PPA: How much funding should the association retain annually (i.e. not spend on cycling)?

[Icycling]

Edge_Design:

 

The reason for having a year buffer is so the association can honor a years benefits as the membership is for 1 year. So if you join the association today your membership expires in 1 years time - if PPA does not get anymore income in the next 365 days they can at least honor your membership. It is a rather simplistic way of looking at things but does show credibility. Naturally the running cost of the organization can be reduce also in that year if one see the "ship" is sinking. I would suggest also that the property PPA owns or should in future purchase should have a full bond allocated to it and be evaluated at least every years and the bond adjusted accordingly - as this in effect is part of the pool of money that PPA is sitting on and should always be assessable!

[andydude]

Andydude - sorry have been on the road most of the day - so not been looking at the hub that much. Here is the link to the PPA constitution - I don't have a link to WPCA constitution

 

http://www.pedalpowe...ion-governance/

 

I wasn't looking for goblygook constitutions. I was just looking for a short summary of who all the recognised organisations in the Western Cape are and what their mandates are.

 

I'm not trying to be difficult, but if I don't know the above then I bet you most other people also don't know and then it makes almost all the votes and comments here invalid.

 

PS. I did read through the PPA constitution and I'm actually still unclear exactly how and where they fall into the bigger picture, especially in terms of races (not funrides)? Is the constitution perhaps written too wide?

[Icycling]

Once again as per the link of the page does this not answer your question?

 

"The main purpose and object of the association is to promote cycling and the interests of cyclists. Without limiting the generality of the aforegoing, the association shall have the following ancillary objectives:

(a) to be a representative body for the furtherance of the interests of cyclists;

( to promote cycling as a recreational activity, a sport and as a means of transportation;

© to improve conditions for cyclists with particular regard to their safety;

(d) to arrange and organise cycle tours, fun rides and outings;

(e) to co-ordinate cycle tours, fun rides and outings organised by other bodies and to assist them in their efforts;

(f) to establish contact and liaise with and where appropriate affiliate with other organisations having similar or alike interests and objectives."

 

What it does not indicate is for a financial perspective their main goals should be to invest as much money possible!

 

Not sure why B and C look like they do and I cannot seem to change them

Edited November 6, 2012 by Icycling

[Icycling]

Bump - due to apathy of cyclist who know how to complain but really are not that interested in getting anything done - possibly that is why of the approximately 20 000 members of PPA has, normally less than 100 go to the AGM. Cyclist don't expect anything to happing if all you can do is complain!

[carbon29er]

I really believe it's PPA job to promote all cycling and that includes the Southern Suburbs fun rides. I ahve been hearing stories of lack of funding as a reason why the SS rides are no more, it costs R30k for traffic control etc.

 

So WHAT? PPA and Cycle Trust make millions from the World Championship Fun Ride every year,plough some of that back into what must some of the best amateur fun ride/racing in the world around the Point.

 

That's how you promote cycling, let people ride in safe and orgnised routes on roads with beautiful scenery and great climbs.

[kandui]

I have been co-opted on to the PPA Executive for a period of 1 year. I attended my first Exco meeting 2 weeks ago , but am still finding my feet and will for the moment refrain from joining the debate as I am not fully up to speed with the internal workings of the PPA yet.

 

I decided to make myself available, because like many other cyclists who pay an annual membership fee, I wasn't sure about what my money was being spent on.

 

Just to address one issue:

PPA organised MTB and Road events make a loss as they bring in less revenue than is spent to organise them.

Road events run at a slightly lower loss than MTB, probably due to larger fields entering the road events.

PPA also sanctions events which are listed on the PPA events calendar . These are organised by events companies or private individuals and the PPA only offers logistical support (marshals, signage, medics..) at their expense.

 

At the meeting I attended it was proposed and agreed that the PPA would look at offering support to initiatives like the Chain Links meetings, Moonlight Mass and other privately organised Awareness and Advocacy initiatives. The support would be more at the "back end" , leaving the initiators to do their thing, if you know what I mean.

 

I am keen to serve on the PPA Exec, because I want to involve myself on the mountain biking side and see where I can make a contribution.

 

I would be happy to act as a conduit for queries, suggestions and comments which are logical and based on fact not hearsay. I won't be checking Hub threads all the time to gather information. Please email me directly at ride@tablemountainbikers.co.za and I promise I will respond to each email sent and I will try my best to get the issue addressed at the PPA Executive level.

If it's urgent, you can call me on 083 6319796.

Edited November 23, 2012 by kandui

[Let's Ride]

Honestly, Moonlight mass has a back up vehicle, it runs smoothly as is. Not sure what the PPA will do, possibly start charging us to attend? (edit it's help at the back end).

 

 

 

 

Olympic Cycles provide the back up vehicle (thanks Olympic cycles).

 

Think bike marshals look after our safety.

 

Traffic officials look after our safety.

 

Moonlight mass organisers have whistles and tell us when to go etc.

Edited November 23, 2012 by Let's Ride

[kandui]

Don't be so cynical "Let's Ride". Where stuff needs to be paid for (and it always does at some point), that's where PPA can get involved.

We also don't want to force anyone to do anything they don't want to , but why not make it known that if you need help, the PPA can and is willing to assist? And this help isn't just reserved for a race. It can be for anything cycling related that encourages more people to get off their arse and on to a bike.

Nobody wants to take over anything! Just because the PPA might pay for a tank of fuel for the support vehicle, doesn't mean the Moonlight Mass has sold out.

 

Keep the perspective on this debate. The thread started because someone suggested the PPA should not sit on a pile of cash, but rather spend it in the best interests of cycling (and this meant to cover all aspects).

 

I merely put the MM forward as an EXAMPLE of a community driven event to make the point that the PPA is there to support any initiative which promotes safe cycling, I could have named others.

Edited November 23, 2012 by kandui

[Let's Ride]

Only saw your comment now that it's at the back end.

 

Sorry.

[Guest ctMTBer]

Always thought PPA was about making money not really providing us a better cycliing experience!

[Icycling]

Unfortunately I have no time to comment right now till Monday - with DC on this weekend! But I do have comments.

[Edge_Design]

Edge_Design:

 

The reason for having a year buffer is so the association can honor a years benefits as the membership is for 1 year. So if you join the association today your membership expires in 1 years time - if PPA does not get anymore income in the next 365 days they can at least honor your membership. It is a rather simplistic way of looking at things but does show credibility. Naturally the running cost of the organization can be reduce also in that year if one see the "ship" is sinking. I would suggest also that the property PPA owns or should in future purchase should have a full bond allocated to it and be evaluated at least every years and the bond adjusted accordingly - as this in effect is part of the pool of money that PPA is sitting on and should always be assessable!

 

What income are you referring to? Surely the membership fee is a major source of income and sufficient to cover their operating costs for a year (I would like to think providing for the members will come before their social development initiatives if it came down to that financially so they should be able to continue operating on those memberships alone)? I don't expect them to go and spend my membership fee the day I pay it to them, that should be used over the year as necessary.

 

Regarding the comments about them making a loss on road races, is it possible to get an accurate breakdown of the costs that go to a single event (call it 1000 riders so roughly R100,000 income)? I am amazed that running clubs can make a profit off much smaller participation at around R30 entry fee (probably more water tables on the run, but obviously a shorter distance so the only difference should be the number of traffic officers involved).

[Cippo]

Decrease entry fees for a year to encourage more 'new' people to do fun rides. Why not pay our CSA fees again.

[JanJan]

I don't know if there is already a system like this in place within the PPA, but how about they spend the excess on a marshal recruiting and organizing facility/body.

 

This facility could serve as a middle man between race-organizers and public volunteers. PPA can advertise an event where the general public could assist as a marshal and help cyclists. Spend the money on administration, bright and reflective bibs and basic emergency training.

 

This would ensure that marshals know whats going on and not just wave a stick with a red flag.

[kandui]

What income are you referring to? Surely the membership fee is a major source of income and sufficient to cover their operating costs for a year (I would like to think providing for the members will come before their social development initiatives if it came down to that financially so they should be able to continue operating on those memberships alone)? I don't expect them to go and spend my membership fee the day I pay it to them, that should be used over the year as necessary.

 

Regarding the comments about them making a loss on road races, is it possible to get an accurate breakdown of the costs that go to a single event (call it 1000 riders so roughly R100,000 income)? I am amazed that running clubs can make a profit off much smaller participation at around R30 entry fee (probably more water tables on the run, but obviously a shorter distance so the only difference should be the number of traffic officers involved).

 

Go to this address and scroll right down where you will see how PPA assists event organisers financially: http://www.pedalpower.org.za/about-ppa/agm/agm-2012-reports/

 

It's easier than to cut & paste.

[andydude]

Once again as per the link of the page does this not answer your question?

 

"The main purpose and object of the association is to promote cycling and the interests of cyclists. Without limiting the generality of the aforegoing, the association shall have the following ancillary objectives:

(a) to be a representative body for the furtherance of the interests of cyclists;

( to promote cycling as a recreational activity, a sport and as a means of transportation;

© to improve conditions for cyclists with particular regard to their safety;

(d) to arrange and organise cycle tours, fun rides and outings;

(e) to co-ordinate cycle tours, fun rides and outings organised by other bodies and to assist them in their efforts;

(f) to establish contact and liaise with and where appropriate affiliate with other organisations having similar or alike interests and objectives."

 

What it does not indicate is for a financial perspective their main goals should be to invest as much money possible!

 

Not sure why B and C look like they do and I cannot seem to change them

 

Ok so taking into account what you said and reading through the constitution, it's clear to me that PPA's mandate is as wide as to DO EVERYTHING. This is what I have a problem with. Don't get me wrong, I actually think they are doing a good job, but narrow down the focus, because my feeling is that there is a mismatch between people doing things and who are capable and too much money.

 

There is a big difference between "promote cycling and the interests of cyclists" which would include commuters on the one hand, and racing on the other hand. Jack of all trades but master of none?