World Marathon Champs - XCM 2017

[Stretch]

Wow! 3 posts and already calling people names.

 

My comment about the munga was sarcasm (your IQ probably does not pick that up)....

 

But if that was 1 of the main criteria for sending this guy to worlds then it is a joke. I am all for development and there were some development riders at the epic that really did well and surely deserved to go

 

nah - he came 9th at SA marathon champs. First dev rider  - I'm all for giving him the opportunity

[Squier]

How does selection for the world cup work?

Shouldn't Nico Bell have been there as he is the SA Marathon champ

 

I believe CSA selects based on overall performance during the season. I would've expected Max Knox to go after his storming early part of the season, but perhaps too quiet a second part of the season cost him. Phillip and Matthys had great results in the last few big stage races and Matthys had some big results also early in the year and is also carrying some good form. I probably would've selected him over Phil, albeit not by much. Nico Bell won Nationals but doesn't really have much other big wins, although he's always been in the mix and is really consistent. I also would've expected to see him there but it's obviously a funding thing.

 

As I understand CSA only paid for Phil and Stembiso. Erik was self funded or there with his team. I stand to be corrected though.

 

Even though we don't have anyone to contend for the win at the moment, we do have talent and we do have riders capable of a good result. Thing is, if you're banking on one guy on one race, your chances of success is always going to be slim. Sending a team of four or more will improve our chances significantly, and we have the depth to do that, but the funds and the Rand will probably remain a stumbling block for the foreseeable future.

[Patchelicious]

I agree here. They averaged almost 30km/h over 98km which is not MTB worthy for my taste :-)

Sounds like my kind of dirt roadie race.

[Patchelicious]

Much rather a proud young South African given the chance of a lifetime over people who won't necessarily appreciate it. Love these sort of stories, regardless of his poor result... 

 

I don't think we should judge people who were never given the opportunity to go. How is that even a fair statement on the other guys. I am sure 99% of athletes would be proud to represent their country, except maybe that guy would like to puke on his Bok jersey.

 

As much as his' is a "cool story", and I like it, how is something as subjective as "gratitude" or "pride" a fair criteria for selection? 

 

General Statement: Development and transformation is about making riders better and developing them into work class riders, its not about sending guys to events where they are out of their depth.

 

Now I know the apologists will have a go at me, so let me state it again, I like his story.

[Andrew Steer]

I don't think we should judge people who were never given the opportunity to go. How is that even a fair statement on the other guys. I am sure 99% of athletes would be proud to represent their country, except maybe that guy would like to puke on his Bok jersey.

 

As much as his' is a "cool story", and I like it, how is something as subjective as "gratitude" or "pride" a fair criteria for selection? 

 

General Statement: Development and transformation is about making riders better and developing them into work class riders, its not about sending guys to events where they are out of their depth.

 

Now I know the apologists will have a go at me, so let me state it again, I like his story.

 

I hear you 100%, and I do wish he was better prepared... but crikey, in SA we know how this works. He needed to go. Just like we need a good quota in the Bok side.

 

And I love that he appreciated the opportunity - he's probably more upset than most at how he did. But maybe he will learn, hopefully there is a proper plan with him (calling CSA ). But even if there isn't, I'll take this humble kid from the valley going to a world championships and going back home and telling his story to the many who follow him and look up to him over some other people who take little pride in representing their country and still achieve boggerall.

 

It does all go back to CSA though and what their plan is... if any.

[Patchelicious]

I hear you 100%, and I do wish he was better prepared... but crikey, in SA we know how this works. He needed to go. Just like we need a good quota in the Bok side.

 

And I love that he appreciated the opportunity - he's probably more upset than most at how he did. But maybe he will learn, hopefully there is a proper plan with him (calling CSA ). But even if there isn't, I'll take this humble kid from the valley going to a world championships and going back home and telling his story to the many who follow him and look up to him over some other people who take little pride in representing their country and still achieve boggerall.

 

It does all go back to CSA though and what their plan is... if any.

1: Why did he "need" to go? We don't need good quotas, we need good players of colour. 

 

2: Like who?? You can't conjure up a hypothetical asshole who hates his country to justify your position on this guy. He isn't the only MTB cyclist in SA that is proud of his country.

 

Do you have personal connection to this particular guy or something?

 

Edit: General Statement: Feel good stories are great, but not at the expense of others.

[Andrew Steer]

1: Why did he "need" to go? We don't need good quotas, we need good players of colour. 

 

2: Like who?? You can't create a hypothetical asshole who hates his country to justify your position on this guy. He isn't the only MTB cyclist in SA that is proud of his country.

 

Do you have personal connection to this particular guy or something?

 

Edit: Feel good stories are great, but not at the expense of others.

1. That's the problem... it would appear he is currently the best option on paper for a rider of colour. It's also not his fault he got selected. 

 

2. Not attacking anyone in particular - I do see honest value in a guy from the valley going to a World Champs versus some guy from Sandton/Fourways going that's only marginally better. I like these kind of stories. Just like the story about this same academies paddlers who have gone on to be world class after humble beginnings. I see merit in him going - bottom line.

 

But like I said, I don't know if there is any plan... there quite possibly isn't. 

 

3. I have zero connection to him... I just know his story, and it's a good one.

[Patchelicious]

1. That's the problem... it would appear he is currently the best option on paper for a rider of colour. It's also not his fault he got selected. Nobody said it was HIS fault, lets not twist this. My question was directed at you, YOU said he "needed to go", I asked why. If he is the best option on paper, then thats answers it.

 

2. Not attacking anyone in particular - I do see honest value in a guy from the valley going to a World Champs versus some guy from Sandton/Fourways going that's only marginally better. You are still using imaginary people to justify your stance, I get your point, but we cannot say John Smith from Camps Bay would have been less grateful if he was selected. I like these kind of stories. Just like the story about this same academies paddlers who have gone on to be world class after humble beginnings. I see merit in him going - bottom line. ​You see merit in him going, thats cool and thats enough to make a statement, but lets not say that other athletes would be less patriotic and grateful. That not fair on them.

 

But like I said, I don't know if there is any plan... there quite possibly isn't. 

 

3. I have zero connection to him... I just know his story, and it's a good one. To you and the public and press, maybe not so much to those who couldn't go.

 

You are confusing my statements as directed towards him. They are not.

They are directed towards the logic that you are using.

[Andrew Steer]

You are confusing my statements as directed towards him. They are not.

They are directed towards the logic that you are using.

You are right... this is all getting a little confusing. I do have some experience of ungrateful entitled "pros' and that may be where my misdirection comes from a little. They are certainly not all like that - we have some awesome human beings in our pro ranks. We've fortunately rid ourselves of some of the less savory characters.

 

Bottom line, a rider of colour needed to go (this is South Africa) and he was apparently the best option. I would like to know if there was/is a plan for him, but CSA's got other issues to focus on I guess. That is a pity though - there would be so much more value in him being mentored to reach his full potential. Does Martins academy have the means for that, time will tell I guess.

 

He didn't take anyone's place if he is there as the best applicant for the set criteria - him being grateful for the experience is a real bonus in my eyes.

 

That is all

[Patchelicious]

You are right... this is all getting a little confusing. I do have some experience of ungrateful entitled "pros' and that may be where my misdirection comes from a little. They are certainly not all like that - we have some awesome human beings in our pro ranks. We've fortunately rid ourselves of some of the less savory characters.

 

Bottom line, a rider of colour needed to go (this is South Africa) and he was apparently the best option. I would like to know if there was/is a plan for him, but CSA's got other issues to focus on I guess. That is a pity though - there would be so much more value in him being mentored to reach his full potential. Does Martins academy have the means for that, time will tell I guess.

 

He didn't take anyone's place if he is there as the best applicant for the set criteria - him being grateful for the experience is a real bonus in my eyes.

 

That is all

I can appreciate this. Nice post.

[NelAndre]

You are confusing my statements as directed towards him. They are not.

They are directed towards the logic that you are using.

 

 

You are right... this is all getting a little confusing. I do have some experience of ungrateful entitled "pros' and that may be where my misdirection comes from a little. They are certainly not all like that - we have some awesome human beings in our pro ranks. We've fortunately rid ourselves of some of the less savory characters.

 

Bottom line, a rider of colour needed to go (this is South Africa) and he was apparently the best option. I would like to know if there was/is a plan for him, but CSA's got other issues to focus on I guess. That is a pity though - there would be so much more value in him being mentored to reach his full potential. Does Martins academy have the means for that, time will tell I guess.

 

He didn't take anyone's place if he is there as the best applicant for the set criteria - him being grateful for the experience is a real bonus in my eyes.

 

That is all

Good.Now it makes sense to me too. Some expert communication. Thanks