JTK

wow I hope you guys heal well. body and emotionaly!

add back on gumtree down to R4k

very nice Fruity!!! have a 3300 trek that I am thinking of giving the same treatment.

OK. Partially done... Bike without pedals. 13.2 kg. Bearing in mind I still need to change wheels, casette and chain. Stock back wheel complete with skewer, tyre, tube, rotor and casette = 3.2kg Replacement back wheel without tyre or skewer but with rotor and cesette = 1.6kg Front stock complete wheel with skewer, rotor, tyre and tube = 2.5kg Replacement without tyre or skewer but with rotor = 1kg Diffs = 3.1kg between wheels. Lets say the tyres with stans if I go tubeless is 1.5kg extra. That leaves 1.6kg And the pedals 500grams. That leaves me with 900gram which will make the bike complete 12.3kg. Lighter tyres 300grams off? Not bad for < R10k invested.

ok. So the Talon frame weighs in @ just under 1.8kg (M). This is with headset and innertube wrapped around chainstay... To me this aint half bad at all. Weighed the stock Alivio vs SLX cranksets. 400grams diffs. So far so good. Cant weigh complete as I need to sort out hub on front wheel to accept a skewer

you kidding right? Who is dumbass enough to advertise something that is stolen everywhere for sale? Given the price is just about right as well everything looks legit. WOW

Dunno smolster. That is still not apples with apples. What I am asking is why would the exact same scotch that is bottled in defferent bottles have different values down the line. Exact same content just different bottles...

yeah, dunno if it can be stolen. Way too brave to be selling with so many detailed photos if it was, imho.

come now, you have the oppertunaty to re-shape society as we know it. There will be only one manufacturer left in each price bracket once we are done as the rest does not mafacture frames up to that quality. Companies will go out of business and economies may collapse. We will all ride the same bike. Parts will be cheap and we can go race together with all carrying one spare component of a given part of the bike as all the replacement parts will be the same. Just think of the service you will be performing

KKK I think you may be presenting me with the best argument It is all about perception (within the same price bracket though - dont compare a Makro dunlop with a TOR Spez)

it is/was never supposed to be... In my argument I have been comparing same new price bracket bikes with simular spec components and they different ways in which they loose value which does ot make sense to me...

ok lets say that with bikes in the same price bracket with the same components one is flawed and the other less so. Why does the flawed one sell in the 1st place? Why are they not out of business? Surely if you buy one you are stupid when you can get another less flawed one with the same components for the same money? Or is it a case of I want to drive an Alpha/Jeep/etc and dont care about the resale?

To be honest. I think that is where answer lies...

yeah am concerned about this. Maxxis Crossmark (non ust) Will have to go UST if they are unhappy about this. Have heard it run like that before from others so have hope

my point exactly

missing the point. Tata / Porche = not the same engine/ components etc. Bikes in the same new price bracket have the same components, give or take. Aplles with apples. Frame geo cant be the be all end all as if I have bad geo I copy the next guy's geo. Cant be the type of Alu as they all almost use the same. Cant be the welding as that is the same. What is it then?

is my feeling as well. And running tubeless with same tyres will take another 400g off right at the edge of the rotation I am sure.

I did not compare frames as being the same. But the price diffs does not go along with the frame diffs. Lets take a Giant, Mongoose and a GT of the same price bracket with same components on. GT appears to loose value much quicker. Mongoose even more so. Why? That is my question...

Jip mine is a bit less already (stock fork goneand XTR kit). Just over 14kg. I am now replacing the Crank & BB and the wheels. Crank and BB going from Alivio octalink to SLX hollo II. Wheels going from solid train wheels ( cheapest gamo inhouse - dont even have a model but with rotors they weight almost 3.5kg to PXC2's which loosing the tubes in the process. New rims weigh at least a 1kg less than old ones and tubes maybe take off another 500grams(slime tubes)? Then still the crank. I recon 1.5kg+ shaved off the bike where it counts... And bike still cost me less than R10k with all the upgrades by shopping wisely... all of this is purely achedemic thought. I still need to learn to ride and get fit

29'r talon. Was inflating as I havent assembled last few parts yet. But given what it weighed with Alivo crank and old wheels/casette I recon it will be below 13kg def. Rear rim with rotor and casette without tyre was already way over 2kg... SLX Crank PXC2 wheels XTR Shifters XTR at the back XT Casette and front derailer Normal Shimano brakes Recon silver fork. Rest Giant Connect SL Relize that the talon frame is the same as the XTC frame. They probably only use diff quality alu. I had to go to my LBS for some assitance removing the BB this morning. Frame had BB and headset in. He picked it up and fell on his back. "wow this frame is light" was his exact words . I will weigh it tonight without BB.

This thread is purely about MTB as I have no idea about road bikes or bmx's etc But it is quite interesting to note that some bikes hold 2nd hand value better than others. One would imagine as cars also do the same that this should not really be all that interesting. But I find it strange given that the components on these bike are made by the same manufacturer, ie: Shimano, Sram, etc. The only different thing is the frame and that cannot be the reason? Why do we have this discrepancy in depreciation when it is pretty much the same bike. The only diffs is the manufacturer sticker. And they are little more than an assembly agent in the grand scheme of things? Is it the exclusivity of certain makes? Maybe the frames of the one is so much more superior to the other? Or the assembly skills? Cant be that though as we all put bikes together in our garages with much less QC oo and yes I understand that if a new fad comes out that the old will loose value because of. Not talking about that. As that will be across the board...

genade! My Talon weighs less than an R80k bike

must say I also find the kiddies bikes a waiste. My kid is 10 turning 11. He was riging a 20 inch last year, upgrded to a 2nd hand 24. When I wanted to start messing around and upgrade components, when I started riding, I realised that it is pointless. I got him a small GT 26inch. 50mm stem. giant comfy seat all the way to the front And he road it. Sure it is not a perfect fit but it was his and he was imensely proud of it. Given that we upgrade our components you pass those old ones on to him. He now sits on a small XTC with some stunning kit on (11kg bike) and he loves his bike. Best of all it can grow with him for the next 5 years or so. If you can get him on a 26inch frame, any size, get that rather. You can always swap frames and the rest of the components can be his bike. They can grow with him. Cheapest and best way imho.

I must say. Being a noob and all I may be far off but to me the most important will be rotational mass and unspring mass. By that I would say that hoops/spokes and tyres need to be lightest. Front hub and your fork lowers should be light. Less worries about the stranctions and even steerer. On a hard tail you could probably get away without a problem by running it heavier on the rear hub/casette. On a susser it probably would need to be light there as well to get best performance from the sus. The crank needs to be light but will be less of an issue. Light crank arms and pedals probably more importnant. But no use running XTR pedals and heavy shoes . The rest of the bike components is to a degree attached to yourself and the closer this weight gets to the centre of the bike the less effect it will have on your performance. The only thing you want then is reliable components. So if you wanna spend money spend it on wheels and make sure the rest is relaible. All this of cource given that your sus cant do with better working parts. Loosing 10kg will have a vastly more profound impact than taking 2kg off the actual bike (wheels/crank arms/fork lowers excluded of course). Putting R5k into wheels/tyres will have a much bigger effect imo than a new xtr groupset

looks like a plan. Where would one get one? LBS? A pic would be great yes plz.