T-Bob Posted June 10, 2013 Share the Sky tactic of not chasing but grinding down attacks reminds strongly of time trialling tactics. Operate at one hair's width below the threshold. Dont go into debt and watch the others burn. Play the game where you are at your strongest It's the clever way to win in todays environment. it's not overly interesting to watch for the flashy 'attack, attack' crowd at times but the pure effort, calculation and knowing your opponents limits is incredible. I don't think we're going to see the kind of relentless, early attacks that last that we used to see in to drug fuelled past. Look at the youtube clips of Armstrong, the pirate and Ulrich trading blows at speeds that are crazy. Tactics seem to be more smaller attacks near to finishes and try to gain smaller advantages over distances where the train can't come back so quickly. Nibali was prime on this @ the Giro. Key is that while Wiggins didn't have that 'jump and go' to counter Froome has that in bucket loads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted June 10, 2013 Share I reckon they must ban power meters...So a rider can race with instinct and gut feel. And not measure their output in a calculated scientific way. This organised stampeding up the bumps and defeating the spontaneous breakaway is *yawn*.It is taking away from the spirit of racing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carbon29er Posted June 10, 2013 Share Race radio is worse...at least the rider needs to read his own power meter and know where he needs to be. Rather than just be a machine following instructions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted June 10, 2013 Share Race radio is worse...at least the rider needs to read his own power meter and know where he needs to be. Rather than just be a machine following instructions. Yip. Something's gotta give otherwise the passion and combativeness of racing will wilt away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOldGuy Posted June 10, 2013 Share I reckon they must ban power meters...So a rider can race with instinct and gut feel. And not measure their output in a calculated scientific way. This organised stampeding up the bumps and defeating the spontaneous breakaway is *yawn*.It is taking away from the spirit of racing. Yeah, but I cant see that happening, sport has also become a game of electronic enhancement. I watched an interview recently with the great Bruce Fordyce and he never even had a heart rate monitor, he ran on splits and timed his splits on a normal old Timex. Quite incredible. On the point of SKY just grinding away, I dont think it will be that easy at the tour, they couldn't get it right at the Giro either and it wasn't for lack of trying. Once there is a real objective the lightweight climbers will just work together and attack until one gets away, SKY cant chase them all down and eventually one will get away, much like the Giro, but where it does make a difference though is limiting the losses of the leader. However, with you completely on the boring aspect, it definitely spoils the TV viewing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nochain Posted June 10, 2013 Share Agree on the race radio's but I think people might over estimate the effect a power meter have.Most of these guys train with power meters and I can tel you if you train with it as much as these guys do you know what power you on.They know what 400 watts feel like and work mostly on sensations...if you on a bad day it won't help you any how and on a good day they know what they are doing. GrumpyOldGuy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nochain Posted June 10, 2013 Share Yeah, he was very impressive here at the Dauphine', no doubt about it. ......but, I still say 'Berto is sitting on some good form , he just has no need to show it........but there are other issues which play into 'Berto's hands I think, a one week race as opposed to a three week grand tour, the stress of been a team leader in a big event, knowing whats needed to win ........all old hat to 'Berto, but I think still relatively new to Chris? Realistically I reckon 'Berto only has to peak in 5 weeks time, (final week of the tour) so in that context he looks like he is on course, BUT, if Chris can hold this kind of form for another 5 weeks (or improve) then Yup, he will be formidable no doubt.If I was Conto I would start to worry about how to avoid going that deep that Froome can counter him....he has done it so many times this year it must worry Conto.Every single time he has attacked Froome has countered and like at Oman he just rides away.It is almost like he wants Conto to attack and burn matches.One thing that I think must worry the GC guys is he has on a couple of occasions put in small attacks while they were on he's wheel and they could not stick...he did this at romandie and here again.Last week when he won the stage he basically dropped Valverde of he's wheel while crossing to Conto....that is very hard to do. If he improves from here and Porte also improves I really don't see anybody beating them.But if he is close to he's best and Valverde,conto and Rodriguez improves still then we will see a good battle. Edited June 10, 2013 by nochain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted June 10, 2013 Share Agree on the race radio's but I think people might over estimate the effect a power meter have.Most of these guys train with power meters and I can tel you if you train with it as much as these guys do you know what power you on.They know what 400 watts feel like and work mostly on sensations...if you on a bad day it won't help you any how and on a good day they know what they are doing. Point taken.True that. Let's target race radios being banned then as a talking point, because when Valverde moves up the gradient, then there is no knowing how far he is... Wez-O 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez-O Posted June 10, 2013 Share Point taken.True that. Let's target race radios being banned then as a talking point, because when Valverde moves up the gradient, then there is no knowing how far he is...YES! I'd love to see a statistic on how many breakaways successfully stayed away in the non-race radio days compared to nowadays.Isn't there a rule that riders aren't allowed radios in the Olympics? That could have accounted for why team GB miscalculated the breakaways lead and blew it for Cav in London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcza Posted June 10, 2013 Share I see Europcar is in touble following Rolland's cortisol test at Dauphine. More to follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wez-O Posted June 10, 2013 Share I see Europcar is in touble following Rolland's cortisol test at Dauphine. More to follow.This must be a misunderstanding, surely a pro cyclist wouldn't cheat!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nochain Posted June 10, 2013 Share Point taken.True that. Let's target race radios being banned then as a talking point, because when Valverde moves up the gradient, then there is no knowing how far he is...Yes will make things interesting for sure ,especially the first big break of the day will be hard to control , might actually make it much harder to get away but will also be hard for the controlling teams.During some of the races they tested this last year all that happened is they ended up riding harder to ensure the break never got a big gap....and in most cases ended up catching the break way to early because of the uncertainty.The biggest thing was they had to react earlier...than normal which could make the beginning part of the race more interesting and cause second and 3 rd breaks to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOOK695 Posted June 10, 2013 Share It's the clever way to win in todays environment. it's not overly interesting to watch for the flashy 'attack, attack' crowd at times but the pure effort, calculation and knowing your opponents limits is incredible. I don't think we're going to see the kind of relentless, early attacks that last that we used to see in to drug fuelled past. Look at the youtube clips of Armstrong, the pirate and Ulrich trading blows at speeds that are crazy.We, the viewers, were probably spoilt in those days of drugs being used so much. Made it very entertaining to watch GrumpyOldGuy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcza Posted June 10, 2013 Share This must be a misunderstanding, surely a pro cyclist wouldn't cheat!!! Its to do with MPCC tests. Cortisol tests are health checks. But one explanation for low levels can be doping with cortisone. A rider with low levels is told to rest. Europcar’s Bernadeau says MPCC-doctor said Rolland could ride. Doctor denies this. Remember AG2R withdrew from Dauphine because of MPCC tests, now Europcar is in the same position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrumpyOldGuy Posted June 10, 2013 Share If I was Conto I would start to worry about how to avoid going that deep that Froome can counter him....he has done it so many times this year it must worry Conto.Every single time he has attacked Froome has countered and like at Oman he just rides away.It is almost like he wants Conto to attack and burn matches.One thing that I think must worry the GC guys is he has on a couple of occasions put in small attacks while they were on he's wheel and they could not stick...he did this at romandie and here again.Last week when he won the stage he basically dropped Valverde of he's wheel while crossing to Conto....that is very hard to do. If he improves from here and Porte also improves I really don't see anybody beating them.But if he is close to he's best and Valverde,conto and Rodriguez improves still then we will see a good battle. Nope, with you there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Dale Posted June 10, 2013 Share Nope, with you there. I'm idealistic when I refer to the banning of race radios and power meters.To beat the Skyborgs, teams will have to fight fire with fire. Bring on le Tour! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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