Shuttle for enduro, yeah of neigh

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

BF, there was a penalty (most have), 1 min for every min over.. quite harsh but promotes fitness and discourages the fearless DH guys from just arriving and competing on their DH rigs.

 

This is also something to consider for events, if they are going to shuttle/chairlift then what is stopping the downhillers from riding it on dual crown forks? I read something on par with this, I think it was Dan actually, he was considering bike choice for round 2. ??

 

If that's the case, then I reckon they (ews) need to put an upper restriction on the bikes, something like a simple Single Crown Forks Only sorta thing. That way you can still run 180mm Totems, but you're gonna have to tote that thing up to the top. Unless you have s step-down feature, that's gonna suck.

 

But agreed - no shuttle on race day, except MAYBE to the top of St1. Unless you put a Liaison stage at the front? That way it'll be an official no shuttle thing.

 

One point though - if your start point is at the top of, say, the top of the mountains at Morzine, or Whistler, and the race meeting area is at the bottom where all the facilities are, surely the okes should be allowed to shuttle to the top, where the actual race will start?

[(Deon)]

If that's the case, then I reckon they (ews) need to put an upper restriction on the bikes, something like a simple Single Crown Forks Only sorta thing. That way you can still run 180mm Totems, but you're gonna have to tote that thing up to the top. Unless you have s step-down feature, that's gonna suck.

 

But agreed - no shuttle on race day, except MAYBE to the top of St1. Unless you put a Liaison stage at the front? That way it'll be an official no shuttle thing.

 

One point though - if your start point is at the top of, say, the top of the mountains at Morzine, or Whistler, and the race meeting area is at the bottom where all the facilities are, surely the okes should be allowed to shuttle to the top, where the actual race will start?

 

ah but in Enduro the first stage is not necessarily at the top.

[deviate]

and EVERYONE should be riding the trails BLIND!!! no more practise!! the next ews race has 1 practice run for each rider, no more!!!!

 

damn we need a Series!!! I want to talk to meurant to create a AME WP Series for next year (allmountain enduro western province series)

 

6 races from march-December main event on 17 December at dirtopia festival!!

 

I think it should be like this

 

Witfontein-saasvel (George)

Delvera

Welvanpas

Jonkershoek

tokai

genadendal - year end festival

 

who would be in to ride a series like this?

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

ah but in Enduro the first stage is not necessarily at the top.

 

In which case, no shuttle...

 

And agreed. Either regulated practices, or nothing at all.

[wesley_r]

At the risk of sounding opinionated, here is my 2c:

 

Enduro courses should be run blind - no practice. But, this can be problematic - what if you're racing at a trail where a lot of your competitors ride regularly - then they end up with the advantage. A day of practice is a good way around this.

 

Shuttling during practice should not be allowed - it gives bigger teams an advantage, as they can afford to have a van there driving them to the top. In Cape Town this isn't an issue - most of our courses don't have public shuttle access.

 

As for shuttling during the race - I think it needs to be at the discretion of race organisers. You should have to climb most of the liasons on your own steam, but a shuttle can help with really long / steep bits that would just be TOO tiring and would also extend your day.

[deviate]

At the risk of sounding opinionated, here is my 2c:

 

Enduro courses should be run blind - no practice. But, this can be problematic - what if you're racing at a trail where a lot of your competitors ride regularly - then they end up with the advantage. A day of practice is a good way around this.

 

Shuttling during practice should not be allowed - it gives bigger teams an advantage, as they can afford to have a van there driving them to the top. In Cape Town this isn't an issue - most of our courses don't have public shuttle access.

 

As for shuttling during the race - I think it needs to be at the discretion of race organisers. You should have to climb most of the liasons on your own steam, but a shuttle can help with really long / steep bits that would just be TOO tiring and would also extend your day.

 

hey wes,

 

that's the beauty of running a 6 race Series!! you can only have a slight avantage at 1 or two races not at all 6!

 

so everyone will have their strength at their local spot but have to ride slower at the unknown tracks

 

it would suck as a once off !

 

but I think that's why there are a lot of series races happening from usa to Italy to uk to france. it levels the field a lot more!

 

what do you think?

[nigelhicks]

As Mr Minn said ... its a bit off par! ... I think you need to ride the whole thing ... HOWEVER ... in the big mountains, this would then limit many of the trails as to climb 1500m before each stage would just be death!

 

So it depends again on the locality of the event.

[nigelhicks]

Enduro courses should be run blind - no practice.

 

NO WAY - from a safety aspect you need to have practice ... BUT practice should be limited to 2 runs per rider on each stage ... NO Shuttles.!

 

This gives the riders an opportunity to check the tracks prior - but does not give any one person an advantage

[(Deon)]

NO WAY - from a safety aspect you need to have practice ... BUT practice should be limited to 2 runs per rider on each stage ... NO Shuttles.!

 

This gives the riders an opportunity to check the tracks prior - but does not give any one person an advantage

 

Morning Nige ..this could be where local and international events differ.

 

During the TP a big focus was on the the equality of each rider riding the course for the first time. I think this is easier when you have large tracts of land littered with trails that have been mapped over years. In our local events though, finding virgin trails is going to limit the sport since we have very little "wilderness" with trails dating back hundreds of years.

 

 

I get the feeling that erosion is mainly what the international events rely on to make the stages difficult, we aren't really allowed to let trails erode naturally (or it counts against the sustainability ) so in SA there is not much choice than to build features in if you don't have the natural rocky terrain..

 

Do you suggest practice because many events here will use parks or local trails with man-made obstacles? Or is it just a sporting chance to let guys have a few runs?

[nigelhicks]

Morning Nige ..this could be where local and international events differ.

 

During the TP a big focus was on the the equality of each rider riding the course for the first time. I think this is easier when you have large tracts of land littered with trails that have been mapped over years. In our local events though, finding virgin trails is going to limit the sport since we have very little "wilderness" with trails dating back hundreds of years.

 

 

I get the feeling that erosion is mainly what the international events rely on to make the stages difficult, we aren't really allowed to let trails erode naturally (or it counts against the sustainability ) so in SA there is not much choice than to build features in if you don't have the natural rocky terrain..

 

Do you suggest practice because many events here will use parks or local trails with man-made obstacles? Or is it just a sporting chance to let guys have a few runs?

 

Hey POS ... No i dont think that it should be limited to an SA thing .... I hear you with regards to the TP ... but that is a whole other kettle of fish all together - there would be no way you could practice 6 days worth of trails ... so in that instance you have to ride it blind.

 

I just feel that there is more chance of injury if the riders havent seen the track (even just once) .. thats why I would say practice is necessary but needs to be restricted!

 

Another way is like we did when i used to be a National Rally Navigator - before a national we were presented with the race book with the stages in them, as well as a DVD with in-car footage shot at a almost constant speed of 60km/h. I could then adjust the notes as I saw fit before hitting the stages in anger in the event.

 

So having videos of the stages up before hand could also work as riders could use these as prep rather than having true practice.

 

Its not realy about a sporting chance - but i think your comment about the "man-made" obstacles might have something to do with it as one of the chicks last year really hurt herself at Cascades by hitting a step down lip incorrectly and landing on her head.

 

The natural trails are better - but when they are as eroded as the trails in Punta Ala were - I dont think anyone should be allowed to race those stages in anger without seeing them first - cus you could really do yourself in ... and thats not what the sport wants or needs

Edited May 27, 2013 by nigelhicks

[(Deon)]

Glad I asked, thanks!

 

Rally Navigator?? You speak in fork tongue? I always tape the nav's mouth shut in Colin McRae Rally, can't understand him so just wing it with crash disabled!

[deviate]

Hell yes! That's a good idea. Do go pro and stage profiles for each stage!

 

That would work! Sent out max 1 week before the race. So that the locals don't have forever to practice the stages

 

Dirtopia is all.blind. With locals having the upper hand. It's still a lot of fun doing it blind!

[nigelhicks]

anyone here know how to reduce a go pro footage quality to upload to youtube? Im trying it now for gibas enduro - but my files are like 600MB! ... (PS sorry for the thread hijack)

[PhilipV]

I reckon Shuttling should be controlled.

As in if shuttling will be allowed, open it for all. One shuttle service covered by race entry that everyone has access to. if it means less practice runs for those who don't want to ride up then so be it.

On race day itself it will be up to specific events. Adapt it to every event.

 

I still think blind runs with minimum practice is more fair in my humble opinion.

 

The format is still taking baby steps, I reckon now is the time to wrinkle out these issues.