PPA Seedings

[Woofie]

There is no rush for them to update the seedings now as it is now MTB season, so seedings dont really matter.

 

 

 

At least it will be done by june/july when we have to renew otherwise they cant issue us new numbers.

 

 

 

But even that is another issue.

 

Didnt they take like two months last time to give out the new numbers?

 

 

 

Last year I renewed my membership like on the day it expired. It then took them another two months to send the number.

 

 

 

I think I will hold onto my pennies this time.

 

 

[Ratty]

The Knysna road race is in July so they will need the seeding before then surely.

[Rapunzel]

Does Cyclelab's seeding work on positions aot your race times relative to the winner's time?

 

PPA's seeding for mtb events is still awful and the season is just about to start

[rvdrijst]

phoned them yesterday, they just blamed racetec and was not willing to give any proper explanation as to the reasons for the delay,  blablabla...

[Dealz]

Does Cyclelab's seeding work on positions aot your race times relative to the winner's time?

Road :

http://www.cyclelab.co.za/seeding.asp

For each event an individual race index is calculated. Your race index is your time as a percentage of the winner's time. The lower your seeding index, the better!

To be included in the ranking table, we need a minimum of three results. If the cyclist has more than three results, we take the best (lowest) three. The overall seeding calculated for a cyclist is the arithmetic average of the three seeding indices used, these are current races, once twelve (12) months have past and you do not have three races you will no longer be ranked until you have three or more races again.

We calculate:

Overall position for all cyclists in the ladder.

Position in gender (male or female) for all cyclists in the ladder.

Category position by gender for cyclists in the ladder.

For a list of categories click here

Super Seeding Ladder Criteria:

Any race will be used provided it falls into the set criteria.

The race must be 90km or longer.

The race must be Chip Timed.

The race must have a minimum of 850 finishers or at least 2 of the professional teams (min. 5 riders per team) participating in the event.

The details of each rider must accompany the time especially the ID no.

Results will be added 1 month after completion of the race. (Providing the data is correct).

Races will be taken off the SSL as soon as the next year?s event has been loaded (or a year has past), except for the Cape Argus Pick 'n Pay Cycle Tour results that will stay on for two seasons.

In the event of a race not meeting the above criteria, the race may still be added at the custodian?s discretion.

If there are no professional teams at a race, a "winning time" will be calculated according to the average of the winners from a selection of the previous years major races.

The above rule will also apply to races where the elites race a different distance.

[Trubie]

Thanks Trubie' date=' lets see if the road riding is going to help me survive the joberg2c next week .... :-) [/quote']

what is 7/8 days of 4hrs + a day?

good luck anyway

[Ratty]

Thanks to someone for mentioning them possibly deleting things.

 

Just  checked my seeding (still the old one) and its missing 38 of my 55 races !!! WTF !!!!  I could understand if they only show the top races, but they are showing some of my worse races i.e 2005 when I first started cycling and the race that previously had the BEST index (Tour de Vino) is no longer there ?????

 

Think once my seeding has been updated I'm going to have to have words with them.  I've dropped a few groups since July last year.   Sigh...

 

 

All the long mtb races that I did are not there either.  Bascially

[besso]

Are races not timed by racetec used for PPa seeding? Like the upcoming Tour Durban?

[mikkelz]

Are?races?not timed by racetec?used for PPa seeding? Like the upcoming Tour Durban?

 

 

 

I don't think so. From their website:

 

 

 

Q: Which events are taken into consideration for seeding?

 

A: All fully-supported events on the PPA calendar

 

 

 

PPA Seeding: General Information

[niklasvm]

Its amazing how on Cyclelab's seeding i got a index of 14 for the 99er but PPA gives me 21. Even though its the best race I've ever done...

[Mugello]

Seedings up on PPA - but I see the winning times for the Malmesbury and 99er are incorrect - What gives?

[FatBoyDrunk]

 

Yippee I've moved up from Z to M

 

I won't have to start at the back anymore

 

[niklasvm]

the winning times are adjusted.... usually made better so your index becomes worse

[mikkelz]

Is the Argus and Three Passes Cycle Tour not used in your seeding?!

 

 

 

Those were my two best times.

[rvdrijst]

finally up, only months late...

[Woofie]

Its amazing how on Cyclelab's seeding i got a index of 14 for the 99er but PPA gives me 21. Even though its the best race I've ever done...

 

 

 

We are soon going to face a big problem.

 

If a new strong rider starts out (elite quality) he will move up through the rankings fairly quickly. But once he hits F group or so he is going to get stuck there.

 

He wont be able to join league (as you need to have a D seeding)

 

With them adjusting the winners time, I cant work out their stupid new formula, I often used to see the winners of a race ending up with a B seeding for the ride.

 

Where does that leave everybody else then?

 

The effect will ripple down and it will mean that the poor elite rider will be stuck in F forever.

 

Yes, they can do a "special" re-seeding for him. But that just shows how bad the seeding system really is.

 

We need a flat seeding system that does not adjust winning times. Needs to work more like the super seeding system.

 

One thing I really really dont agree with is adjusting races where the pros who win the argus are winning those races. No one is EVER going to do it faster than them so why the heck adjust their time?

 

Especially for the national level races where we have the countries best riders racing.

 

Just take a look at some of results how they have been adjusted.

 

Actual time   | Race | New adjusted time

 

2:44:55 99er 02:37:10

 

2:38:53 medalion 02:32:14

 

2:51:52 simonsberg 02:48:04

 

2:23:58 burger 02:22:58

 

Look are the 99er time.

 

Disgusting. Almost a 8 minute difference.

 

We had the countries best riders doing it as well. (Evans and George were there), very difficult and over 1100 riders.

 

The person who won it may have even a C seeding for the race, where he should actually have a 0 for it.

 

 

 

What can we do about this?

 

Surely us as paying members should be happy with the way that the seeding works?

 

 

 

I dont know, but I think we need some brain storming around a new model that will work for everyone.

 

 

 

PPA has its public meetings once or twice a year. With them being a NPO alot of its decisions come from a board of ppa members.

 

 

 

Ideas?