous-prescription-drugs/

Hi Eugene, I have dropped about 1kg but I have not exercised as planned (this Cape weather is to blame I say)... I have cut back on cream, butter and milk consumption but upped my coconut oil intake somewhat to compensate. I am literally almost eating no carbs now, and the loss is slooooowly happening. I still think that my total caloric intake may be a little low which is causing my body to hold on to whatever it can (and I have not run my food intake numbers to confirm this, it is just based on gut feel), but I am at the same time conscious of the fact that any form of exercise will contribute to weight loss so I will (I hope) get my lard ass going on this weekend. My diet is almost the same as yours, I probably just front-load my fat earlier in the day and I don't really eat lunch, but may snack on kaiings and biltong. I suspect our daily caloric intake is little low, hence the stall - my numbers look remarkably similar to yours. I should be able to form a more conclusive opinion over the next two weeks.... provided I start getting active.

Could be tumbleweed.... But I think we found the guy !

Google Drive finally synched after a week of choking through our restricted ADSL lines, however... Vanishing of the Bees did not copy because we are out of space on this drive - yep, just under 15GB used up ! Anyway, there's enough on there to keep you busy for a while - have a great weekend !

For those of you who are still worried about higher cholesterol on LCHF, old Jimmy Moore is really pulling the ring out of it with all the tests he is having done and so far it all seems good.... Jimmy Moore's Livin' La Vida Low-Carb I had four cardiovascular health tests run on Wednesday: CIMT (carotid artery scan), Bone Density, Peripheral Arterial Disease and Abdominal Aortic Aneurysm. Don't worry, I'm perfectly healthy and doing just fine. Just doing more testing to satisfy my own curiosity as well as being able to add one more piece to the puzzle about the true meaning of what my "high" cholesterol is all about. It was a relief to FINALLY find a place that did this CIMT (an ultrasound that looks for increased thickness and plaque development) especially in my area (one of those traveling health testing companies) and was completely thrilled that Christine and I could both have it done. The cost for all four tests was around $140 each--a bargain if you ask me for a test like this. We'll be getting the results back within 21 days and I will be blogging about those when I get them. With my zero Heart Calcium Score, I don't expect any issues. We'll know soon. Stay tuned!

tapson it is good to have you back

Forget for a second about the many health benefits we have experienced with a healthier lifestyle. I think the point relating to training that I was trying to make is this... What if we REALLY tried to adapt ? What if we didn't give up when we hit that first mini-bonk and started taking carbs ? What if we kept pushing that envelope and allowed the body the time to adapt - what is really possible ? Could we adapt to the point that we had the capability to perform at max or race effort without supplementation at all ? I know most on here will have races to compete in, groups to ride with, or whatever valid reason why you cannot allow yourself to regularly have those "mini-failures" while riding and we then have to resort to supplementing for those peak efforts, but what if we could take the time to adapt ? Because I am not a racer, this is a bit of an academic question for me - I have the luxury most of the time to train at my own pace and our group training rides are seldom so tough that I will burn through my available glycogen completely. So somewhere in my mind's eye I can see myself being able to ride at race pace, maybe even do stage races without supplementing.... I just cannot help but think back to more primitive man, heck even think back to the very, very early days of cycling when there were no GU's and gels - I think athletes then (and the hunters before them) were supremely adapted fat burners not through choice, but through design due to the "lifestyle" (read need to survive) then. I cannot for a second believe that a primitive hunter who had to chase down his prey always operated below 75% VO2Max and always had the opportunity to recover - there MUST have been mechanisms in our ancestral bodies that could burn stored bodyfat and burn it regardless of the requirements at rates far more efficient than what we are experiencing now. And THAT must be the ultimate goal, surely ? I reckon if we stay on this, if we keep surfing those bonks for longer and longer, if we keep adapting and learning though this, we are going to have amazing conversations on here in a year or two....

PAK, you are asking a very pertinent question and I don't have the answer to that. I am also sitting at around 95kg now and I eat very little - I think the body has gone into preservation mode somehow. I have, due to personal circumstances, not trained for the past month, not at all. Next week I am going to cut right back on my milk intake and actually substitute milk with water, to see if that makes any difference, and I will start training again from this weekend. My guess is that on LCHF the body is much more conservative in how it uses its own energy stores and becomes quite efficient at keeping homeostasis at where it thinks the comfortable levels are. Perhaps we could experiment with the same amount of food, but spread that throughout the day ? I only eat breakfast and dinner and seldom snack in between. My guess, however is that we are too far below the daily caloric requirement and need to be within that magic 500 kcal window to kick start the weight loss. Perhaps I should just get back into HIIT training as that got me going in the past. Interesting times - let's keep the conversations and the learning going !

Yes it does, but look at what it did initially - it goes up then stabilizes and settles around a healthy level. Also his ratio of HDL : LDL remains good. My own measurements seem to be heading the same way - I guess the trick is to stay in the LCHF zone for this to happen !

Love where this discussion is heading. Most of us have been doing LCHF for less than a year. MY guess is that in a year or two from now we may discover astounding things about our bodies' ability to burn fat a lot quicker than we do now - I agree on the Oscar Calupsky (and Bruce Fordyce) story - they have trained to do extreme events only on bodyfat and water, there must be some learning in that for us. I don't dispute for a second that we run out of glycogen quickly (now) at levels well into our VO2Max zone, but I suspect with enough time and by systematically training at lower and lower levels of carb intake we will be able to perform at levels we can only speculate about now. At least I hope we will. My real battle right now is with my weight that is just absolutely not moving, from next week I am going to severely restrict my milk intake to see if that makes any difference at all.....

No need to stop your adaptation, just keep tuning the carbs down and the fats up while maintaining about 1g protein / kg bodyweight. Even if you continue to gradually do this, you will benefit in the long run and cut your adaptation time when you do decide to give it another go. If you keep your carbs nice and low your weight should continue to roll off which in turn will give you a huge power to weight advantage on the bike. Whichever way you look at it, it's a win for you !

GOOGLE DRIVE UPDATE Telkom have made some temporary repairs to the ADSL infrastructure damaged during the heavy rains a week or two ago, but the full repair is only scheduled for 20 September. In the meantime all the movies have copied across. Starting later tonight, I will copy the following 3 movies that I received from tombeej (thanks Mate ): David vs. Monsanto Doctored The future of food I am also going to copy the following documentaries as I am sure you will find them interesting: The end of the line (about how we are overfishing the oceans) Pumping Iron (the original Arnold movie) Vanishing of the Bees (disturbing evidence of genetic modification and pesticides killing off honey bees) Redbull's Where the trail ends (extreme downhilling at its most extreme) I will also copy a collection of Paleo cookbooks to a folder called "Paleo Cookbooks" Francois has kindly shared some Atkins Diet info and that will be under "Atkins diet" Can't tell you when this will all be done, so do check in from time to time. That link again: https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B9eZXQXPw2z_RnJTcVRRQzVxWE0&usp=sharing

@lovestocycle - this is not an overnight, switch-on / switch-off process. You will need to train your body to start using fat in preference over carbs and as schweinehund has said, that takes a few weeks. Some people seem to manage to do this in about 4 weeks, but for most it is an 8 - 12 week process to fully adapt while training as well. Once you have read through this thread and looked at some of the references on the first two pages of this thread, you will soon see that your question about breakfast becomes academic. When you are fully fat-adapted you could easily ride without any breakfast at all, depending on how hard you want to ride. Most people on here who have become adapted to fat burning will still take some carbs during training in their VO2Max zones, as those carbs get readily burned for fuel by the body. The trick is to try and minimize this during the initial phase of adaptation so that you "force" your body to fire up that fat burning engine, which involves (amongst other things) actually forming new mitochondria in your muscles. Just take it easy on yourself and if you have a training deadline looming for some big race, then best you start training and eating on the bike like you would want to during that race. Shout if you have questions - lots of people with great experience on here who will happily assist.