Cape Town Riders. Submit your TMNP MTB trails. Legal or illegal.

[kandui]

Morning

 

As the Table Mountain MTB Forum, we want to get an idea of where mountain bikers are currently riding in the Table Mountain National Park precinct and adjacent areas. We want to gather this information to include it in discussions with San Parks around the new Environmental Management Plan (EMP) which has to be formulated , before we can proceed with proposing any new trails in the park. From experience with the current EMP from 2002, any piece of trail which is not part of the EMP is not up for discussion and it becomes a real hassle to get it included.

 

Send us your tracks where you ride, it's mainly the illegal ones we want to include in the bigger picture. Some of these may become legal, who knows.

We need your input. Whether you are riding in the park (Cecilia Forest Night Ride, Signal Hill, etc) or in adjacent areas (Constantia Green Belt or on wine farms), we would like to build up a map of the all the areas where riding is taking place.

 

If you ride anywhere from Signal Hill to Cape Point, whether you know it's illegal or are not sure, please send us your tracks.

We don't need names and we have no interest in naming and shaming. This is for your benefit and the Forum needs as much information to do a proper job.

 

You can submit information to me at ride@tablemountainbikers.co.za or contact me if you have any questions.

 

All the best

Robert

Edited September 5, 2012 by kandui
spelling

[nishiki]

I'm not playing this game with TMNP and if you think it's worthwhile, you go for it. The parks have done very little for MTB over the years. I'm certainly NOT going to tell anyone where some of the trails are on this range. Many of them have been kept secret for years and years, and I feel they should stay that way. For some of us, quite a bit of blood and sweat went into making them too.

 

First lets see the singletracks being built on the trails below the cableway, since these were supposedly on the cards a while back. Let's see something from their side first. The parks are full of promises, with very little delivery. We have to worry about security too.

 

Bottom line though, if the parks don't know about the trails built in their areas, then it means they are not patrolling there, which means that they will do stuff all to upkeep them, and actually will try to fine riders with passion for exploring.

[Eddy Gordo]

a few years ago we had a run in with the parks official behind the Karamat on signal hill. This after we followed another MTB'er who took a trail down towards seapoint on that side of the mountain. Immediately after that we were stopped talks of confiscating bikes etc. Anyways after a lengthy discussion these guys told us that any trail below the tarred road which is the road running from the cable way through to signal hill was permissable to ride on, anything above that which are mainly hiking trails are not allowed. That is a huge amount of trails!!

[nishiki]

Yeah don't believe that. They don't know themselves.

 

To the OP: please outline the motive, benefit and purpose of this quest you are on. Really, how do you see this effort helping riders in the long run? I've been riding in these hills for over ten years and am yet to meet these park rangers, nor see any development towards riding.

[kandui]

Sorry you feel that way. Perhaps I should have phrased my into differently. We, the MTB Forum would like to get an idea of the trails being ridden on the mountain so that we can formulate a strategy based on where the highest concentration of cycling takes place. We are not pencil pushers who don't ride ourselves. We are just as sick and tired of the San Parks rhetoric and that's why we have decided to do something about it.

Unfortunately is is not as simple as having a meeting with a ranger and agreeing on a trail that will now be open to cycling, this is a Parastatal we are dealing with, who can't make any quick decisions.

There is a lot more to this process than you think, but we have decided that it's time to get San Parks to commit and start offering tangible results.

It'll take time and I can't make any promises about what the end result will be.

Single tracks all over the mountain, i doubt it. Access to more trails , very possible. When? No idea at this stage, but if you feel you don't need to make a contribution, fine, that's your call. We will work on your behalf and we won't mind if you enjoy the benefits at the end of the process. What the Forum is trying to achieve is an ongoing dialogue with San Parks on behalf of mountain bikers. We will stay in their faces and get the job done.

[kandui]

Yeah don't believe that. They don't know themselves.

 

To the OP: please outline the motive, benefit and purpose of this quest you are on. Really, how do you see this effort helping riders in the long run? I've been riding in these hills for over ten years and am yet to meet these park rangers, nor see any development towards riding.

We had a public meeting on the 22nd of August to introduce the Forum to riders. We spent R14k advertising in the papers, plus I gave notice of the meeting on the Hub.

Go to the website, where you find the Minutes, the Constitution and some info on what the purpose of the Forum is.

http://www.tmmtb.co.za

 

If the Minutes of the public meeting are not up yet, apologies. We met yesterday to go through them and amend certain wording in the Constitution which was queried by some in attendance.

[nishiki]

Sorry you feel that way. Perhaps I should have phrased my into differently. We, the MTB Forum would like to get an idea of the trails being ridden on the mountain so that we can formulate a strategy based on where the highest concentration of cycling takes place. We are not pencil pushers who don't ride ourselves. We are just as sick and tired of the San Parks rhetoric and that's why we have decided to do something about it.

Unfortunately is is not as simple as having a meeting with a ranger and agreeing on a trail that will now be open to cycling, this is a Parastatal we are dealing with, who can't make any quick decisions.

There is a lot more to this process than you think, but we have decided that it's time to get San Parks to commit and start offering tangible results. Good luck with that

It'll take time and I can't make any promises about what the end result will be. I have a guess what it will be.

Single tracks all over the mountain, i doubt it. Access to more trails , very possible. When? No idea at this stage, but if you feel you don't need to make a contribution, fine, that's your call. We will work on your behalf and we won't mind if you enjoy the benefits at the end of the process. What the Forum is trying to achieve is an ongoing dialogue with San Parks on behalf of mountain bikers. We will stay in their faces and get the job done.

I have a problem with people doing things on behalf of others. Good luck with your painful quest, but I hope you don't end up just giving them a list of all the places people ride and messing up trails that have been there for some time (with no impact on anyone, and a few who ride them). I won't be giving any info, and I hope the other riders think twice as well.

I'm saying all of this because another sport that I dearly love has had the exact same process happen. It went from one tiny area of concern, then some over-zealous process loving individuals opened up a can of worms that sees most if not all areas coming under the spotlight.

 

Please answer my questions in my previous post. Thanks

[nishiki]

We had a public meeting on the 22nd of August to introduce the Forum to riders. We spent R14k advertising in the papers, plus I gave notice of the meeting on the Hub.

Go to the website, where you find the Minutes, the Constitution and some info on what the purpose of the Forum is.

http://www.tmmtb.co.za

 

If the Minutes of the public meeting are not up yet, apologies. We met yesterday to go through them and amend certain wording in the Constitution which was queried by some in attendance.

Also, sorry to say this, but just because you started a club, does not mean you speak for all who ride the hills.

[JGR]

Keep fighting the good fight Rob!

[Guest Omega Man]

m. This is a tough one.

 

I'm not sure you are going to get many if any people giving up the whereabouts of the tracks they ride. If Sanparks agreed to not close any of them down you might meet with more success.

Edited September 5, 2012 by Omega Man

[nishiki]

m. This is a tough one.

 

I'm not sure you are going to get many if any people giving up the whereabouts of the tracks they ride. If Sanparks agreed to not close any of them down you might meet with more success.

It will be even worse. They will start doing an "Environmental Impact Plan", based on these areas. Then they will let this drag out for a year/s, all the while stringing this "Forum" of riders along, with an end result similar to Tokai, but worse, because there's no money to steal from taxpaying riders and populace who this mountain belongs to, so it will be easier to apply a formal ban.

 

Seriously. What's the point of all of this 'process'? To me, it looks like a bunch of guys who love sitting in meetings discussing minutes and who's going to bring biscuits. I went to your site Rob. Doesn't inspire much. The minutes of your last meeting are not up either. I suppose another meeting to discuss the spelling/wording is in order? Rob, you still havn't answered my question: what do you gain from this exercise?

Edited September 5, 2012 by nishiki

[kandui]

There was an Environmental Management Plan formulated for Mountain Biking in 2002, which pretty much formed the basis for the establishment of the Tokai Trails. That plan has become outdated and needs to be revised, due to the huge increase in mountain biking in general. Tokai can't cope with the rider numbers anymore and there is conflict between San Parks, cyclists and other user groups.

San Parks will not deal with individuals and the EMP of 2002 makes provision for an MTB Committee which speaks to San Parks on behalf of Mountain Bikers. This Committee is was named the Table Mountain MTB Forum and the 4 grouping who decided to get if off the ground were Amarider, PPA, Tokai Mtb and Table Mountain Bikers.

No properly constituted body to represent Mountain Bikers = No need for San Parks to do anything.

 

Motive: Nobody was else was doing anything to take on San Parks, so we decided to make a Start. Formulate a body San Parks will officially recognise and deal with. The Forum is not exclusive to the 4 founding members. We just got the ball rolling. We want other constituted bodies to join the Forum to make it as representative as possible.

Benefit: The Forum fights on behalf of the cyclist. Bring the concerns and ideas to the Forum and we will take the time to hash it out with San Parks. They have said they will listen to the Forum,if it has the support of the mountain biking community. We received that support at the meeting on the 22nd.

Purpose: Take a measured approach. Cynics ( I am one of the biggest) believe San Parks will never offer more trail access on the mountain, but I have decided that I am going to do it the legal way and see where that gets me. Along with Amarider,PPA and Tokai Mtb, we think it is possible to get more trail access (share trails with other users) and establish new trails on the mountain. San Parks are starting to change their tune and are asking for our input. They realise that they have to work with Mountain Bikers to keep a handle on the rapid expansion of the sport, but at the same time they see financial benefits as well (Activity Card Sales, access to private funding via the Forum). We say sure, but we need something in return. Activity Card revenue must be used for trail maintenance and building, or at least we as riders need to know where our money is going. Private funding can be used to build more trails, enhance facilities, etc. It's a situation of give and take. San Parks can't just take anymore, they have to give back too.

 

I hope that answers your questions in some way.

[kandui]

m. This is a tough one.

 

I'm not sure you are going to get many if any people giving up the whereabouts of the tracks they ride. If Sanparks agreed to not close any of them down you might meet with more success.

San Parks don't have the resources to close down illegal trails. What can they physically do? Cement up the entry and exit? Put armed guards there?

Ranger patrols will remain as thin as they are. They might stumble across a trail, they might not. It could have been there for years ,made by animals, it could have been made last week.

[Meezo]

my theory, leave early and you get to ride all the trails!

[kandui]

Nishiki. Just to be clear. The Table Mountain MTB Forum is not my club. If you want to trash the TMMTB website, then speak to Meurant Botha who whipped it up. We prefer to get things done instead of sitting in meetings and chomping on biscuits.

If you want to trash my club, then go to www.tablemountainbikers.co.za , take a look and come back here and vent.

 

If you have something meaningful to contribute, or want more clarity then by all means give me a call on 083 6319796 . If not, then don't call me.

[VT2jp]

Are 'The Glen' trails legal?