Lance Armstrong Banned and Stripped of TDF Titles

[covie]

Once again its the US legal system all he has to do is create reasonable doubt, the case is being built on human testomany and thats the easiest thing to break into a pool of doubt if your laywer is any good, and i assume he has some damn good vultures on retainer.

 

Secondly i can already see his closing arguement: 500 test over many years, they say LA masked the dope, well ladies and gentleman of the jury, some of the samples in the possesion of the authorities are more than 10 years old, did my client enivsage how technology would advance to the point that they can now tell you if you have plasticides in your blood? Why has there never been any traces of these supposed masking agents found in the samples that are still available today, why with all our new technology can we still not find anything untoward in any of these stored samples, simple ladies and gentleman of the jury? You can only convict my client beyond a reasonable doubt, the evidence speak for itself, many cases all for personal gain against my client, 500 tests performed on him like a lab animal, contradictory wittness accounts, ladies and gentleman you cannot find my client guilty since there is only doubt here not to mention reasonable doubt.

[TNT1]

* 5000 tests

[dracs]

Once again its the US legal system all he has to do is create reasonable doubt, the case is being built on human testomany and thats the easiest thing to break into a pool of doubt if your laywer is any good, and i assume he has some damn good vultures on retainer.

 

Secondly i can already see his closing arguement: 500 test over many years, they say LA masked the dope, well ladies and gentleman of the jury, some of the samples in the possesion of the authorities are more than 10 years old, did my client enivsage how technology would advance to the point that they can now tell you if you have plasticides in your blood? Why has there never been any traces of these supposed masking agents found in the samples that are still available today, why with all our new technology can we still not find anything untoward in any of these stored samples, simple ladies and gentleman of the jury? You can only convict my client beyond a reasonable doubt, the evidence speak for itself, many cases all for personal gain against my client, 500 tests performed on him like a lab animal, contradictory wittness accounts, ladies and gentleman you cannot find my client guilty since there is only doubt here not to mention reasonable doubt.

all true if it was the US legal system trying him and preventing him from competing in triathlons in the mean time... the legal case against him was (and still is) dropped remember. Edited June 19, 2012 by dracs

[covie]

all true if it was the US legal system trying him and preventing him from competing in triathlons in the mean time... the legal case against him was (and still is) dropped remember.

 

Jip but his laywer has already made it clear that this is just an attempt to villify LA on the part of the USADA, so all he is going to to is drag the USADA to court to get them to deliver evidence of his cheating beyond a reasonable and if they can't he will more than likely apply for an interndict against them to leave him alone lift his bans and pay him in damages till such time they feel they want to take him to court.

[Wyatt Earp]

Ahem...

 

In one famous instance, Garry Kasparov changed his move against Judit Polgár in 1994 after momentarily letting go of a piece. Kasparov went on to win the game. The tournament officials had video tape proving that his hand left the piece, but refused to release the video evidence and allow Polgár the win. A factor counting against Polgar was that she waited a whole day before complaining, and such claims must be made during the game.

 

http://en.wikipedia....eating_in_chess

 

:whistling:

Close but no EPO, so Gary is still clean, except for having some fast hands.

[Tumbleweed]

dracs, just a point of clarity. It's not the legal system; it's USADA. And it isn't the latter preventing him from competing; it's the triathlon governing body.

 

Mention was made of masking agents. The evidence they're are most probably looking at in the usage and administering component is that of micro-dosing, which Ashenden said gave some credence to Floyd's claims.

 

Other components would include the allegations of a "slush fund" to run USPS's alleged doping programme, which would've been turned up by the federal probe. To have gone ahead with the probe, someone - grudges aside - thought there was a prima facie case. It may not have been enough to try in court, but a USADA panel, and ultimately a CAS sitting may see different.

 

Someone mention "attempted doping". The Basso crime. There is allegations about LA acquiring shares in a company which made blood-replacement products.

 

Like I said earlier, what USADA has is not hearsay, it's anecdotal evidence. And it seems USADA has a lot of it, despite being vague is what it is asking of the respondents. Take Lance's biggest troll, David Walsh. Has Lance been able to successfully dismiss all of the claims the Irishman made against him . No. Yes, Lance won the dispute on which a large portion of his writings about him were based on, but it wouldn't have been enough at the time for USADA to pursue charges against him at the time.

 

I think the house of cards is coming down.

[dracs]

dracs, just a point of clarity. It's not the legal system; it's USADA. And it isn't the latter preventing him from competing; it's the triathlon governing body.

 

ummm but thats what I said...

 

And, not that i said it was the USADA preventing him, but actually it is. WTC are bound by their own constitution to prevent any athlete under investigation from competing. The USADA action directly led to his suspension from ironman competition and not WTC

[Wyatt Earp]

ummm but thats what I said...

 

And, not that i said it was the USADA preventing him, but actually it is. WTC are bound by their own constitution to prevent any athlete under investigation from competing. The USADA action directly led to his suspension from ironman competition and not WTC

 

I understood what you said, it might just be a bitt more challenging for others.

[Tumbleweed]

It's not the USADA, even by extension, that's to blame here. His exclusion from competing in triathlons lies solely at the feet of the WTC. The rule under which he has been excluded has been the topic of discussion as being unfair for a while. There has been a lot of discussion about this rule being scrapped, but the WTC are on record as saying that it couldn't be rescinded mid-season.

 

This maybe a bit beyond the comprehension of some who have posted here.

[Wyatt Earp]

It's not the USADA, even by extension, that's to blame here. His exclusion from competing in triathlons lies solely at the feet of the WTC. The rule under which he has been excluded has been the topic of discussion as being unfair for a while. There has been a lot of discussion about this rule being scrapped, but the WTC are on record as saying that it couldn't be rescinded mid-season.

 

This maybe a bit beyond the comprehension of some who have posted here.

Hahahahahah......woooohhhahahahahaha.

We have all read what you just googled and comprehended it ages ago.

You are just echoing what Drac's has been annoyed by.

[dracs]

It's not the USADA, even by extension, that's to blame here. His exclusion from competing in triathlons lies solely at the feet of the WTC. The rule under which he has been excluded has been the topic of discussion as being unfair for a while. There has been a lot of discussion about this rule being scrapped, but the WTC are on record as saying that it couldn't be rescinded mid-season.

 

This maybe a bit beyond the comprehension of some who have posted here.

Look its semantics but I don't really agree. WTC action is passive - they are simply abiding by something that is pre-determined. I think its unfair but I also understand it and what it does do is keep controversy out of their events.

 

USADA's action is active and carries consequences. One of which is that LA won't be able to compete in WTC santioned events. This was not a WTC action or decision relating to LA it was a USADA decision / action....

Edited June 19, 2012 by dracs

[TNT1]

Do you guys really think the USADA gives a f*&k what the WTC does or doesn't do in instituting these proceedings?

[Wyatt Earp]

http://coversmaster.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/6.png

 

USADA's action is active and carries consequences. One of which is that LA won't be able to compete in WTC santioned events. This was not a WTC action or decision relating to LA it was a USADA decision / action....

[petatodd]

Do you guys really think the USADA gives a f*&k what the WTC does or doesn't do in instituting these proceedings?

No they don't. And WTC wants a credible sport without question marks over results. Which is why they have the suspension rules in place. If only the UCI had the same courage.

 

Tumbleweed has it on the "beyond a reasonable doubt".

 

This is not a court case. It cannot end up in court (as in the Justice system court), it can only go as far as the CAS, Court of Arbitration for Sport, where it is much easier to get a "conviction".

 

In the Contador, the CAS increased than ban over what the UCI where asking for, remembering that AC had 1/80th of the reportable dosage.

 

They were convinced he had broken the rules and it was up to the athlete to prove he had not broken the rules. But the difference is he did have a positive, even if only tiny.

 

In this latest case I think a lot of hubbers are tied up in the emotion of "he's been tested and never failed and is therefore not a cheat", but the reality is, that does not matter. USADA is bringing a case against a group of guys based on anecdotal evidence (witness testaments and blood analyses and who knows what else from the feds) and "beyond a reasonable doubt" does not come into it.

 

This case is far more about the balance of probabilities and I doubt USADA would have launched this action without being pretty sure of their stuff.

[TNT1]

No they don't.

 

So why are you okes all up in arms that USADA has banned Lance from doing a triathlon?

[Wyatt Earp]

No they don't. And WTC wants a credible sport without question marks over results. Which is why they have the suspension rules in place. If only the UCI had the same courage.

 

Tumbleweed has it on the "beyond a reasonable doubt".

 

This is not a court case. It cannot end up in court (as in the Justice system court), it can only go as far as the CAS, Court of Arbitration for Sport, where it is much easier to get a "conviction".

 

In the Contador, the CAS increased than ban over what the UCI where asking for, remembering that AC had 1/80th of the reportable dosage.

 

They were convinced he had broken the rules and it was up to the athlete to prove he had not broken the rules. But the difference is he did have a positive, even if only tiny.

 

In this latest case I think a lot of hubbers are tied up in the emotion of "he's been tested and never failed and is therefore not a cheat", but the reality is, that does not matter. USADA is bringing a case against a group of guys based on anecdotal evidence (witness testaments and blood analyses and who knows what else from the feds) and "beyond a reasonable doubt" does not come into it.

 

This case is far more about the balance of probabilities and I doubt USADA would have launched this action without being pretty sure of their stuff.

 

Kinda like having a death sentence handed down when you just happened to have lost a hair at the scene of the crime and not getting a proper trial.

 

I am with y'all that Armstrong has been tested and positives have been found, but why now ?

USADA have certainly woken up a little too late and no matter how their legal system operates, I reckon it will be challenged, especially if it's full of loopholes.