Rider Down

[Tiny K]

But that's what track is about...no? Seriously, from the three pics I've seen, it looks like he is pushing away a rider who is about to cut into him, rather than pulling someone down.

 

but then surely you push the rider away by his body, and not by grabbing onto his steering mechanism?

[Java001]

As a team manager - I hope not Pheiffer's - should you even be commenting on this while it is still being sorted out by CSA?

 

Forget commenting, starting a thread that trashes the youngster without the benefit of his response is worse form from a team manager.

 

It will not change what happened on the track - I would still like to hear what went on before to cause this reaction from Daniels, stuff doesn't happen for no reason all that often - but this thread could influence the outcome of a hearing if your ill-advised posting here is used by Daniels. He can rightfully feel grumpy he is being found guilty in his absence here.

 

Not clever, IMHO. Let the correct processes do their thing.

 

onetrackmind, I can confirm that I am in not in any way involved with either Pheiffer or Daniels or their teams, families, sponsors etc.

 

I do however have riders that compete against both and beat them, so would have derived no personal benefit by Daniels'suspension. I also have a few U16’s to which these Juniors are supposed to be role models. As such my first responsibility is towards the riders and their parents & their safety on and off the track. CSA, if they can be trusted to sort this out, comes 2nd. As aptly put by a few hubbers, NOTHING that happened before can be used as excuse – stuff is sometimes caused for no particular reason at all ……all you need is a k*k attitude and to this you add its normal bedmates – inferiority complex, parents who live through their children, a massive sense of entitlement e.t.c.. Once you have stirred these ingredients together, you add money to it – not their own money, but sponsor money, CSA money ………

I for one have a problem that my CSA license fees are used to in any way subsidise guys like Daniels.

 

I have absolutely no problem sharing these events on a public forum such as the Hub

and after first hand witnessing the entire event and it’s aftermath, also have absolutely no problem mentioning the youngster’s name and that of his family. If Daniels and his family are on the Hub, they are obviously more than welcome to join the discussion. As to him feeling grumpy, language usage restrictions prevent me from commenting!

 

As earlier indicated, I witnessed the incident and the purpose of my posting was to create awareness, inform hubbers and stimulate a debate not so much about the incident, but rather guage the feeling of the cycling community represented on the Hub as to a suitable punishment. I was told in CT by WP team managers that CSA would, for a variety of reasons, be hesitant to act against Daniels and his vuilbek family, and I could simply not accept this; so no, I am not prepared to sit back as you put it and “let the correct processes do their thing”.

 

I believe that I will in fact bring cycling and specifically track cycling into even bigger disrepute than this rider and his family already have, if I don’t speak up! Without sounding melodramatic, history shows that a lot of atrocities were committed, because the peaceful majority sat back and did nothing.

 

We have numerous posts normally greeted with outrage by Hubbers, advising of cyclists knocked down by cars/taxis or MTB’s being attacked. Recently a photo of the alleged perpetrator’s caught by the Police were even posted on the Hub! I cannot remember a single post that asked us to wait for a response from the perpetrators or to cease making any comments until these guys were found guilty in a Court Of Law?

 

Thanks Thornman, ccc2, wattsup, Mallo, Frank Tank, CyclingLegs, MTB_Roadie etc. for adding to the info – I heard that young Daniels had a bit of a reputation, but I am not from Cape Town and had no idea as to the extent thereof and how long it has already been tolerated.

 

Yes, after viewing the footage indeed also heard that no appeal lodged by Daniels'manager – I should perhaps have added this earlier, to prevent hubbers from posting about “the other side of the story” etc.

Things have already become hushed, but apparently the CSA hearing will be a disciplinary one to decide not on his guilt that many feel has been established over a period of time, but rather as to what to do with young Daniels and his family.

Edited May 6, 2011 by Java001

[MTB_Roadie]

well said!

[Guest agteros]

Why does no one take the law to this guy? If the cycling bodies are turning a blind eye then sue the chap. Lay charges of assault. Lay charges of damaging others property. I know this country is slack in the law but maybe if he has enough charges against him and his family he might see some jail time. It may be in the future but worth a try??

 

CSA does tend to turn a blind eye to rider safety issues when (future?) money is involved.

A few years (like 2?) there was an incident with a junior and a team cars and a crash.

Said junior suffered injuries, however CSA was not interested as the team car was also a sponsor of a series, even though his dad threatened legal action.

Junior has abandoned cycling in the interim....

[andydude]

Give that man a bells

[ThaStig]

Something tells me that we don't have all the info to make any judgement wrt to this incident. The track is not for sissies/angels and I am sure that if the "Guilty" party pulled the "victim" down without any provocation and if it was his intention to really injure the "innocent" victim (because that is how he is portrayed by the poster)then the wheel will turn and he will receive his just desserts. But if this is not the case then you the poster should be ashamed of yourself for basically assembling a lynch mob for a junior, this is uncool and unfair on the CSA disciplinary structures. Rather allow them to reach their decision instead of pre-empting the outcome. If they don't reach the 'correct'decision based on all the evidence presented then you "might" have a cause to be aggrieved. It also seems that a lot of the comments are based on hearsay, conjecture and supposition. Not guilty until proven so...I in no way condone this type of behaviour but you a manager of juniors should set the example and follow the processes set out for disciplinary issues instead of using a public forum and with all your experience you should know which steps to follow to resolve this issue in the best interests of cycling and not to do anything which would bring the sport into disrepute. I also see that you are very generously naming and shaming the "perpetrator" while being basically anonymous..Not cool

[TNT1]

Something tells me that we don't have all the info to make any judgement wrt to this incident. The track is not for sissies/angels and I am sure that if the "Guilty" party pulled the "victim" down without any provocation and if it was his intention to really injure the "innocent" victim (because that is how he is portrayed by the poster)then the wheel will turn and he will receive his just desserts. But if this is not the case then you the poster should be ashamed of yourself for basically assembling a lynch mob for a junior, this is uncool and unfair on the CSA disciplinary structures. Rather allow them to reach their decision instead of pre-empting the outcome. If they don't reach the 'correct'decision based on all the evidence presented then you "might" have a cause to be aggrieved. It also seems that a lot of the comments are based on hearsay, conjecture and supposition. Not guilty until proven so...I in no way condone this type of behaviour but you a manager of juniors should set the example and follow the processes set out for disciplinary issues instead of using a public forum and with all your experience you should know which steps to follow to resolve this issue in the best interests of cycling and not to do anything which would bring the sport into disrepute. I also see that you are very generously naming and shaming the "perpetrator" while being basically anonymous..Not cool

 

Nice! I vote for thastig. OP, you are the weakest link, you may leave the island.

[The Drongo]

if you are familiar with track cycling then you never take your hands off your handlebars until you have stopped your bike to get off.

 

Ok. My bad. Ffff....t

 

So I take it he took his hands off the bars to get up then?

 

That is hard core, hard-wiring that is! Kinda like the F16 pilot who just can't loose the stick to punch out.

 

Bravo. Tha' man can carry his Ti staple with pride.

[ccc2]

Bradwin Daniels has been included in the Juniors W Champs training squad subject to the outcome of his disciplinary hearing.

and so is the rider that fell and broke a bone.

[fabes]

Bradwin Daniels has been included in the Juniors W Champs training squad subject to the outcome of his disciplinary hearing.

and so is the rider that fell and broke a bone.

I bet nothing will happen to him or his family

[ThaStig]

I bet nothing will happen to him or his family

What has his family got to do with this incident? Let justice follow its course and don't pre-empt the outcome you will have your chance to bleat after the Disciplinary if it doesn't go your way. Both sides will have their opportunity to state their case and hopefully the right decision will be taken based on the evidence. The laaitie obviously has talent and an attitude to boot, yes he should get taken down a notch or two but it must be done within the structures and in a way that does not leave him the excuse to cry "foul" or "lynch mob"; let him state his case. Let me say it again "I don't condone what he is alleged to have done" but he is being found guilty without a trial.

[fabes]

What has his family got to do with this incident? Let justice follow its course and don't pre-empt the outcome you will have your chance to bleat after the Disciplinary if it doesn't go your way. Both sides will have their opportunity to state their case and hopefully the right decision will be taken based on the evidence. The laaitie obviously has talent and an attitude to boot, yes he should get taken down a notch or two but it must be done within the structures and in a way that does not leave him the excuse to cry "foul" or "lynch mob"; let him state his case. Let me say it again "I don't condone what he is alleged to have done" but he is being found guilty without a trial.

 

Based on what has been said in this forum i am allowed to my own opinion. And in my OPINION i think there is enough evidence to prove this kids guilt. And waiting for a disciplinary hearing and the outcome of that hearing means absolutely nothing. There are too many politics in each and every sport in this country. It is a fact that the wrong person with the right skin colour gets away with whatever whenever.

 

So me saying "i bet him and his family will get away with it" is my own opinion and has nothing to do with the outcome of a hearing.

 

I am not involved in track cycling or any cycling club so i have based my opinion on what i have read and seen on this forum. The outcome of the hearing will not affect me.

[ThaStig]

Based on what has been said in this forum i am allowed to my own opinion. And in my OPINION i think there is enough evidence to prove this kids guilt. And waiting for a disciplinary hearing and the outcome of that hearing means absolutely nothing. There are too many politics in each and every sport in this country. It is a fact that the wrong person with the right skin colour gets away with whatever whenever.

 

So me saying "i bet him and his family will get away with it" is my own opinion and has nothing to do with the outcome of a hearing.

 

I am not involved in track cycling or any cycling club so i have based my opinion on what i have read and seen on this forum. The outcome of the hearing will not affect me.

I sincerely hope that you are proven wrong, that justice will prevail. I have noted in my short time on this earth that the wheel does turn and people who have done wrong eventually do get found out no matter what their colour or politics...you can't escape justice.

 

The sooner we stop using colour as a basis/excuse for an argument the better for all of us. It is a fact that in any sport there are people who are "connected" and seem to get away with things but that does not continue forever they are eventually found out for what they are. There are many other parents who are also very fanatical supporters of their "little champions" and inspiring them to "win at all costs", inflating their actual talents. If the little champs don't live up to the expectations all manner of excuses are offered and many of them are just a bunch of spoilt brats. You just have to attend a few races to hear and see this; and this in not only limited to people of one colour or political persuasion.

[fabes]

I agree i do i hope i get proved wrong and the correct measures are taken against this kid.

 

I also agree that sometimes you do get over board parents trying to push their kids in a direction that they never once got to do in the lives and yes the parents end up carrying on worse than kids.

 

However using the colour thing is unfortunately not an excuse anymore its reality. Last year in a club rugby match an innocent child was killed. The club that caused the violence already had an suspended sentence for an previous offence. We were also told to keep quiet until an hearing had taken place. Guess what we still waiting. Why? Its because the club involved is a previously disadvantaged club and because Eastern Province Rugby Unioun had many members of that specific club on the board it got swept under the carpet.

 

I am all for development in this country but when they start using that as excuse to push development athletes into provincial teams just because they previously disadvantaged is just wrong and when they start getting away with everything because they previously disadvantaged is even worse.

 

So lets hope the right punishment is dished out and that wheel you speak of turns.

Edited May 11, 2011 by fabes

[VeloRacer]

I witnessed how crap this laaitie rides first hand. I was there that day when he took down 2 development riders from Velokhaya. They were taken away in a ambulance with neck braces. The second time he was in a CAT 3 bunch where he also almost took down a rider from Kinetic Cycling club. That rider almost punched his teeth out.

[Willehond]

Send your hotshot trackie over here for a couple of crits in Belgium. He will either learn very fast how to behave and thrive amongst the real hardmen or return to Cape Town with his tail between his legs and a passion gap bigger than the Polsmoor ladyboys! Mommy and Daddy won't count for squat when the real riding starts.

 

PS You guys are soft!