Dirtbreath Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 looks like the problem you need to solve is stupidity. how? These guys are definitely not stupid. They are however right that something needs to be done about the sport. There is a massive discontent about the price of goods in this industry. Imagine looking at it from the point of "how do we make gear more affordable so more people buy and start the sport which grows the industry". Would love to see that!
no.one.knows Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 looks like the problem you need to solve is stupidity. how? These guys are definitely not stupid. They are however right that something needs to be done about the sport. There is a massive discontent about the price of goods in this industry. Imagine looking at it from the point of "how do we make gear more affordable so more people buy and start the sport which grows the industry". Would love to see that! As well as Tony leon the next president?
Jules Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 minutes not approved or signed by anyone' date='and done buy a mechanic who is afrikaans and the meeting done in english,Minutes need to be approved and voted on[/quote'] Were the minutes approved when Fritz sent out this e-mail urging people to read them? From: Fritz Pienaar [mailto:mm@firebreak.co.za] Sent: 17 September 2008 12:27 PM Subject: Minutes - margins in the bicycling industry Dear bicycle wholesaler and retailer, Thank you for your support and great response in making our industry more healthy. For those of you who were unaware of this meeting here is a quick refresher: "I am sure that most of you are aware that there are a lot of concerns in the retail bicycle industry. There is a lot of rumours about retail shops that are struggling and wholesalers that are not getting paid. This causes a lot of problems for everyone in the industry and I?m sure that you would agree that it is not a healthy position to be in. I have had numerous meetings with retail shops and wholesalers over the last couple of months and everyone seems to agree that the retail shops are not making enough profit and that something needs to be done about it. The bicycle wholesalers agree that a healthier retail industry would also allow for a healthier wholesale industry." We've had a great response from the meeting on 10th September 2008! With all the mayor bicycle wholesalers and retailers in Gauteng, we've all come to agreement that raising the margins is the resolution to the problem. It is of utmost importance that we sign-up and state that you support this decision, we need everyone?s support to be able to make this change and to be able to implement these changes right away. Click here to see the attendance of the meeting on 10th September 2008 Click here to see the meeting on 10th September 2008 minutes Please click here, to state if you are supportive of higher margins in the Bicycling Retail sector (We recommend that you read the minutes if you were not present at the meeting) Regards, Fritz Pienaar 083 275 2123 PS. Please forward this to all bike shops you know of, or wholesalers that did not attend.
jagwil Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 I dont need to be jealous believe me' date='but you bunch must get your facts right before you critsisize people,innocent until proven guilty[/quote'] That wasn't meant for you but for the other bigoted, judgmental types out there who seem to begrudge the fact that some people do have a real Porsche. I have said it before and I will say it again. I am amazed at how quickly and easily some of the hubbers condemn others without affording them the opportunity to defend themselves in the appropriate forum, in this case before the CC. Sanity does not appear to prevail in this type of thread and cries of "jail them", "hang them", boycott them" and "fine them heavily" are heard throughout. As someone else said on this thread , what happened to the principle of S. A Law. "Innocent until proven guilty" ????? With "friends" like some of these guys ,who needs enemies.??????
jagwil Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 even if the competition comission finds no wrong doing' date=' half the people here have already made up their minds and publicly crucified the parties involved.i bet you almost no-one will come apologize afterwards.[/quote'] You have got to be kidding. They have already judged and condemned and as you said publicly crucified. Apologies do NOT form part of their make-up. They will probably just say that the CC was wrong and proceed to judge, condemn and crucify the members of the CC.
jagwil Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 find out for yourself' date='you have already been judge and jury [/quote']You see that's where your one eyed metallity lets you down. METALLITY. I have been unable to figure out what the F&%# METAL has to do with the present discussion unless you want to beat someone about the cranium with a metal baseball bat
Dirtbreath Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 find out for yourself' date='you have already been judge and jury [/quote']You see that's where your one eyed metallity lets you down. METALLITY. I have been unable to figure out what the F&%# METAL has to do with the present discussion unless you want to beat someone about the cranium with a metal baseball bat Maybe you should have taken the minutes.
Slowbee Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 Are you asking us to stop skinnering? Oh my word! like no way doll. This is hot gossip and with out it the world would stop. This is a very sane post !! Daaaarling where would the hub be without a doll?
porky Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 minutes not approved or signed by anyone' date='and done buy a mechanic who is afrikaans and the meeting done in english,Minutes need to be approved and voted on[/quote'] Were the minutes approved when Fritz sent out this e-mail urging people to read them? From: Fritz Pienaar [mailto:mm@firebreak.co.za] Sent: 17 September 2008 12:27 PM Subject: Minutes - margins in the bicycling industry Dear bicycle wholesaler and retailer, Thank you for your support and great response in making our industry more healthy. For those of you who were unaware of this meeting here is a quick refresher: "I am sure that most of you are aware that there are a lot of concerns in the retail bicycle industry. There is a lot of rumours about retail shops that are struggling and wholesalers that are not getting paid. This causes a lot of problems for everyone in the industry and I?m sure that you would agree that it is not a healthy position to be in. I have had numerous meetings with retail shops and wholesalers over the last couple of months and everyone seems to agree that the retail shops are not making enough profit and that something needs to be done about it. The bicycle wholesalers agree that a healthier retail industry would also allow for a healthier wholesale industry." We've had a great response from the meeting on 10th September 2008! With all the mayor bicycle wholesalers and retailers in Gauteng, we've all come to agreement that raising the margins is the resolution to the problem. - Sounds very anti competitive to meIt is of utmost importance that we sign-up and state that you support this decision, we need everyone?s support to be able to make this change and to be able to implement these changes right away. - THE intention here is clearly to collude and unilaterally INCREASE PRICES. Click here to see the attendance of the meeting on 10th September 2008 Click here to see the meeting on 10th September 2008 minutes Please click here, to state if you are supportive of higher margins in the Bicycling Retail sector (We recommend that you read the minutes if you were not present at the meeting) - Appears to me these minutes are APPROVED as he quite freely suggests everyone read them - obviously not so inaccurate as is made out.!Regards, Fritz Pienaar 083 275 2123 PS. Please forward this to all bike shops you know of, or wholesalers that did not attend.- again collusion without remorse. I wonder if the CC has this document - to me it looks like there were no iinaccurate minutes noted 7 DAYS after the meeting, in fact, it is suggested that other shops read the minutes. How they can say this was a meeting to discuss the retail and wholesale industry when clearly no mention is made of wholesalers increasing prices and a clear intention is made of RETAILERS to unilaterally increase prices across the board is beyond me - the intention was clearly price fixing and collusion - any 6th grader will tell you thats illegal.! porky2009-03-16 12:59:46
porky Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 even if the competition comission finds no wrong doing' date=' half the people here have already made up their minds and publicly crucified the parties involved.i bet you almost no-one will come apologize afterwards.[/quote'] You have got to be kidding. They have already judged and condemned and as you said publicly crucified. Apologies do NOT form part of their make-up. They will probably just say that the CC was wrong and proceed to judge, condemn and crucify the members of the CC. Why should anyone apologise?? The documents are available for all to see, it is clear there was an illegal meeting and the intentions were to unilaterally increase prices to the detriment of the consumer - in my opinion this is anti competitive and I for one will not apologise to anyone, irrespective of the CC outcome. You can walk around with a bleeding heart, thats your perogative, I take a slightly more cynical view.
Newlands Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 find out for yourself,you have already been judge and jury ...I don't think there are too many different ways in which the minutes or FP letter can be interpreted. The minutes and FP's letter are remarkably consistent for something that is suddenly thought to be inaccurate. And it was not a once off affair. FP mentions meetings over a a period of time, while AM organized meetings in Gauteng and CPT. If AM is such a clever and hard working businessman who has done so much for SA cycling as some are suggesting, are the rest of us really expected to believe that AM is in fact just dumb cyclist after all? I a dumb vet cyclist can make enough money from local cycling to drive around in a fancy car, then I cannot see how anyone can say the industry is in financial trouble. It may be in trouble, but not financial trouble. Come on, give me a break.
Newlands Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 phone FP on his mobile and ask him whether his letter is real
porky Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 My goodness - is that FPC letter for real ? Looks like it - kinda damning aint it.??
Tumbleweed Posted March 16, 2009 Posted March 16, 2009 My goodness - is that FPC letter for real ?? it's been on the hub for ages.
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