Norns Posted January 31, 2012 Posted January 31, 2012 I've got a bee in my bonnet recently: I want to know what cyclists are prepared to do for themselves to create a safer environment for cycling, before asking for someone else to do it for them. Please have a look at the questionnaire I have put together and take a minute to answer some (hopefully all) of the questions. I plan to do something, based on the results, but it depends on how much the community is really prepared to help themselves. Note: Only the comments posted on the questionnaire will be taken into account - none that are posted on the Hub.
Selous Scout (aka LegTrap) Posted February 1, 2012 Posted February 1, 2012 I completed the form but cannot "verify the word"
(Deon) Posted February 1, 2012 Posted February 1, 2012 I've got a bee in my bonnet recently: I want to know what cyclists are prepared to do for themselves to create a safer environment for cycling, before asking for someone else to do it for them. Please have a look at the questionnaire I have put together and take a minute to answer some (hopefully all) of the questions. I plan to do something, based on the results, but it depends on how much the community is really prepared to help themselves. Note: Only the comments posted on the questionnaire will be taken into account - none that are posted on the Hub. Just reading the text on the site, I find this very interesting.. and topical! I am in the position to negotiate trail access with SANParks for Tokai in CT. You thoughts behind the petition are almost an exact copy of the situation I find myself in. Your points of people happily jumping on the bandwagon to petition is spot on. Fine to motivate someone else to make some changes but what are the petitioners themselves prepared to do to help the situation?? I have been asked by a prominent user group in Tokai to develop one of the trails. Since I represent all the trails it should have been easy.. not. All the years of this user group's ignorance to the landowners rules have turned any request into a negotiation. Long story short. Permission was granted but under certain conditions.. everyone agreed and the trail was built. Two months later I am being called in to find out why the conditions aren't being adhered to.. threats to shut down the new trails are being made and all because a few people cannot stick to the rules??!! Cyclists are making it really bad for themselves, it does not matter if it is on the road or the mountain, same people.
Mojoman Posted February 1, 2012 Posted February 1, 2012 Prehaps it will have to go the same way as the 4x4 community, one of these days you will need to have done a course to allow you to make use of the 4x4 trails. Prehaps with a cycling venue there should be some kind of induction course before you can ride the trails?
(Deon) Posted February 1, 2012 Posted February 1, 2012 If the induction involves answering the rules of the road or mountain, then I'd agree, it will go that way. If we act incapable, then we might just be treated that way..
zaShadow Posted February 1, 2012 Posted February 1, 2012 I completed the form but cannot "verify the word" +1
Pappa Bear Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 Prehaps it will have to go the same way as the 4x4 community, one of these days you will need to have done a course to allow you to make use of the 4x4 trails. Prehaps with a cycling venue there should be some kind of induction course before you can ride the trails? Geoff the Ausie did an induction course before you were allowed to ride at Logwoodhaven.... He made it quite clear do not tammper with the trail, do not go against the flow and do not smoke - caught doing any of those and you are out of there.... People obaid him out of respect and not "fear" - after all he made SA's firs bike park.
Pappa Bear Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 Just reading the text on the site, I find this very interesting.. and topical! I am in the position to negotiate trail access with SANParks for Tokai in CT. You thoughts behind the petition are almost an exact copy of the situation I find myself in. Your points of people happily jumping on the bandwagon to petition is spot on. Fine to motivate someone else to make some changes but what are the petitioners themselves prepared to do to help the situation?? I have been asked by a prominent user group in Tokai to develop one of the trails. Since I represent all the trails it should have been easy.. not. All the years of this user group's ignorance to the landowners rules have turned any request into a negotiation. Long story short. Permission was granted but under certain conditions.. everyone agreed and the trail was built. Two months later I am being called in to find out why the conditions aren't being adhered to.. threats to shut down the new trails are being made and all because a few people cannot stick to the rules??!! Cyclists are making it really bad for themselves, it does not matter if it is on the road or the mountain, same people. How do people at Wistler and bike parks elswere "enforce" their rules? Sticking to trails, direction and not tampering?
(Deon) Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 How do people at Wistler and bike parks elswere "enforce" their rules? Sticking to trails, direction and not tampering? They have similar issues, only less of it since the bike parks are already established and caters for the riders' progressing needs.. Our problem is that we cannot move to that level because we cannot move passed respect issues around the negotiating table. You would not disrespect someone and then ask them for a lift home, would you? Well it is happening. Riders are asked to stick to single file and the request is ignored. Then, when we slap bumper stickers everywhere pleading for patience towards cyclists, we scratch our heads at the rage incidents posted online or read in the headlines.. does not make any sense??? Looks like we cannot establish a consensus among cyclists because everyone has their own agenda, FINE, but rules are fact and cannot be ignored!
leet22 Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 Just reading the text on the site, I find this very interesting.. and topical! I am in the position to negotiate trail access with SANParks for Tokai in CT. You thoughts behind the petition are almost an exact copy of the situation I find myself in. Your points of people happily jumping on the bandwagon to petition is spot on. Fine to motivate someone else to make some changes but what are the petitioners themselves prepared to do to help the situation?? I have been asked by a prominent user group in Tokai to develop one of the trails. Since I represent all the trails it should have been easy.. not. All the years of this user group's ignorance to the landowners rules have turned any request into a negotiation. Long story short. Permission was granted but under certain conditions.. everyone agreed and the trail was built. Two months later I am being called in to find out why the conditions aren't being adhered to.. threats to shut down the new trails are being made and all because a few people cannot stick to the rules??!! Cyclists are making it really bad for themselves, it does not matter if it is on the road or the mountain, same people. What track you refering to PoS? the new DH one?
scotty Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 If past history is anything to go by, most Hubbers are mouths no action when it comes to ensuring cycling safety.
(Deon) Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 The DH route in Tokai is a very sensitive topic considering it is planted square in the middle of an ecologically sensitive reserve. You would think just that one fact alone would get the buy in from this user group.. Despite the efforts of the trail managers keeping this route alive, and getting continued access for the part of the route which does not officially exist on the Park map (DH3) you would think the support and respect for the land owner and the efforts for the advocates, from the downhillers would be forthcoming. They have instead proven otherwise and cast such a bad light on themselves..
TNT1 Posted February 2, 2012 Posted February 2, 2012 If past history is anything to go by, most Hubbers are mouths no action when it comes to ensuring cycling safety. Yeah, we should follow the example of this 15 year old from Hong Kong. This is taking action. A 15-year-old boy who killed his mother and sister because he believed there were too many people in the world was ordered to be detained indefinitely in a psychiatric hospital, a Hong Kong news report said on Thursday.http://www.iol.co.za/news/world/teen-kills-mom-sister-to-save-planet-1.1225805
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