The Veganism Thread

[Odinson]

That is definitely not what I said.

 

I am ASKING: " If the whole idea is that one can't bring oneself to eat an animal, then surely its a bit weird trying to make one's diets taste, look and feel as close as you can to animals flesh?" Its not an attack, nor an attempt to discredit it, are all questions about veganism from non-vegans seen as attacks?

 

Just like how those protesters used a fake dog to try and gross out non-vegans? My point has merit if you dont feel like answering it, then don't, but please don't try and turn my questions into something that they are not. Ironically this is inline with my question about vegan foods being made to taste like flesh is all about.

 

Edit: Here is an example, I wont eat plant based Roasted Dog Shank, because I wont eat real dog. So if eating real cow is unpalatable, surely eating fake cow should illicit a similar feeling?

 

I've seen some vegans who claim that they can't eat stuff like Beyond Burgers because it's too realistic and, personally, that's fine. I've also seen vegans who say they still crave animal flesh (oftentimes there's a biological mechanism at play). 

 

At the end of the day, veganism isn't about vegans and taste preferences. It's about every person understanding the injustices being committed against animals and nature and deciding to not participate therein. 

[Chris_]

That is definitely not what I said.

 

I am ASKING: ....

 

Chill man, that wasn't aimed at you. Its just something I think of often and its along the lines of whats been brought up today. 

 

xoxo peace

[Eldron]

That is definitely not what I said.

 

I am ASKING: " If the whole idea is that one can't bring oneself to eat an animal, then surely its a bit weird trying to make one's diets taste, look and feel as close as you can to animals flesh?" Its not an attack, nor an attempt to discredit it, are all questions about veganism from non-vegans seen as attacks?

 

Just like how those protesters used a fake dog to try and gross out non-vegans? My point has merit if you dont feel like answering it, then don't, but please don't try and turn my questions into something that they are not. Ironically this is inline with my question about vegan foods being made to taste like flesh is all about.

 

Edit: Here is an example, I wont eat plant based Roasted Dog Shank, because I wont eat real dog. So if eating real cow is unpalatable, surely eating fake cow should illicit a similar feeling?

Most vegans I know and omnivores like me steer clear of the faux meat stuff. It's BAD!

 

I think faux meat is a relic from a bygone era or maybe something to help meat eaters transition.

 

Your question is mostly irrelevant.

[Patchelicious]

Chill man, that wasn't aimed at you. Its just something I think of often and its along the lines of whats been brought up today. 

 

xoxo peace

Apologies, your comment and the content thereof straight as the post directly after mine and the content thereof, did create the impression it was reply to me.

[Patchelicious]

Most vegans I know and omnivores like me steer clear of the faux meat stuff. It's BAD!

 

I think faux meat is a relic from a bygone era or maybe something to help meat eaters transition.

 

Your question is mostly irrelevant.

Not when the topic being discussed is around faux meats. Its kind of what we have been discussing the last few posts.

 

Regardless, it might be irrelevant to you, but I am asking because I want to know.

[Patchelicious]

I've seen some vegans who claim that they can't eat stuff like Beyond Burgers because it's too realistic and, personally, that's fine. I've also seen vegans who say they still crave animal flesh (oftentimes there's a biological mechanism at play). 

 

At the end of the day, veganism isn't about vegans and taste preferences. It's about every person understanding the injustices being committed against animals and nature and deciding to not participate therein. 

 

I know this, and I appreciate it.

 

Many of the vegans I know dont eat meat because the thought of eating an animal grosses them out. I can get behind that, as I used the dog meat example to prove their case. I just asking that surely this thought process should counts for fake cows and people who don't want to eat real cows too.

 

But anyway... This biological craving thing you speak off, what is that?

[Chris_]

....

 

Edit: Here is an example, I wont eat plant based Roasted Dog Shank, because I wont eat real dog. So if eating real cow is unpalatable, surely eating fake cow should illicit a similar feeling?

 

Its actually almost 2 years since I last ate meat. I've had a few fake chicken products, which tasted very similar, it was weird at first but my mind and stomach are pretty happy dealing with it so far. Beef seems more tricky, I've tasted seitan 'biltong' which was gross, mushroom 'biltong' which was super odd and won't go back for, I'm yet to try something that actually tastes like beef - so if I ever have a Beyond Burger it'll be an interesting sensation. To be honest, I don't miss the taste in the slightest and would rather choose an actual veggie 'burger' over the former.

 

I often wonder if there will be a situation where I order a steak again, and what would happen to my body/stomach. 

[Odinson]

I know this, and I appreciate it.

 

Many of the vegans I know dont eat meat because the thought of eating an animal grosses them out. I can get behind that, as I used the dog meat example to prove their case. I just asking that surely this thought process should counts for fake cows and people who don't want to eat real cows too.

 

But anyway... This biological craving thing you speak off, what is that?

 

There's an analogy I can make here to answer that question, but I think it's a bit, inappropriate. 

 

The mechanism is around carnitine and creatine. These are non-essential compounds (i.e. your body produces what it needs), but can also be ingested via a number of foods and are highly concentrated in animal products. So, when you eat a diet heavy in those 'foods', your body down regulates production of those compounds. Go plant-based in a short period of time and your body takes a while to get the regulation back to where it needs to be and can result in 'meat cravings'. 

[Odinson]

https://www.facebook.com/mercyforanimals/videos/359908898018444/

[Chris_]

Impossible Whopper rolling out to 7000 stores in the US next week. I wonder if/when it'll reach SA? And how much it'll cost....

[Odinson]

Impossible Whopper rolling out to 7000 stores in the US next week. I wonder if/when it'll reach SA? And how much it'll cost....

I think production capacity will be a big limiting factor. Apparently Impossible Foods will be partnering with a third party to help boost production.

[100Tours]

Please help with an issue of definition here for me - 

 

Is Veganism:

1. Following a plant based diet

or

2. The belief that we should not eat animals (variations include that we should not pursue intensive factory farming, or that we should treat animals ethically)

 

That's an important difference. 1 is a dietary choice, the other is a belief system. Personally I believe in ethical treatment and limited animal consumption, but I also recognise that at some point in human development you probably need to consume meat products.

Edited August 2, 2019 by 100Tours

[Odinson]

Please help with an issue of definition here for me - 

 

Is Veganism:

1. Following a plant based diet

or

2. The belief that we should not eat animals (variations include that we should not pursue intensive factory farming, or that we should treat animals ethically)

 

That's an important difference. 1 is a dietary choice, the other is a belief system. Personally I believe in ethical treatment and limited animal consumption, but I also recognise that at some point in human development you probably need to consume meat products.

 

That's a good question. 

 

Veganism is an ethical stance against the unnecessary exploitation of animals. This extends to diet. Thus, a vegan eats a plant-based diet. However, just eating a plant-based diet doesn't necessarily mean that you're living in alignment with vegan principles (e.g. you could eat a plant-based diet, but still hunt or go to a 'wild animal' circus). 

 

Veganism IS NOT a diet. 

 

It's good that you've thought about the treatment of animals. I would have to disagree with your last paragraph. You cannot ethically consume an animal's body. Once you accept that animals are sentient beings here with us, not for us, one cannot 'ethically' eat their dismembered bodies or the products of their death.  

 

Your last sentence - are you referring to human history or an individual's lifetime? 

[Stretch]

 

 

Once you accept that animals are sentient beings here with us, not for us,

But...Why are we differentiated from any other carnivore? An eland is there for and with a lion.. Why can't it be the same for us?

[Odinson]

But...Why are we differentiated from any other carnivore? An eland is there for and with a lion.. Why can't it be the same for us?

 

Without human intervention, a pride of lions can live in harmony with the herbivores they predate on, never taking more than what is necessary. Lions are sustained on the herbivores, ensuring that their numbers do not overwhelm the lands. Humans can't do that. We disrupt every natural environment we enter. 

 

Further, a lion is an obligate carnivore. Humans aren't. We can live a long and healthy life on a plant-based diet. We have no need to eat animals. 

 

Lastly, have you ever seen a lion breed gazelle for their food? 

Edited August 2, 2019 by Odinson

[Stretch]

Without human intervention, a pride of lions can live in harmony with the herbivores they predate on, never taking more than what is necessary. Lions are sustained on the herbivores, ensuring that their numbers do not overwhelm the lands. Humans can't do that. We disrupt every natural environment we enter.

 

Further, a lion is an obligate carnivore. Humans aren't. We can live a long and healthy life on a plant-based diet. We have no need to eat animals.

 

Lastly, have you ever seen a lion breed gazelle for their food?

The lion eats meat only because there's not another lion lurking around saying that he should eat grass [emoji6]