Markdeep Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Hi, Can anybody running these forks or know about these forks assist me with a tech Q. This being a dual air version, you have both the + at the top and - at the bottom. According to the little print on the shock it says for my weight 81-90kg I should be running at 120psi on + and - . When I try this setting it is SUPER hard, you literary have to put your body weight on it to make the shock engage. So in normally riding it rattles my hands badly. Now if I soften it to like 70psi and + and - then it feels right. The reason I say this, is on my brothers Bike he has a RockShox Recon Silver which is a single Air, when I add the correct pressure for my weight the shocks feel 100% and so do other air shocks I have tested. I suspecting something may be wrong with this fork, any ideas or should I just send it in for a service? The fork is still quite new though, done less than 100hrs.. Thanks in advance
banna Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Hi, Can anybody running these forks or know about these forks assist me with a tech Q. This being a dual air version, you have both the + at the top and - at the bottom. According to the little print on the shock it says for my weight 81-90kg I should be running at 120psi on + and - . When I try this setting it is SUPER hard, you literary have to put your body weight on it to make the shock engage. So in normally riding it rattles my hands badly. Now if I soften it to like 70psi and + and - then it feels right. The reason I say this, is on my brothers Bike he has a RockShox Recon Silver which is a single Air, when I add the correct pressure for my weight the shocks feel 100% and so do other air shocks I have tested. I suspecting something may be wrong with this fork, any ideas or should I just send it in for a service? The fork is still quite new though, done less than 100hrs.. Thanks in advance Nope boet. That's the way a SID rides. Rock hard. I replaced mine with a Fox F120. Much softer ride.
NotSoBigBen Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Well only advice I can give is that we normally run the - air 10psi lower than the + .... Why not just lower it by 10PSI till you get closer to the 'feel' you want? Their chart is only a guideline
AndreZA Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Only use those markings as an reference. Let air out untill you get about 20-30% sag when you sit on the bike.
NotSoBigBen Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Nope boet. That's the way a SID rides. Rock hard. I replaced mine with a Fox F120. Much softer ride. Shakes head Whateva ......
banna Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Shakes head Whateva ...... Ha ha! Did I step on a toe perhaps? Dunno boet, I tried everything with my SID and just couldn't get it to perform the way I think a fork should feel. The Fox felt perfect from the first ride. But anyway, I guess it's up to preference. Enjoy your SID!
HammerHed Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Get a cable tie and wrap it around the stanction the smooth part that slides into the bottom of the shock. push the cable tie down so it is touching the bottom of the shock. Now sit on the bike and then get off the bike and look to see how much the shock sagged, the cable tie will be pushed upwhen you sit on the bike and remain where it was pushed to. This movement should be about 20 - 25% of the total movement allowed by the shock. Adjust the amount of air pressure in the fork - & + until you get that amount of sag. Once that is done you will ride nicely on that fork. From my experience I have a Reeba World Cup fork the - & + should be about the same pressure. So its quite fiddly but once you get the setting it will feel good. I hope this helps.
HammerHed Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Shock pressure settings are quite personal, and also variable depending on the terrain. A rough course would require softer settings than a smooth course. Likewise a heavier rider requires more pressure in the shocks to keep the shocks from sagging too much under the riders weight. Saggy shocks change the geometry of the bike. Its all relative to these variables, so there cannot be one setting for everything.
Markdeep Posted July 28, 2011 Author Posted July 28, 2011 Nope boet. That's the way a SID rides. Rock hard. I replaced mine with a Fox F120. Much softer ride. I know they are crazy hard, look its great on the rocky technical downhill stuff but uncomfortable over all.
Markdeep Posted July 28, 2011 Author Posted July 28, 2011 Get a cable tie and wrap it around the stanction the smooth part that slides into the bottom of the shock. push the cable tie down so it is touching the bottom of the shock. Now sit on the bike and then get off the bike and look to see how much the shock sagged, the cable tie will be pushed upwhen you sit on the bike and remain where it was pushed to. This movement should be about 20 - 25% of the total movement allowed by the shock. Adjust the amount of air pressure in the fork - & + until you get that amount of sag. Once that is done you will ride nicely on that fork. From my experience I have a Reeba World Cup fork the - & + should be about the same pressure. So its quite fiddly but once you get the setting it will feel good. I hope this helps. Thanks for the help, been trying to find this Nirvana setting but not 100% yet, I was just a little concerned that it feels good to me at like 40Psi below what the chart recommends. Will do the sag test tonight, thks again.
riaanb Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Got the same fork. Also found the recommended setting to be way too hard and ride it softer than recommended. Fox does feel more comfortable - I have to admit.
david16v Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Thanks for the help, been trying to find this Nirvana setting but not 100% yet, I was just a little concerned that it feels good to me at like 40Psi below what the chart recommends. Will do the sag test tonight, thks again. Those printed settings are incorrect. I have the SID Race and weigh 74kg, pressure set to 60psi/60psi. You have to set according to the 20-25% sag!! Plus side of Rockshox SID over FOX:1) SID much lighter!2) Lock-out on SID does not lock out 100% and therefore if a fairly big ditch/bump is hit it will take up the slack without damaging your shock, whereas the FOX lockouts 100% (no budging at all) and if the same situation above happens to the FOX the damping/lockout system (seals) could be damaged! Personal preference at the end of the day!If i was to upgrade from my SID it would be to a Cannondale for the Lefty!
AndreZA Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 2) Lock-out on SID does not lock out 100% and therefore if a fairly big ditch/bump is hit it will take up the slack without damaging your shock, whereas the FOX lockouts 100% (no budging at all) and if the same situation above happens to the FOX the damping/lockout system (seals) could be damaged! depending on model. My RLC you can adjust how hard the bump needs to be before the lock-out releases.
Brighter-Lights Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 With all respect to 'incorrect opinions' and disrespectful replies above: RS Sid's are not hard at all if maintained or set up correctly, in fact, few forks are as plush! The pressure table on the fork as recommended by RS normally feels much too hard. Because... Oil level in the right (damper) leg partly determines the amount of compression needed (in the left leg) to make the fork ride around the chosen sag percentage mark. On new SIDs is very easy to 'monitor' sag by looking down at the calibration marks while riding. IMO, setting sag as recommended by most, leaning against a wall while sitting on the bike doesn't give an accurate measurement as initial stiction plays an important role here and could result in a 'false' setting. Brand new SID WC (blue one) and 3 Sid Races I accuired didn't have correct oil volumes and some had nothing. Before these I had older generation Sid's and knew that they didn't come with oil from the factory so I serviced them before riding them. Let me explain... The SID Races had too much oil in the right leg, adding to the compression curve and recommended pressures on the left leg were way too hard for my 70kg... At that time I pumped new SIDs rider weight over rider weight, + or - a bit at the negative chamber. But... after replacing all the oil in the right leg and adding to the correct level, the indicated pressures were much more realistic for good riding fork, hitting 80% travel on harder hits. This changed from 70/65 psi for my 70kg to 100/90, getting the same feel, same sag and same amount of travel on big holes. 120/120 for a 90kg rider should not feel too hard at all if everything is in order. Are you capable of disassembling the fork? I highly recommend to get the tools (long 10mm socket and plastic hammer) and learn to do it yourself as these forks are very simple and easy to maintain properly. Step by Step Pdf's are on the RS website. I would take the fork apart and dump all oil and start from scratch, but if not possible, here's what I would do: 1) with the bike standing upright, drop some fork oil, or even gearbox oil - 1 or 2 drops on the front side of the stanchoin (about 30mm above the wiper rim) and let it run down to the rim of the wiper, and then backwards of the wiper, (fork is at an angle so oil wil slowly run downwards to the back of the wiper) compress and release the fork once - dirt hidden on the edge of the wipers will have lifted and sit on the stanchoin - wipe off with soft cloth. Repeat 3-5 times. This will clear most of the crud, and also lubricate the stanchoins to some degree. If the fork's upper bushes and foamrings were dry, this step will dramatically increase fork response - remember that any kind of resistance adds to the spring rate = harder feel with the same air pressure. I've seen SIDs that could barely move, (new generation ones) that's been serviced by bike shops! 2) deflate + and - air, set rebound and compression damping to the least amount possible - make sure it's UNLOCKED! and cycle the fork up and down... This should be totally stiction free, and check how much travel the fork achieves when compressed all the way. If the fork doesn't achieve at least 95% travel, something is in the way. That could be too much oil in the right leg (damping) or too much oil in the lower legs (lubricating) and oil can't compress - with these forks, it's very important to have the foam rings soaked + having enough oil in the lowers for lubrication - if THAT is properly maintained, the forks feels like your're floating on air. Very fast responding and smooth through the travel. Next... 3) Remove the valve cores with a core removal tool and make sure they are good and sealing. A negative that's leaking may also make the fork feel VERY VERY hard, as you esentially have i.e. 100 top, 0 bottom. Then pump the + chamber to 100, and then the negative to 95 psi. When doing this, it's VERY important - crucial, to properly detatch the pump nozzle, as air can very easily leak out when detatching. In case of the negative, which is a very small chamber, a quick psssssst can be 30% of air in it.... resulting in a false impression of pressure inside... you pump it 100 and leak 40% and think it's 100... in reality, the underinflated negative will make the fork feel MUCH too hard. I use a Risse Racing pump with seperate atachment chamber which cannot leak air while taking it off... many pumps work like this. First do the above and make very sure your pump is ok and that you're not spilling air while detatching the fitting... especially at the negative, because a 100 psi + 100 psi negative, which lost 30% while detatching, will make the fork feel MUCH harder than 100... Tell me your findings and I'll guide you further -> checking oil in the lower legs and foam rings + making sure oil level in the right leg (damping side) is correct.
Nobody Posted July 28, 2011 Posted July 28, 2011 Lat all the air out of the fork, - chamber first. (watch the oil doesnt spray on your rotors) Take your weight and convert to pounds(weight X 2.2), Divide by 2 (almost same weight) and that is the pressure you need for + air. Check the SAG (Due to different riding styles).Make the - chamber 5 - 10 psi less. This is a starting point and you will have to play around.
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