CSA / PPA. The Heat is on

[ccc2]

just to bring some reality to the picture. i'm familiar with most of these clubs as they want to race in the wpca winter league and have shot a wp champs etc etc and maybe win some cash BUT their riders aren't licensed.

some are and rode and joined the wpca as a fully fledged club - well done to the ppa

i only allow csa licensed cyclists to race - they are NOT top end pro's just ordinary cyclists like you and me racing their bikes.

a lot of the belowmentioned clubs want to race but can't even afford the entry fee. a sad reality. and unlike the ppa i don't have the money to subsidise them.

PPA PROJECTS SUPPORTED IN 2012-2013

Cape Town Giants, Southern Suburbs

Cedar High, Mitchells Plain

Fairmount Secondary School, Lotus River

Freewheelers Cycling Club, Steenberg

Genesis BMX Club

Heinz Park, Heinz Park

Hex valley Secondary School, De Doorns

Hout Bay Cycling Club, Hout Bay

Kinetic Cycling Club, Bishop Lavis

Lavendar Hill Secondary School

Muhammadeyeh Cycling Club, Wynberg

Rhadsport Cycling Club, Paarl

Southern Cape Cycling Club, Oudtshoorn

Southern Most Foundation Bredasdorp

Steenberg High School, Steenberg

Suburbs Cycling Club, southern Suburbs

Yep Clan, Khayelitsha

[Icycling]

just to bring some reality to the picture. i'm familiar with most of these clubs as they want to race in the wpca winter league and have shot a wp champs etc etc and maybe win some cash BUT their riders aren't licensed.

some are and rode and joined the wpca as a fully fledged club - well done to the ppa

i only allow csa licensed cyclists to race - they are NOT top end pro's just ordinary cyclists like you and me racing their bikes.

a lot of the belowmentioned clubs want to race but can't even afford the entry fee. a sad reality. and unlike the ppa i don't have the money to subsidise them.

PPA PROJECTS SUPPORTED IN 2012-2013

Cape Town Giants, Southern Suburbs

Cedar High, Mitchells Plain

Fairmount Secondary School, Lotus River

Freewheelers Cycling Club, Steenberg

Genesis BMX Club

Heinz Park, Heinz Park

Hex valley Secondary School, De Doorns

Hout Bay Cycling Club, Hout Bay

Kinetic Cycling Club, Bishop Lavis

Lavendar Hill Secondary School

Muhammadeyeh Cycling Club, Wynberg

Rhadsport Cycling Club, Paarl

Southern Cape Cycling Club, Oudtshoorn

Southern Most Foundation Bredasdorp

Steenberg High School, Steenberg

Suburbs Cycling Club, southern Suburbs

Yep Clan, Khayelitsha

Like I said about PPA chairmans comment on the radio about getting some cyclist wanting to race!

 

"Its like a parent with enough money to pay school fees but at grade 10 say sorry you must now pay your own school fees and varsity fees - yes the parent says I know I can afford it but you on your own. Then to watch their child not going to school as the child does not have the fund! Personally if I saw that I would really question that parents ability in parenting and certainly would not agree with it!"

 

Quite sinful actually!

[DJR]

@ Icycling & ccc2

 

I do agree that prizemoney for league races should be substantially bigger. I know how much effort and money gets plowed into racing by riders themselves as well as by parents, with no financial assistance or return. At the very least, a few thousand rand could be a great incentive for any youngster, if not a solid financial return.

 

Where I truly think money should be spent, is helping promising young racers with coaching, equipment and travel to races further afield and even overseas. Who should step up to the plate and fund this, is a different story though.

[Brogue]

Like I said about PPA chairmans comment on the radio about getting some cyclist wanting to race!

 

"Its like a parent with enough money to pay school fees but at grade 10 say sorry you must now pay your own school fees and varsity fees - yes the parent says I know I can afford it but you on your own. Then to watch their child not going to school as the child does not have the fund! Personally if I saw that I would really question that parents ability in parenting and certainly would not agree with it!"

 

Quite sinful actually!

 

Regarding Steve's comment: PPA encourage riders at grassroots level, and then pass them on to CSA's provincial affiliate for further development. CSA has many income streams, it's not good enough for them to plead poverty and look to funriders to fund their core activity.

 

Your example of the parent and kid is somewhat convoluted, Icycling. As it happens CSA is the self-appointed parent, by virtue of it's sanctimonious and dubious role as the sport's so-called "governing body". PPA is the ABUSED "child" (not the other way around). It's not the role of the child to finance the parent's TIK habits. The parent has effectively disowned the kid by writing him out of it's will. The parent has to take responsibility for it's own actions (or inactions), it cannot point fingers at the kid. The child, on the other hand, has managed his pocket money very well and just wants to ride his bike with his friends in his home province without having his piggy bank raided by the thieving parent. The parent is abusive and needs to be brought down a few notches by the kid, who has the law and public sentiment on his side. The parent needs to get his act together, which is why the kid is asking him to do what he originally undertook to. NOW THAT's SINFUL!

 

Phew, speaking in the third person is tiring

 

I just renewed my PPA membership, and really enjoyed spending that R295 KNOWING I will receive full value for every penny.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Brogue

[ccc2]

just isolate the west cape for a minute.

in other provinces, cycles events are organized by a promotor, they pay R7 levy per rider to csa who then pays R4 of the R7 to the local region.

in the WP, the PPA are the promotors. they have never paid over the levy hence the WP are not rolling in money.

whatever we have have done has been self funded (just like the recently completed winter league).

ppa have helped with the wp schools academy which draws its members from the clubs.

wpca clubs and its members coach the youngsters - kinetic, Mohammedeyah, City must be commended for its youth policy.

CT Giants,Cedar, Siphiwo have recently joined wpca with a large contingent of youngsters.

equipment is an ongoing headache - hand me downs take on another meaning

i been to 3 youth festivals with my son and the wp look like paupers compared to other provinces.

we take the biggest contingent of youth but provinces like ep, fs , nam are like pro teams, their youngster warm up under gazebos on idt's, it's an eye opener.

but we'll carry on, regardless of the issues with csa / ppa

i know where competitive cycling is going with or without ppa.

keep an eye on the events page

[ccc2]

Regarding Steve's comment: PPA encourage riders at grassroots level, and then pass them on to CSA's provincial affiliate for further development. CSA has many income streams, it's not good enough for them to plead poverty and look to funriders to fund their core activity.

 

Your example of the parent and kid is somewhat convoluted, Icycling. As it happens CSA is the self-appointed parent, by virtue of it's sanctimonious and dubious role as the sport's so-called "governing body". PPA is the ABUSED "child" (not the other way around). It's not the role of the child to finance the parent's TIK habits. The parent has effectively disowned the kid by writing him out of it's will. The parent has to take responsibility for it's own actions (or inactions), it cannot point fingers at the kid. The child, on the other hand, has managed his pocket money very well and just wants to ride his bike with his friends in his home province without having his piggy bank raided by the thieving parent . The parent is abusive and needs to be brought down a few notches by the kid, who has the law and public sentiment on his side. The parent needs to get his act together, which is why the kid is asking him to do what he originally undertook to. NOW THAT's SINFUL!

 

Phew, speaking in the third person is tiring

 

I just renewed my PPA membership, and really enjoyed spending that R295 KNOWING I will receive full value for every penny.

 

this is a more accurate:

the csa is my legal father but i live in my step father's house owned by the ppa. every time i ask my father for money he tells me he has 8 other mouths to feed and i must rather ask my rich step father as he only has one mouth to feed.

iow most cyclists in the wpca an affiliate of the csa are also members of the ppa

Edited June 25, 2013 by ccc2

[DJR]

ccc2

 

Can (or has) WPCA ever asked PPA to fund something specific? Like taking kids to an inter provincial or nationals? Even if it isn't their baby, I think they might just consider something like that if it is motivated properly and the money used wisely and accountably. They might even think of sponsoring a number of proper racing bikes for a club to use on a "pass me on" basis for derserving youngsters. Or is the CSA vs PPA thing getting in the way? (I'm asking because i'd like to know.)

[Brogue]

this is a more accurate:

the csa is my legal father but i live in my step father's house owned by the ppa. every time i ask my father for money he tells me he has 8 other mouths to feed and i must rather ask my rich step father as he only has one mouth to feed.

iow most cyclists in the wpca an affiliate of the csa are also members of the ppa

 

I merely used Icycling's example, with context and perspective.

 

Using your example, your stepfather is feeding many more mouths than your biological father (who sounds like a loser, so you should seek legal emancipation). If the WPCA members are dual members of PPA, then CSA are getting their pound of flesh from their license fees anyway so what's the issue?

 

PPA and CSA have separate objectives. PPA merely seek a declaratory order from the high court preventing CSA from prescribing to them and holding them to ransom. I REFUSE TO PAY R75 TO CSA BULLIES, SIMPLY COZ THEY DEMAND IT. I'd rather pay it voluntarily (which I already do). I have yet to hear what CSA did with it's abundant cashflow over the past 12 months.

 

Read the PPA's founding high court affidavit on the website, it's illuminating.

http://www.pedalpower.org.za/blog/news/ppa-and-csa-the-way-forward/

[ccc2]

ccc2

 

Can (or has) WPCA ever asked PPA to fund something specific? Like taking kids to an inter provincial or nationals? Even if it isn't their baby, I think they might just consider something like that if it is motivated properly and the money used wisely and accountably. They might even think of sponsoring a number of proper racing bikes for a club to use on a "pass me on" basis for derserving youngsters. Or is the CSA vs PPA thing getting in the way? (I'm asking because i'd like to know.)

yes, the ppa have sponsored the wp schools association to send kids to the youth festivals.

in previous years the ppa and wpca have worked together, more recently the ppa/wpca ran the 2012 spring league.

yes, ppa will help any club, even if it is affiliated to wpca, if they apply for funding. ppa have been excellent in this regard. they only pay out on receipt of an invoice for hardware so you don't get cash if you are successful.

i am not that close to the politics to feel how cold the 'cold war' has got but i do know that neither side will back down.

[Seepglad]

Spot on Brogue - even if people may have a problem with PPA, they are a voluntary organisation and people have the choice of supporting them or not. On the other hand CSA is not.

u r wrong, they both VA's, and only their employees get paid

[ccc2]

I2

 

Read the PPA's founding high court affidavit on the website, it's illuminating.

http://www.pedalpowe...he-way-forward/

i've read it - i'll pull it apart in less than 5 minutes.

[Icycling]

 

 

Regarding Steve's comment: PPA encourage riders at grassroots level, and then pass them on to CSA's provincial affiliate for further development. CSA has many income streams, it's not good enough for them to plead poverty and look to funriders to fund their core activity.

 

Your example of the parent and kid is somewhat convoluted, Icycling. As it happens CSA is the self-appointed parent, by virtue of it's sanctimonious and dubious role as the sport's so-called "governing body". PPA is the ABUSED "child" (not the other way around). It's not the role of the child to finance the parent's TIK habits. The parent has effectively disowned the kid by writing him out of it's will. The parent has to take responsibility for it's own actions (or inactions), it cannot point fingers at the kid. The child, on the other hand, has managed his pocket money very well and just wants to ride his bike with his friends in his home province without having his piggy bank raided by the thieving parent . The parent is abusive and needs to be brought down a few notches by the kid, who has the law and public sentiment on his side. The parent needs to get his act together, which is why the kid is asking him to do what he originally undertook to. NOW THAT's SINFUL!

 

Phew, speaking in the third person is tiring

 

I just renewed my PPA membership, and really enjoyed spending that R295 KNOWING I will receive full value for every penny.

 

While there are attitudes like this who suffers - well cycling in general, but directly the up and coming cyclists who want to try and make a future out of sport in this case cycling! So another generation lost! Think about that for a second. Its easy to say this is for CSA knowing they are not capable - when one is capable like PPA well thats just a travisty!

 

I personally for the past three years have donated to individuals air tickets to Europe for cycling - sort of like the starfish theme - well you cannot help all but you can help one and as an individual thats all I can do - as an association PPA could do so much more at ZERO expense to other cycling projects.

 

I, like others on the hub - read the Urgent appeal for assistance - am able to help on occassion, but this is ad hoc where as an association PPA could help their members directly who have come through the PPA funride / race system to explore international exposure. I put a proposal of a list of criteria together for PPA a few years back but.... - file 13!

 

[Brogue]

While there are attitudes like this who suffers - well cycling in general, but directly the up and coming cyclists who want to try and make a future out of sport in this case cycling! So another generation lost! Think about that for a second. Its easy to say this is for CSA knowing they are not capable - when one is capable like PPA well thats just a travisty!

 

I personally for the past three years have donated to individuals air tickets to Europe for cycling - sort of like the starfish theme - well you cannot help all but you can help one and as an individual thats all I can do - as an association PPA could do so much more at ZERO expense to other cycling projects.

 

I, like others on the hub - read the Urgent appeal for assistance - am able to help on occassion, but this is ad hoc where as an association PPA could help their members directly who have come through the PPA funride / race system to explore international exposure. I put a proposal of a list of criteria together for PPA a few years back but.... - file 13!

 

Why should anyone have to donate anything to talented cyclists to gain international exposure, surely that is CSA's purpose? I too donate to causes close to my heart regularly. I do this because I WANT to, not because I am compelled to (like CSA want to compel funriders to pay R75). PPA do indeed help their members, and many other organizations (as listed earlier) with their exceptional work province-wide. We all know how PPA spend their cash, they are transparent and honest.

 

I have yet to hear, from anybody, what CSA have done with their cash over the past 12 months. Show us the balance sheet CSA, full income from all sources and expenditure. People conveniently expect too much of PPA, and too far little of CSA. Nobody seems able to answer that, including the CSA supporters. Funny that.

Edited June 25, 2013 by Brogue

[Icycling]

I have never said that CSA is capable - but PPA who are capable, I was on the PPA committee for 18 years so I think I can speak 1st hand, have actually turned their back on promising racing cyclist who have come through their funride system - possibly only started in the sport of cycling and yes lets give it another name the biggest development sporting event in the world - The Cape Argus Cycle Tour - where people take an interest in cycling some of them get bitten by the cycling bug and then some become really competitive and look further towards racing cycling at National and international level. So that 14 year olds Argus entry now is costing the parents how much at 18 years old when selected for the SA team R30 000.00 to go to world champs! The 50% shareholder of this event is PPA and this is the main reason why PPA has money to put into project funding, but why do they hide behind CSA and exclude racing from the agenda of project funding? Yet PPA know their best supported funride are the league ride i.e. funrides with races! PPA give pretty little back to racing cycling yet they make their success out of racing cycling - I also regard the Cape Argus cycle tour to be a race!

 

In the past PPA did have racing events like the Giro del Capo and even assisted individuals selected by SACF / CSA who were PPA members to get to the international events they were selected for - but now they have turned their back completely on the competitive side of cycling unless it adds to their events!

[HappyMartin]

I'm now totally confused. CSA is my father? PPA is a 2nd cousin once removed to Slaapstad. CSA never did anything for me, sounds like my father so I'm cool with that. My second cousin lives so far away they don't know I exist and when I visit they don't seem terribly happy to see me but enjoy the money I spend on them and look relieved when I leave to go home to Jobug.

 

Do I have this all straight? Never been good at family stuff.

[Brogue]

I'm now totally confused. CSA is my father? PPA is a 2nd cousin once removed to Slaapstad. CSA never did anything for me, sounds like my father so I'm cool with that. My second cousin lives so far away they don't know I exist and when I visit they don't seem terribly happy to see me but enjoy the money I spend on them and look relieved when I leave to go home to Jobug.

 

Do I have this all straight? Never been good at family stuff.

 

When one can't blame the PPA for the SA Cycling's ills any longer, bring in da family to complicate matters