lagosloonie Posted March 10, 2011 Author Posted March 10, 2011 I have been away for a while - here are the photographs requested by hubbers. As you can see, there is absolutely no evidence of a strike or impact in the region of the depression. The tube has folded almost certainly as a result of a force transmitted through the head. My argument will always be that this frame has not received an impact large enough to destroy a top-level frame. I have ridden fast, rocky downhills, small dropoffs (XC type) and that's about it. I can't see how you can risk this frame on a race like the Attakwas, for example.
lagosloonie Posted March 10, 2011 Author Posted March 10, 2011 Thanks for all the feedback Lagosloonie. My (reasoned) opinion at this point is that it's a design flaw which has caused a failure via a much smaller impact than which would usually be required to do similar damage. As Chickenrun4me has noted, frames usually "buckle" in this spot when confronted by a serious head-on impact to the fork. In thise case however, the impact may not have been all that serious, it was just enough due the weakened structure caused by the design. That's my opinion. I think Martin has hit the nail on the head here - the frame is just not up to hard riding - don't buy one if it has a dent in the downtube.
MTB_Roadie Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 that looks like accident damage...hit something straight from the front or a accident, just dont look like they will design a frame like that....
Caerus Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 that looks like accident damage...hit something straight from the front or a accident, just dont look like they will design a frame like that.... Did you not read the whole thread? The frames DO come like that.
Capricorn Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 I still think that looks like a factory 'dent' made worse by some of buckling force. The problem is not so much the impact that caused the buckling, as opposed to what I still think is a factory-installed defect-waiting_to_happen. If however, the impact was sufficient to cause the denting, then I'm pretty sure that front wheel is taco'd. If not, then what's the brand and model of that wheel, cos I would like to buy a few..
Caerus Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 I still think that looks like a factory 'dent' made worse by some of buckling force. The problem is not so much the impact that caused the buckling, as opposed to what I still think is a factory-installed defect-waiting_to_happen. If however, the impact was sufficient to cause the denting, then I'm pretty sure that front wheel is taco'd. If not, then what's the brand and model of that wheel, cos I would like to buy a few.. Could have been over a period of time to,maybe a few small drop offs here, a jump there. All slowly making the "dent" buckle.
Capricorn Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 I'm not sure about that Caerus, as the metal has it's own elastic range, not mention the damping properties of the front fork and the tires and rim itself to prevent translation of those small forces you mentioned, onto the frame. Also, what you are suggesting is fatigue failure, and i'm not sure given all the damping previously mentioned, the force of those small hits are large enough, or of sufficient frequency to result in fatigue failure. but litespeed said it's impact damage, so it must be so.
Caerus Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 I'm not sure about that Caerus, as the metal has it's own elastic range, not mention the damping properties of the front fork and the tires and rim itself to prevent translation of those small forces you mentioned, onto the frame. Also, what you are suggesting is fatigue failure, and i'm not sure given all the damping previously mentioned, the force of those small hits are large enough, or of sufficient frequency to result in fatigue failure. but litespeed said it's impact damage, so it must be so. I hear what you are saying, but with that "dent" already in the frame, couldn't any small impact, make it worse. Well look at carbon, very strong, yet you impact at the wrong angle and bye bye carbon. Could be a Friday afternoon before a long weekend frame.
lagosloonie Posted March 10, 2011 Author Posted March 10, 2011 The wheels were DT Swiss XR4.1. I still run tubes and i have NEVER pinch flatted the front, not on any bike at any time.
lagosloonie Posted March 10, 2011 Author Posted March 10, 2011 whoops - i lied - just remembered hitting a pothole and endo'ing as a result during a rainstorm on the Lekki Expressway in Lagos some years back. That did the front.
divernick Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 I reckon your front brakes are too powerful for the frame....I'm sticking to v-brakes!
Capricorn Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 lol lagosloonie; that pothole explains your nickname Caerus: u know carbon is special. look at it wrong and it will delaminate, and slap u silly in the process. The proof for all our conjecturing that it's a factory flaw that dent, is in the number of returns this specific has had over it's product lifecycle, and reasons for litespeed discontinuing the 'dent' from future models. Accomodate wheel travel? what rubbish design.
MTB_Roadie Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 Did you not read the whole thread? The frames DO come like that. The square part inside the 'factory dent'....u can clearly see that was made with some force as the frame bent in various ways....a factroy dent will be nice and smooth....and edges will be the same.... no offence if I had a company and receieved that as a warranty I will also not pay out.....
Grebel Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 I hear what you are saying, but with that "dent" already in the frame, couldn't any small impact, make it worse. Well look at carbon, very strong, yet you impact at the wrong angle and bye bye carbon. Could be a Friday afternoon before a long weekend frame. I can't see the benefits of putting a "dent" in a perfectly structurally sound round tube other that for aesthetics. If that is the case the introduction of the dent would immediately create a weak spot that would be succeptible to failure. If they say that it is there for suspension clearance, then somebody in their design office f@cked up. I would have been fired for that! It's like designing a sports car and cutting away the top of the fender for suspension clearance... I think not. IMHO of course
ZakAttak Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 Ever take an aluminium cooldrink can, put a slight dent in the side then step on the top to crush the top and bottom together? Well, IMO, the above is impact damage, but not from direct impact into the dent, but more a force applied to the ends of the tube.... This is a MTB? If so, MTB trails are never smooth and all that bumps can cause a Manufacturers Dent to fail catastrophically in this manner, same as the above Aluminium can scenario...
Caerus Posted March 10, 2011 Posted March 10, 2011 The square part inside the 'factory dent'....u can clearly see that was made with some force as the frame bent in various ways....a factroy dent will be nice and smooth....and edges will be the same.... no offence if I had a company and receieved that as a warranty I will also not pay out..... I'm not disputing that.
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