davetapson Posted December 8, 2011 Share I do know that his wife doesn't like the fresh farm stuff… Fresh farm stuff can be a bit too 'real'... :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davetapson Posted December 8, 2011 Share Ok, you made your point. No go and ride off your excess of Christmas lunch and then go attend to your cows ! Well said that man. But I've had a beer, or possibly two, so hear me out... The next argument of course is about genetically modified 'GM' crops, esp. Soyabeans... Monsanto created 'Roundup' resistant Soyabeans. Roundup (also manufactured by Monsanto) is a weed (i.e. plant) killer that kills any plant, one time, no questions asked, thankyou very much. So you plant your Roundup resistant crop, and when the weeds start coming up and smothering your crop, you blitz them with Roundup, which is cheaper than other forms of weed control - by far. And because you've planted Roundup resistant soyabeans, they don't die. Why don't they die? They've stored the Roundup in structures called vacuoles. So, when you eat your Soy, in whatever form you choose (Tofu, Soy powder), you're scarfing down all the Roundup all nicely stored safely away by your Roundup resistant crop. Now, comes the interesting part. Some will argue that Roundup has no effect on animals (and hopefully humans, humans being animals). Some, and the conspiracy theories abound, that animals 'thrive less well' on 'GM' crops. As in 'a lot less well'. There is anecdotal evidence of Monsanto getting extremely heavy handed on research departments that persue this kind of research. Makes you think, ne'? I'm outta here. Enjoy your Thursday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodbadugly Posted December 8, 2011 Share I spend quite a long time in the dairy industry when living abroad, its a fact, and especially in south africa, that the hormone levels in cows r extremely high. A cow can only be milked when its pregnant, they milk cows 365 days of the year, cows r not pregnant for that long. So a lot of research has been done and if you look at the fact that RBST hormone is not any longer given to the cows it does not matter, as from generation to generation the high hormone levels have carried across. If you look at a Woolworths Milk label as an example and this one I photographed, see below. Its a very interesting statement "Free from added RBST hormone" BUT they cannot say its totally free from the hormone. Bottom line cows milk today is shocking, and it was never meant for human consumption. Goats milk, soya or rice milk from a health perspective is far healthier. Looking at the alternatives, goats milk is best, rice milk is unfortunately processed, and can be fattening, soya is the next best alternative, but soya has quite a few advantages, especially if its an isolate. It contains all the essential and nonessential amino's, no other protein naturally contains this. Also science has shown that soya contains phytoestrogens, which bind naturally to the estrogen receptors in the body and its shown to decrease the risk of cancer. As I tell my clients natural is best, we were born to live off the land, Abraham had goats in the desert NOT cows and there were no processed foods. What most people r consuming today is really a health risk, and one should always go back to basics, to keep it as simple and natural as possible. So my proteins of choice are soya or albumen, but soya comes first, I dont take anything which is an animal derivative purely because I dont trust the source of it, and i have seen with my own eyes what goes on behind the scenes. Remember guys health first.I think you are just trying to split hairs.I smell bad science when I read the words "science has shown" without the mention of the proper article/paper.phyto oestrogens? Last time I looked oestrogens were FEMALE hormones. And that I am not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDW Posted December 8, 2011 Share I think you are just trying to split hairs.I smell bad science when I read the words "science has shown" without the mention of the proper article/paper.phyto oestrogens? Last time I looked oestrogens were FEMALE hormones. And that I am not.Friend u obviously dont understand physiology then, estrogen is found in men, just as testosterone is found in women, it might not be the dominant hormone but its present. Phytoestrogens can actually reduce the risk of prostate cancer, of course thats a man thing is it not? there r plenty of papers on the subject. later m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodbadugly Posted December 9, 2011 Share Friend u obviously dont understand physiology then, estrogen is found in men, just as testosterone is found in women, it might not be the dominant hormone but its present. Phytoestrogens can actually reduce the risk of prostate cancer, of course thats a man thing is it not? there r plenty of papers on the subject. later mWhat makes you an expert? Google Guru does not count. Take care when answering...For the same money that you claim milk is bad because of hormones (and Woolies claims their milk is free), others might claim that soy bean oil can be used to fuel dielsel engines. Can you really say that yor soy milk is free of that oil? Or of pesticides and glifosate? Or not genetically modified?Carefull when you split hairs.And why would plant (phyto) oestrogens be better than human oestrogen? I am not some kind of plant.Have a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davetapson Posted December 9, 2011 Share Ha! For those that love to say 'Scientists say...' and 'Scientist proved...'. Seems scientists can be bought... Scientific fraudOn two occasions, the United States EPA has caught scientists deliberately falsifying test results at research laboratories hired by Monsanto to study glyphosate.[91][92][93] In the first incident, involving Industrial Biotest Laboratories (IBT), an EPA reviewer stated, after finding "routine falsification of data", it was "hard to believe the scientific integrity of the studies when they said they took specimens of the uterus from male rabbits".[94][95][96] In the second incident of falsifying test results in 1991, the owner of the lab (Craven Labs), and three employees were indicted on 20 felony counts, the owner was sentenced to five years in prison and fined US$50,000, the lab was fined $15.5 million and ordered to pay $3.7 million in restitution.[97][98] Craven laboratories performed studies for 262 pesticide companies, including Monsanto.(Wikepedia) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDW Posted December 9, 2011 Share What makes you an expert? Google Guru does not count. Take care when answering...For the same money that you claim milk is bad because of hormones (and Woolies claims their milk is free), others might claim that soy bean oil can be used to fuel dielsel engines. Can you really say that yor soy milk is free of that oil? Or of pesticides and glifosate? Or not genetically modified?Carefull when you split hairs.And why would plant (phyto) oestrogens be better than human oestrogen? I am not some kind of plant.Have a nice day.Nutrition is my field of expertise and physiology, i have a masters in clinical nutrition plus a few others, but guys i am not here to argue or fight, there ar emany schools of thought, and you are 1000% correct i dont just buy any soya, i need certification i want the source and the process, i am not knocking milk as recovery, i just in my own opinion from a lot of the research been done feel thats its suitable for human consumption, plants do have a lot of advantages aside from the protein etc, there are many minerals and vitamins which are advantageous. I think the point of this discussion is not to knock one of the other but to maybe open discussion. The common point here is and i agree whether plant, or animal whatever you are consuming the retailers are very difficult to trust. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted December 9, 2011 Share MDW, I welcome your inputs.Very useful. Please continue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zula Posted December 9, 2011 Share Wow this is interesting, and something that I to feel very strongly about. There is no denying it, the human race has grown so exponentially quickly over the past few years that no matter how much food producers try, there is no way of keeping up with demand other than using modern methods of manufacture which unfortunately dont take human heatlh in consideration. Yes there are authorities who monitor the levels of chemicals in our food, but I dont trust them as people/corporations are easily corruptible. Let's look at the humble chicken. A few generations ago, lets say 3, chicken was a treat. My grandparents and their parents used to eat chicken at most once or twice a week because of its lack of availability and high price. Today, chicken is a staple in many households. So what has changed? Clearly demand went through the roof and the chicken famers had to mae a plan to keep up. So what did they do? Introducing battery farming. Chickens live in a coop which has a few hundred of them in the same place. They are fed food which not only contains hormones but also beef and chicken! How siff is that? There are strong lights which are turned on at least 4 times a day to simulate daylight and get the chickens to eat and thus grow quicker. The result is that the majority of the poultry we eat has had the furthest thing from a natural life and is generally slaughtered around 4 months old. Now I ask you with tears in my eyes, surely this is unhealthy not to mention HIGHLY UNETHICAL? Onto the subject of hormone induced milk, well I for one surely hope not. I love milk and have a bowl of all bran flakes and raisins with 2% milk everyday during the week. I can do what I can but at the end of the day there is an element of trust that we as humans have to place in manufacturers. Its not like a canned item which is loaded with preservatives an E this and E that, its milk FFS. Yes it may not be as GD intended, but there is only so much I am willing to do which includes only eating Elgin chicken! Have a great day peeps and remember its all about what you put in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted December 9, 2011 Share http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-2joTePCbyIE/TdtVIHP4qPI/AAAAAAAAGqg/lGUbj5LY_s4/s1600/animal_like_people-14081.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted December 9, 2011 Share Malt smoothie for me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman Posted December 9, 2011 Share Nutrition is my field of expertise and physiology, i have a masters in clinical nutrition plus a few others, but guys i am not here to argue or fight, there ar emany schools of thought, and you are 1000% correct i dont just buy any soya, i need certification i want the source and the process, i am not knocking milk as recovery, i just in my own opinion from a lot of the research been done feel thats its suitable for human consumption, plants do have a lot of advantages aside from the protein etc, there are many minerals and vitamins which are advantageous. I think the point of this discussion is not to knock one of the other but to maybe open discussion. The common point here is and i agree whether plant, or animal whatever you are consuming the retailers are very difficult to trust. Hi I'm glad to see that you are not here to knock one or the other , 'cause in some of your earlier posts you came across rather hostile towards milk ( without really giving any credible reasoning ) . Milk , being one of the oldest nourishing substances in the world , has been tested to death by science throughout the world . And after all these years , and numerous trials , the overwelming majority of scientists and dieticianists in the world ( and I'm not talking about conspiracists here )see milk as a primary source of nutrition .The bottle of milk you get from your local Spar or P & P has also been tested ( Antibiotics , added water , e-coli , coli , bacteria , butterfat , protein , lactose , total solids , sommatic cell count to name some tests)and is deffinately more scrutinised than 90% of all the other products on their shelves . So , don't think you have to worry to much about having some milk with your Kellogg's in the morning .Not wanting to knock soya here ( we also use soya in our rations for dairy cows ) but cannot say that the same amount of scrutiny is applied to soya .I am also sceptical of finding any certified soya products where they will be able to identify the source , and or distinguish whether it is geneticaly modified . Edited December 9, 2011 by Milkman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topwine Posted December 9, 2011 Share Not wanting to knock soya here ( we also use soya in our rations for dairy cows ) but cannot say that the same amount of scrutiny is applied to soya .I am also sceptical of finding any certified soya products where they will be able to identify the source , and or distinguish whether it is geneticaly modified . Good points, however, I think people sometimes get all worked up too much about genetically modified plants like corn and soya. We as humans are genetically modifying ALL the time and so are plants and other animals naturally ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted December 9, 2011 Share I'll continue with my soya milk, flavoured in strawb or choc. It's tough to find the good stuff.I guess it's about damage limiting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zeepee Posted December 9, 2011 Share I've been using Tapout for the last few months and I must say - never felt better. They have a drink (Electrokick) for on the bike (with protein Ed Hardy vest extract in it) that tastes awesome and has worked like a bomb! There, fixed it Edited December 9, 2011 by zeepee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TNT1 Posted December 9, 2011 Share love milk and have a bowl of all bran flakes and raisins with 2% milk everyday during the week. What's the other 98% made up of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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