180 Heart Rate MAF Training

[The Ouzo]

7 minutes ago, love2fly said:

Something I forgot to mention is that the initial MAF training I read mentioned that we generally go to hard on the Easy days, and too easy on the Hard days - This was me mostly although no really easy days, just trying to grind all the time and not making any progress. Thus where I think I'm headed is to ride 80% of my distance/time at MAF and do around 20% at a higher intensity.

It is a hard battle, I have configured a screen on my garmin to show me nothing else but HR, hoping to not be tempted by a low speed reading as this is generally what makes me up the pace.

[Frosty]

35 minutes ago, love2fly said:

Something I forgot to mention is that the initial MAF training I read mentioned that we generally go to hard on the Easy days, and too easy on the Hard days - This was me mostly although no really easy days, just trying to grind all the time and not making any progress. Thus where I think I'm headed is to ride 80% of my distance/time at MAF and do around 20% at a higher intensity.

Polarised training is essentially the same. The easy rides are easy, but need volume to see adaptation. An hour is not long enough.

That is why Sweet Spot became popular, hard enough to illicit adaptation, but short enough to allow recovery before the next session.

[dalem44]

I started MAF training last year in both running and cycling. Running is a new sport to me and I am not conditioned to run whatsoever so trying to run at a max of 144bpm ended up being quite frustrating. I was walking more than running and I felt like I wasn't doing enough. 

After about a 3 months of it with incorporating MAF into my cycling, I started to see results. They weren't groundbreaking but my endurance in both sports improved dramatically. I went from running 5kms to 21kms, I was riding with my heart rate below the 144bpm limit without event trying to keep it down. I would recover way faster after sprints and I generally felt better after exercise. 

I didn't however follow the MAF training religiously....

I would incorporate 1 HIIT session per week on the bike and try my best to achieve a polarized plan. 

It does work but you have to be disciplined and willing to go really slow. 

A great way to quantify your results/progress is as follows:

Run - Take note of when your heart rate reaches the MAF max at the start of each and every run when running at a medium pace

Ride - Choose a flat route on Zwift or outdoors and ride for the full duration with your heart rate at the MAF max and record your distance over 30 minutes. Do this once a month

You will see the small victories everytime you do it.

 

Just to add, I didnt do any rides longer that 2 hours when training below 144bpm. 

 

[_David_]

13 minutes ago, dalem44 said:

I started MAF training last year in both running and cycling. Running is a new sport to me and I am not conditioned to run whatsoever so trying to run at a max of 144bpm ended up being quite frustrating. I was walking more than running and I felt like I wasn't doing enough. 

After about a 3 months of it with incorporating MAF into my cycling, I started to see results. They weren't groundbreaking but my endurance in both sports improved dramatically. I went from running 5kms to 21kms, I was riding with my heart rate below the 144bpm limit without event trying to keep it down. I would recover way faster after sprints and I generally felt better after exercise. 

I didn't however follow the MAF training religiously....

I would incorporate 1 HIIT session per week on the bike and try my best to achieve a polarized plan. 

It does work but you have to be disciplined and willing to go really slow. 

A great way to quantify your results/progress is as follows:

Run - Take note of when your heart rate reaches the MAF max at the start of each and every run when running at a medium pace

Ride - Choose a flat route on Zwift or outdoors and ride for the full duration with your heart rate at the MAF max and record your distance over 30 minutes. Do this once a month

You will see the small victories everytime you do it.

 

Just to add, I didnt do any rides longer that 2 hours when training below 144bpm. 

 

Do you follow the MAF food guidelines as well?

[Jay F]

Just my short anecdotal evidence on MAF here. 

In May 2020, when we were first let out onto the streets to train, I did about 140km of road running using the MAF method. Incredibly frustrating to begin with, but after one month of consistency I was able to take 20 minutes off of my PB for a 21km. 

And then life happened and I didn't keep up with the training at all. 

[dalem44]

49 minutes ago, _David_ said:

Do you follow the MAF food guidelines as well?

No not really. I enjoy some of the good things like chocolates and beer.

The MAF training that I mentioned is not 100% in line with his plan because of my additional high intensity workouts. I personally don't feel like training at your MAF limit ONLY, will have the highest benefits. Mixing it up like I mentioned above seems to condition your body for both the endurance and high intensity that would be experienced come race day. 

I also managed to lose ~4kg by using this method

[Frosty]

1 hour ago, dalem44 said:

I started MAF training last year in both running and cycling. Running is a new sport to me and I am not conditioned to run whatsoever so trying to run at a max of 144bpm ended up being quite frustrating. I was walking more than running and I felt like I wasn't doing enough. 

After about a 3 months of it with incorporating MAF into my cycling, I started to see results. They weren't groundbreaking but my endurance in both sports improved dramatically. I went from running 5kms to 21kms, I was riding with my heart rate below the 144bpm limit without event trying to keep it down. I would recover way faster after sprints and I generally felt better after exercise. 

I didn't however follow the MAF training religiously....

I would incorporate 1 HIIT session per week on the bike and try my best to achieve a polarized plan. 

It does work but you have to be disciplined and willing to go really slow. 

A great way to quantify your results/progress is as follows:

Run - Take note of when your heart rate reaches the MAF max at the start of each and every run when running at a medium pace

Ride - Choose a flat route on Zwift or outdoors and ride for the full duration with your heart rate at the MAF max and record your distance over 30 minutes. Do this once a month

You will see the small victories everytime you do it.

 

Just to add, I didnt do any rides longer that 2 hours when training below 144bpm. 

 

What was your max distance cycling (training or event)? Not your 2 hour rides below MAF, but in general. 

And what were you training for? Just fun, or for specific events.

[_David_]

30 minutes ago, dalem44 said:

No not really. I enjoy some of the good things like chocolates and beer.

Nothing wrong with that! 

[dalem44]

11 minutes ago, Frosty said:

What was your max distance cycling (training or event)? Not your 2 hour rides below MAF, but in general. 

And what were you training for? Just fun, or for specific events.

Max ride was 70km MTB - I do not ride road
Not training for anything specific, just seeing what is achievable with the MAF method and I still do an improvised version to this day. I am however trying a new approach with a sort of progressive overload in 3 week blocks but still maintaining the MAF ideology.

 

6 minutes ago, _David_ said:

Nothing wrong with that! 

Nothing at all....

[Frosty]

26 minutes ago, dalem44 said:

Max ride was 70km MTB - I do not ride road
Not training for anything specific, just seeing what is achievable with the MAF method and I still do an improvised version to this day. I am however trying a new approach with a sort of progressive overload in 3 week blocks but still maintaining the MAF ideology.

 

Nothing at all....

As _david_ said, nothing wrong with that. Low intensity work is good aerobic training, and that’s a good base to have. The added HIT training just makes getting up the hills a little easier.

 

Slightly off track, but relevant. Another coach was saying that his one athlete wasn’t a sprinter, so why do sprint work. Rather focus one your limiters for the type of event you’re going to do.

[Yyyy]

7 hours ago, tsdutweet said:

As frustrating as MAF is, it does work, but you need to stick to it for at least 6 months. We are so conditioned to red line our ALL our rides and the one thing I did learn with my MAF training is that it is ok to slow down and enjoy the ride and surroundings. 

Best is when you are able to climb to the top of Irish in Jonkershoek at a Max HR of 144 and feel super fresh for the downhill. 

to what level of Irish and how long did it take you to get to the top???

[Frosty]

2 hours ago, dalem44 said:

Ride - Choose a flat route on Zwift or outdoors and ride for the full duration with your heart rate at the MAF max and record your distance over 30 minutes. Do this once a month

You will see the small victories everytime you do it.

To echo the above:

 

For those with a power meter, or smart trainer with power. You can do any distance/duration, while riding at, or just below, your MAF max. You should see an improvement in the power you can put out while still riding at the same HR.

The metric will be EF: efficiency factor (normalised power / avg HR).
The higher the number, the better you are (more efficient). Power/HR uses Avg. Power instead of Normalised power for EF. If you're on an IDT and don't stop pedalling for the entire workout, average power and normalised power will be very close.

Another metric, VI: Variability Index (Normalised Power / Avg. Power) where getting as close to 1.0 is the goal for a session like this.

Can one do it in ERG mode?
Yes, initially to get the "feel" for how it should feel, but then a few workouts later move to resistance mode and actually feel how easy it should be.

This is my go to workout when I am feeling a little off, like this week. If the number drops, and it feels harder than it should, I know I need more recovery. I'll then push a harder workout out by one or more day(s). I would do this weekly at the start of a new training cycle, then move it out to two weeks and eventually monthly once I'm close to the end of Base & Build (on a traditional plan).

[love2fly]

Thanks for all the contributions, very much appreciated.

[DAcaveman]

The MAF... It works man. My father-in-law uses it, won the Grandmasters in J2C a few years back that way. I used it too, but went with a coach for a bit and trained NOT Maf, intervals like a possessed man. Burned myself right the flip out. I think a mix of Maf mindset and serious intervals (like 2 to 4 times a month only) might be best for me. It's a journey. I do not regret any of it. It's about discovering what works for you, very much the 'enjoy the ride' vibe. Lots of wisdom in the Maf Method.

Edited February 10, 2022 by DAcaveman

[The Ouzo]

On 2/10/2022 at 12:16 PM, ouzo said:

It is a hard battle, I have configured a screen on my garmin to show me nothing else but HR, hoping to not be tempted by a low speed reading as this is generally what makes me up the pace.

With this screen up on my Garmin I managed a 70km ride without going higher than Zone 2, and even Zone 2 I only spent 8 minutes there with the rest in Zone 1

[dalem44]

1 hour ago, ouzo said:

With this screen up on my Garmin I managed a 70km ride without going higher than Zone 2, and even Zone 2 I only spent 8 minutes there with the rest in Zone 1

How did you feel on the ride? Was it very slow?