The Audiophile/reference music thread.

[VincentBikes]

Saw these on Gumtree.... Have the babies 683's

 

Nothing wrong with 683's or anything baby about them...lol Have a pair of 684's on my AV System

[nishiki]

Yeah it looks awesome. Hopefully we can get the packaging of the amp looking good like that.

As far as the speaker goes I have been reading quite a bit and most people have recommended the maple as it will give the highs and lows and a nice mid punch. The maple will also match my Gibson Les Paul. But I haven't made the final decision yet. I have Maple, Mahogany, Rosewood and Cherry on the list at the moment. As I learn more I will make my decision. I could always build more than one as well. The wood will have to be a good looking hardwood, but I don't want to compromise on tone either.

This doesn't make sense at all. I'd love to read the articles that say this. The resonance of the cabinet (especially if open backed) will make very little difference to the tonality by changing the woods. With acoustics we look at the density coefficient and that would be very similar. Also, highs, mids and lows are separate frequency bands within the spectrum, so I can't understand how the hihgs and lows could have a 'nice mid punch'.

 

Changing that Celestion and the circuitry should be the focus if you are looking at tonal changes. The cabs are very cool looking though and for non gigging they are awesome.

 

Can you build other cabinets? I'm looking for something to be made soon.

[Wyatt Earp]

Nothing wrong with 683's or anything baby about them...lol Have a pair of 684's on my AV System

 

Nothing wrong with that CD 6000 KI signature

[DaLoCo]

Yeah it looks awesome. Hopefully we can get the packaging of the amp looking good like that.

As far as the speaker goes I have been reading quite a bit and most people have recommended the maple as it will give the highs and lows and a nice mid punch. The maple will also match my Gibson Les Paul. But I haven't made the final decision yet. I have Maple, Mahogany, Rosewood and Cherry on the list at the moment. As I learn more I will make my decision. I could always build more than one as well. The wood will have to be a good looking hardwood, but I don't want to compromise on tone either.

 

Sorry for the "ass"umption that that you did not consider wood tone.

 

Yes, I agree, the Les Paul should match well with maple, it already has a lot of warmth so you want to keep definition.

 

Where do you buy wood? I am lucky in that Rare Woods has a branch in PE, so I can go and pick my own wood. I was lucky enough to find a maple plank with some faint curl in it. Used it as a fretboard on my current go to bass.

[Kona Kula]

This doesn't make sense at all. I'd love to read the articles that say this. The resonance of the cabinet (especially if open backed) will make very little difference to the tonality by changing the woods. With acoustics we look at the density coefficient and that would be very similar. Also, highs, mids and lows are separate frequency bands within the spectrum, so I can't understand how the hihgs and lows could have a 'nice mid punch'.

 

Changing that Celestion and the circuitry should be the focus if you are looking at tonal changes. The cabs are very cool looking though and for non gigging they are awesome.

 

Can you build other cabinets? I'm looking for something to be made soon.

 

Well firstly its close backed with a port

"The speaker cab will be made out of maple using a celestion speaker. It will have a closed back and a port which will be tuned to the lowest string of the guitar"

The wood will def add or change tonality, its covered in multiple forums across the internet. I am not an experienced builder so I don't know how it will change but based on what I have read this is the conclusion i have come too. I will let you know when I have built it. I will be adding a celestion speaker not changing it. This build will be from scratch so no existing circuitry either.

I am not sure I can build this cab well. But if it does turn out well I will certainly make a cab for you.

[Kona Kula]

Sorry for the "ass"umption that that you did not consider wood tone.

 

Yes, I agree, the Les Paul should match well with maple, it already has a lot of warmth so you want to keep definition.

 

Where do you buy wood? I am lucky in that Rare Woods has a branch in PE, so I can go and pick my own wood. I was lucky enough to find a maple plank with some faint curl in it. Used it as a fretboard on my current go to bass.

 

Well here is the thing, this will be my first build. So there are still many things I have to work out. I do have a friend who makes wooden furniture and he is going to help me with the first build. So I guess I will be learning a lot from him.

 

Post some pics of your bass builds I would like to see that.

[nishiki]

Well firstly its close backed with a port

"The speaker cab will be made out of maple using a celestion speaker. It will have a closed back and a port which will be tuned to the lowest string of the guitar"

The wood will def add or change tonality, its covered in multiple forums across the internet. I am not an experienced builder so I don't know how it will change but based on what I have read this is the conclusion i have come too. I will let you know when I have built it. I will be adding a celestion speaker not changing it. This build will be from scratch so no existing circuitry either.

I am not sure I can build this cab well. But if it does turn out well I will certainly make a cab for you.

I didn't read the bit where you'd said it was a closed design.

If you believe that using exotic woods will greatly affect the tone then by all means go for it (although I'd take what people say on forums with a pinch of salt. I've read and experienced otherwise).

 

Using a dodgy guitar cable will have massively more influence on your tone, as will the circuitry inside the amp. What topography are you working with there?

[Kona Kula]

I didn't read the bit where you'd said it was a closed design.

If you believe that using exotic woods will greatly affect the tone then by all means go for it (although I'd take what people say on forums with a pinch of salt. I've read and experienced otherwise).

 

Using a dodgy guitar cable will have massively more influence on your tone, as will the circuitry inside the amp. What topography are you working with there?

 

The expensive wood is not just for tone. I have read that a few hardwoods will be good for tone. I want a wood that looks good too. anyway as I said I am learning as I go and I will see where it ends up. Some of the sound clips I have heard so far it is definitely heading in the right direction.

Agreed dodgy cable will make a huge difference. But I am still going to build something that I want, along the way I may make mistakes and change things. That's why its a project.

You going to have to excuse my ignorance but what do you mean by topography?

[nishiki]

The expensive wood is not just for tone. I have read that a few hardwoods will be good for tone. I want a wood that looks good too. anyway as I said I am learning as I go and I will see where it ends up. Some of the sound clips I have heard so far it is definitely heading in the right direction.

Agreed dodgy cable will make a huge difference. But I am still going to build something that I want, along the way I may make mistakes and change things. That's why its a project.

You going to have to excuse my ignorance but what do you mean by topography?

Well, what type of amplifier are you going to build? This is where your tone is affected. A tube design has a different sound to a transformer based design. A ported cabinet design will extend the bottom end, but ultimately one is looking for a flat frequency response, so if the closed back with porting is extending it too much you might end up with undefined bottom end. If tone is what you are crafting, then you'd be better off focussing on guitar electronics (active/passive), pickup choice and the type of preamp you are running it into. From there the cone/cab does have an effect but not as much as the former.

 

Using rare woods will look awesome though and it's a great idea. In fact, after seeing these pics I'm itching to have a couple of my toys 'rare-wooded' here.

[Kona Kula]

Well, what type of amplifier are you going to build? This is where your tone is affected. A tube design has a different sound to a transformer based design. A ported cabinet design will extend the bottom end, but ultimately one is looking for a flat frequency response, so if the closed back with porting is extending it too much you might end up with undefined bottom end. If tone is what you are crafting, then you'd be better off focussing on guitar electronics (active/passive), pickup choice and the type of preamp you are running it into. From there the cone/cab does have an effect but not as much as the former.

 

Using rare woods will look awesome though and it's a great idea. In fact, after seeing these pics I'm itching to have a couple of my toys 'rare-wooded' here.

 

The amp is a tube amp. The design is a simple Ax84 P1. There are schematics on the Ax84 website. As this is a first build it will be the simplest design. 1 preamp stage and the power tube stage. It should give us a very good 5 watt clean amp. My goal however is a lot bolder and as we know more we will adjust it. My dream build is something along the lines of the Mesa rectifier but in a smaller version (I will most probably never gig and remain a bedroom player, so building a huge high gain amp is out the question) So far from what I have read this complicates things quite a bit as you start to add more pre amp stages.

So we starting with the smaller clean amp. We will try get it sounding awesome and then start playing around with more pe amp stages and more complicated designs.

This is where the idea of building the cabinet came from. Its the end point of the tone. So the guitar and pick ups are good. Hopefully the amp turns out well. Then the last stage the cab will need to be well thought out in order to get a great tone.

Luckily for me there are far cleverer people who have done the maths and design. So for now I wont be rebuilding the wheel but rather following someone else's design.

[dev null]

I am just puzzled. Why would you want to build speaker cabinets with solid wood? For example, how are you going to compensate for the movement in the wood as the seasons change. The norm is usually to use an MDF (Supawood) base and then to use veneer on top of that.

 

Or am I missing something?

[kosmonooit]

I am just puzzled. Why would you want to build speaker cabinets with solid wood?

...

Or am I missing something?

 

Yes, it costs more therefore it must be better,

 

Its all over the Internet therefore it must be true.

[DaLoCo]

I am just puzzled. Why would you want to build speaker cabinets with solid wood? For example, how are you going to compensate for the movement in the wood as the seasons change. The norm is usually to use an MDF (Supawood) base and then to use veneer on top of that.

 

Or am I missing something?

Yes, it costs more therefore it must be better,

 

Its all over the Internet therefore it must be true.

You just have to play a few acoustic guitars made from different woods to know that wood has a massive effect on tone. A guitar rosewood back and sides will be far crisper than one with Mahogany back and sides, which is a lot warmer. Speaker boxes are reliant on resonance the same as acoustic guitars.

 

Wood movement with changing seasons is not a factor, otherwise all my guitars will be crooked at some time of the year. Wood does however move over much longer periods, so you need to compensate for that.

 

We are not talking about building a run of the mill item here, there are certain criteria which are aimed for.

 

MDF is for mass production, and gets fairly good middle of the road tone.

Edited September 19, 2012 by DaLoCo

[DaLoCo]

Using rare woods will look awesome though and it's a great idea. In fact, after seeing these pics I'm itching to have a couple of my toys 'rare-wooded' here.

You get some really nice veneers that you can use. None of the artificial stuff, but proper wood, about 3mm thick. It is very pricey, so get a good carpenter to do it. I would have to hunt, but there is a place in Cape Town that does veneer sheets. Otherwise you can get the planks and have them split in the width by someone with a large bandsaw till you have the veneer sheets....beware, this involves lots of sanding

[dev null]

Well, it depends on the type of enclosure. If it is going to be a box of some sorts, then you are going to have problems. I am not so much on about the tonal quality. In any case, in a good speaker design the material from which the enclosure should be made must be acoustically dead. The whole situation is completely different to a guitar where you want the wood to give character to the sound. With speakers its should be the other way around.

[kosmonooit]

Get your point about acoustical instruments, and most famously certain violins of great value from antiquity from a special type of wood hitherto unequalled in nature. The vibration of the strings are transferred to the woods sound chamber, which produces the sound, although resonance is surely to be avoided (vibrations as certain 'natural' frequencies)

 

But a speaker box is a surely a different device. The sound waves are projected from the moving cone. The box is an inert passive anchor, and also an acoustical sound chamber inside, with suitable porting. And exciting resonant frequencies would be undesirable surely because the box will buzz / boom at those certain frequencies.

 

Help me understand if I got it wrong please: I love the physics of sound although my theoretical knowledge is a bit rusty.

Edited September 19, 2012 by kosmonooit