Best performing suspesion design

[Caerus]

So according to the poll, the Spez which are top of the range bikes comes out with one of the worst performing suspension designs. Interesting.

[Caerus]

After my first wipe on the new rig ill let you have a go at her

That shouldn't take long then

[HowellingWulf]

cva?

[covie]

OOH! OOH!

 

Saying that, the Tallboy LT is on my list. First 9er I actually could see myself parting with my cash for...

 

Santa, Rocky Mountain, Pyga, ellsworth they all need a honorable mention and cash to be forked out for.

[madvics]

I love my trek top fuel with ABP .

[Iwan Kemp]

To better understand poll results you need to run another one that asks " Which suspension design do you currently ride?". Chances are you'll get the same result as this one.

 

People vote for what they know and most often for what they currently ride. In most cases your current is your best ever. So if you ask "best brakes" hubbers will vote for what's on their steed. Very few people downgrade and even if you go from XT bike to XT bike chances are it will have had an upgrade since you bought your previous bike.

 

And of course statititions will say you need to factor in percentage market share before you can come to any sort of conclusion. Murky.

[covie]

To better understand poll results you need to run another one that asks " Which suspension design do you currently ride?". Chances are you'll get the same result as this one.

 

People vote for what they know and most often for what they currently ride. In most cases your current is your best ever. So if you ask "best brakes" hubbers will vote for what's on their steed. Very few people downgrade and even if you go from XT bike to XT bike chances are it will have had an upgrade since you bought your previous bike.

 

And of course statititions will say you need to factor in percentage market share before you can come to any sort of conclusion. Murky.

 

Agreed you will never get a acurate result, not only is it what they currently ride, hubbers will vote for what they perceive to be the best suspension which will reside on their dream bike that they would one day like to buy.

[North Shore]

I do agree with you Crow, we tend to choose what we know, and obviously in no way do I mean that Stander and Sauser won due to the brain, that'd be ridiculous, but you cannot deny it is an efficient system. I have a 2010 Stumpie and the 2012 S works (29er) and the original Santa tallboy. I have also ridden A LOT of other mates bikes and IMHO the brain is by far the best at dealing with pedal bob, climbs like a hardtail and for me is a much smoother ride than the Tallboy although I definitely do notice it bottoming out on the bigger hits, although from having ridden friends stumpies without the brain or it set very low seems to help with this. For you to rank it as the worst out of that list seems to me ridiculous as I've also ridden on most of those systems and objectively there is no way I would place it anywhere near the bottom of the list. You claim the brain doesn't translate across the board, although I'd never recommend it on a downhill course (well I have at the MANKELE course but I'd hardly recommend it) I do find the stumpie in particular to be one of the better all rounders, I've smashed it pretty much everywhere in situations I've seen other designs fall very short (obviously rider influenced).

[DJR]

@ Crow

 

Tell us how you come to ride so many bikes. The story behind the story?

[BergForce]

But with so many happy Maestro users it must be very good

[Iwan Kemp]

I do agree with you Crow, we tend to choose what we know, and obviously in no way do I mean that Stander and Sauser won due to the brain, that'd be ridiculous, but you cannot deny it is an efficient system. I have a 2010 Stumpie and the 2012 S works (29er) and the original Santa tallboy. I have also ridden A LOT of other mates bikes and IMHO the brain is by far the best at dealing with pedal bob, climbs like a hardtail and for me is a much smoother ride than the Tallboy although I definitely do notice it bottoming out on the bigger hits, although from having ridden friends stumpies without the brain or it set very low seems to help with this. For you to rank it as the worst out of that list seems to me ridiculous as I've also ridden on most of those systems and objectively there is no way I would place it anywhere near the bottom of the list. You claim the brain doesn't translate across the board, although I'd never recommend it on a downhill course (well I have at the MANKELE course but I'd hardly recommend it) I do find the stumpie in particular to be one of the better all rounders, I've smashed it pretty much everywhere in situations I've seen other designs fall very short (obviously rider influenced).

 

Trust me my intention is not to turn this into a bash. I respect that you like it. Having said that...

 

The fact that you say it climbs like a hardtail yet bottoms out on bigger stuff is proof in itself that it's not a good design. If anything it should not get full travel if set to climb like a hardtail.

 

Before I owned my first Ibis I got to ride the Mojo Classic back to back with a Stumpy in Jonkers and the Ibis killed it. Not only just. It simply couldn't cary the same speed through rough stuff and didn't have half the grip through corners and berms. Took me all of two rides to get the Ibis' suspension down to what works for the canaries and the rest of the day trying to get the Stumpy up to speed.

[North Shore]

@ Crow do you mean the 2008 Mojo? Because the stumpie's design has changed quite a bit since then, I must confess I've ridden the Ibis Mojo SLR (and another mates HD) and had lots of fun on it, but DEFINITELY don't agree with you on speed, my stumpie owned on time. Given that the stumpie is about 1kg lighter probably accounts for it but they were both carbon and xx vs xtr. I invite you to come and retest the newer models before you make blanket statements based on five year old designs.

[(Deon)]

@ Crow

 

Tell us how you come to ride so many bikes. The story behind the story?

 

"I invite you to come and retest the newer models before you make blanket statements based on five year old designs."

 

That's how. People seem to throw bikes his way..

 

I think all bikes have weak areas. I am available to test on Mondays, Thursdays and any day of the weekend!

[Iwan Kemp]

@ Crow

 

Tell us how you come to ride so many bikes. The story behind the story?

 

Felt demo rider for over a year. Developed a love for all things technical behind on and over the bike. Since then have wiggled my way into enough proper rides to know what is what. Have spend days in the mountains tuning bikes for customers (as part of a service Cycle Factory offers) and friends.

 

By no means is my word the final say as there are lots of guys I still learn from. But what I do different from the average weekend warrior is proper analysis. And lots of spare kit. The above mentioned Mojo / Stumpy test was done using control tyres and wheelset. Bought a Garmin for timing purposes and was fortunate enough to have the local guru help me set it up to pin point time differences. Now I use the incredible Mobii Motion for which I am a Beta tester.

 

When doing timed runs it would never be top to bottom. Take Majik for instance. When leaving the car park you have a fairly gradual, smooth climb till you get to the fence where you have to turn left to climb up along the fence. (Not the new route through the vineyards). The first section to there and from there to the gate where you turn right to climb to the post would get divided into sectors. So far three sectors.

 

1: Climb to end of office park on right (Smooth Climb)

2: Climb to the gate (Rutted climb, lots of suspension movement)

3: Climb to post (smooth climb, legs nice and warmed up

 

Rest of the sectors as follows if not going all the way to the top:

 

4: Single track section down to first bridge

5: Single track section down to sharp left hand turn leading into trees that run along river

6: Single track to edge of dam

7: Single track from there till the end.

 

Reason for this is each "sector" has a different characteristics. No use riding all the way from the bottom to the top and back down again and just saying "Bike A is faster". Where is it faster? Where does it make up the time? Where is Bike B slower? You can only tell that by splitting out the different sections.

 

Doing lots and LOTS of rides with a hardtail back to back with a dual, 26" back to back with a 29er, 29 hardtail back to back with 26" dual have taught me lots. No need for me to fall around in the dark when I comment about whether a hardtail 29er feels like a 26" dual. (It doesn't by the way). Also I can say exactly where a 29er is faster and exactly where it loses time.

 

Back when I was doing this four times a week I had a stem in every length imaginable and would often spend the whole day in Snake Eyes trying to find the best combo of stem / spacers and bars. Would also go up there with a shock pump, measuring tape and lots of other geeky bits to dial my own bike's suspension. That taught me a hell of a lot about LSC, HSC, Rebound, Sag, Positive Air, Negative Air, Motion Control and whatever else.

 

Through my involvement with Cycle Factory I have been privileged to weeks on demo bikes to get a feel for them. I would then have to give feedback to the shop as well as the agents. Tests are never done without proper set up of bike and if not the right size. And I never ever offer an opinion on the Hub based on jumping on a mate's bike. Can be dangerous and need to keep myself in the clear when it comes to my opinion on all things bike.

 

Have spend the last four months riding 29ers... More on that soon.

Edited April 3, 2012 by The Crow

[Iwan Kemp]

@ Crow do you mean the 2008 Mojo? Because the stumpie's design has changed quite a bit since then, I must confess I've ridden the Ibis Mojo SLR (and another mates HD) and had lots of fun on it, but DEFINITELY don't agree with you on speed, my stumpie owned on time. Given that the stumpie is about 1kg lighter probably accounts for it but they were both carbon and xx vs xtr. I invite you to come and retest the newer models before you make blanket statements based on five year old designs.

 

Spez has been asked for a follow-up test. Rep agreed only to pull out at the last second. Saying the tests are "inconclusive" and of no use to them. Scared much?

 

Also, ask yourself how come they need to tweak the bike EVERY year. If you don't trust me, have a look online at pro reviews. Spez bikes with fox Suspension always get better reviews than the ones with Spez' own stuff.

Edited April 3, 2012 by The Crow

[Iwan Kemp]

To add, it's not often I feel the need for speed (typing)! I try to separate bike from the OP's question which was suspension design. Not shock. Not bike. Not geo. Not brand or anything else. Suspension design.

 

My HD is by no means perfect. I wish I could get the same pedaling platform with a bit more downhill focus. If anything I think too many manufacturers are trying to build the perfect one bike instead of designing and building a bike squarely aimed at being damn good at it's intended purpose. A 160mm bike is not suppose to climb just as good as a 4" bike. It's a bonus that it does, but that's a nice to have.

 

This is why the Anthem is so good. Giant managed to build a brilliant XC bike. So good that it gave enough confidence to be thrown around trails. They then thought to make the Trance a longer travel version of the Anthem. Didn't work. Then, even more foolishly made a longer travel version of the Trance and called it the Reign. But since then things have moved on. The Trance is now a model in it's own right with a geo sorted for trail riding. So too the Reign and the Reign X. No more confused bikes.

 

Anyway, I think I've stopped making sense about two posts ago...