Why is a left hand turn easier?

[Capricorn]

One thing that may be useful to try apart from all the above mentioned. When you want to turn to the left, try initiating the turn by turning your front wheel to the right. Just a slight movement, hardly noticeable, but it will result in the bike leaning to the left. The once this happens, as you lean with it, the front wheel will straighten by itself and like magic you will be turning to the left. And you'll be railing it.

Slightly counterintuitive, but it does work. The problem is you can't initiate a turn at speed to the left by turning the front wheel to the left as this throws you off balance and the front wheel will want to slide out.

You might find that if you are turning much better to the right that this may be the missing move you may be doing without even realising.

 

 

where's Johan Bornman to rip you a new one

 

but i must admit, reading what you said, made me express a very audible "huh"..

 

Remember, he is referring to climbing and cornering, not descending, and even then, you can corner at speed, by leaning the bike instead of turning on the bars. I've NEVER needed to counter steer first, except when drifting.

 

I'm not in favour of this bit of advice to be honest as I simple dont see a need for it, especially from the physics of it all.

[vanniri]

Barhugger is correct - it is more intuitive than anything else.

 

Apart from the figures of 8 he describes try the following:

• Mount the bicycle from the side you are struggling to turn into, i.e. right-hand turns get on the bike from the right and vice versa. We tend to mount the bike only from one side - I suppose being creatures of habit. The best way of mounting the bike - with the objective of improving balance, is to put your foot on the pedal, for eg left foot/left pedal, push the bike forward and swing your leg (in the above example your right leg) over the seat. Your balance will improve by default. It works even better with flat pedals since you have a larger contact area.
  

Edited March 14, 2014 by vanniri

[milky4130]

Why is it easier for me to execute a tight left turn on a single track? I find it much more difficult to go right. I thought it was because I am right handed and my right leg (outside leg on the turn) is dominant and therefore I have more control, but today I spoke to a left handed cycling buddy and he has the same problem.

 

I surf left foot forward and uncleat left first.

i'd say you are not riding enough right hand turns so therefore you are not use to it. Just think about it, your local trail that you ride most frequently probably has most of them left hand turns? Since you surfing left foot first that side is probably stronger too (core)?

[BarHugger]

i'd say you are not riding enough right hand turns so therefore you are not use to it. Just think about it, your local trail that you ride most frequently probably has most of them left hand turns? Since you surfing left foot first that side is probably stronger too (core)?

 

What about riding in a vehicle? When steering the vehicle and turning left, you can lean into the turn with your body......body becomes accustomed to this action (becomes natural and automatic). Same leaning action in left turn on bike. When turning right in a vehicle, there is no leaning as you are supported by a door (or will bump your head against window). Body "programs" this as acceptable motion. The opposite action is however experienced on the bike when turning right (leaning)......this might lead to a feeling of awkwardness. Just have a look at sportsmen (as in discuss) that need to do the rotation action in the opposite direction they are accustomed to......also experience a drop in coordination.

Edited March 14, 2014 by BarHugger

[milky4130]

 

 

What about riding in a vehicle? When steering the vehicle and turning left, you can lean into the turn with your body......body becomes accustomed to this action (becomes natural and automatic). Same leaning action in left turn on bike. When turning right in a vehicle, there is no leaning as you are supported by a door (or will bump your head against window). Body "programs" this as acceptable motion. The opposite action is however experienced on the bike when turning right (leaning)......this might lead to a feeling of awkwardness. Just have a look at sportsmen (as in discuss) that need to do the rotation action in the opposite direction they are accustomed to......also experience a drop in coordination.

not sure where you got your license from but that is not K53, you don't turn leaning your body you only need your arms & hands. I'm

afraid if you had to go re-test today you will fail.

[BarHugger]

not sure where you got your license from but that is not K53, you don't turn leaning your body you only need your arms & hands. I'm

afraid if you had to go re-test today you will fail.

 

Yip, I know...... ......but the "leaning" part came well into play during an advanced driving course with........MB C63 AMG monsters. Then you don't steer with your arms and hands......

[beanz]

where's Johan Bornman to rip you a new one

 

but i must admit, reading what you said, made me express a very audible "huh"..

 

Remember, he is referring to climbing and cornering, not descending, and even then, you can corner at speed, by leaning the bike instead of turning on the bars. I've NEVER needed to counter steer first, except when drifting.

 

I'm not in favour of this bit of advice to be honest as I simple dont see a need for it, especially from the physics of it all.

 

It's a subtle thing that you are probably doing already without noticing. You definitely won't see it, but you may feel it. When you say you lean the bike instead of turning the bars, thats exactly what you are doing. Think about the physics of it. There is no other way of leaning the bike except through countersteer.

e.g.

http://www.obairlann...ersteering.html

but I agree it doesn't really apply to turning at low speed when climbing.

[Caerus]

 

 

where's Johan Bornman to rip you a new one

 

but i must admit, reading what you said, made me express a very audible "huh"..

 

Remember, he is referring to climbing and cornering, not descending, and even then, you can corner at speed, by leaning the bike instead of turning on the bars. I've NEVER needed to counter steer first, except when drifting.

 

I'm not in favour of this bit of advice to be honest as I simple dont see a need for it, especially from the physics of it all.

Almost on a plane to the Highlands.

[Capricorn]

It's a subtle thing that you are probably doing already without noticing. You definitely won't see it, but you may feel it. When you say you lean the bike instead of turning the bars, thats exactly what you are doing. Think about the physics of it. There is no other way of leaning the bike except through countersteer.

e.g.

http://www.obairlann...ersteering.html

but I agree it doesn't really apply to turning at low speed when climbing.

 

i completely disagree with you. I've never NEEDED to countersteer to turn around any corner, car or bike, and when I need to lean, i most definitely do not countersteer prior to the corner. It's not 'natural', and most definitely not necessary. I've filmed myself enough to know i dont do it. at all.

[Guest Omega Man]

i completely disagree with you. I've never NEEDED to countersteer to turn around any corner, car or bike, and when I need to lean, i most definitely do not countersteer prior to the corner. It's not 'natural', and most definitely not necessary. I've filmed myself enough to know i dont do it. at all.

He's talking about the Scandinavian flick. If you watch a few vids of people like Matti Leikonen and Ben Reid you'll see what he's talking about.

[beanz]

i completely disagree with you. I've never NEEDED to countersteer to turn around any corner, car or bike, and when I need to lean, i most definitely do not countersteer prior to the corner. It's not 'natural', and most definitely not necessary. I've filmed myself enough to know i dont do it. at all.

 

No worries then, lets agree to agree (which I think we probably do, just in different words) or agree to disagree, whatever the case may be. My point is you won't see it but you may feel it, so filming it won't help. I'm sure you are instinctively doing it right. But for someone who isn't aware of the mechanism it can be helpful to experiment with it in a visible way to just to get the feeling for it. Once you know what countersteer feels like your cornering skill is transformed, whether you know you are doing it or not.

Edited March 14, 2014 by beanz

[beanz]

He's talking about the Scandinavian flick. If you watch a few vids of people like Matti Leikonen and Ben Reid you'll see what he's talking about.

 

I'm talking about the basics but yes it's the same principle in action. The flick gets you into the lean and you rail out of it. One day I'll hopefully be able to do that!

[Guest Omega Man]

I'm talking about the basics but yes it's the same principle in action. The flick gets you into the lean and you rail out of it. One day I'll hopefully be able to do that!

Yeah. Love to be able to do a Scandi.

[Capricorn]

He's talking about the Scandinavian flick. If you watch a few vids of people like Matti Leikonen and Ben Reid you'll see what he's talking about.

 

i dont think it's that. that little flick is meant to scrub speed, not help you turn a corner. What Bean is suggesting is a means to turn corners as a basic technique. I'm not in agreement, or maybe i'm just not advanced enough yet...

[Capricorn]

I'm talking about the basics but yes it's the same principle in action. The flick gets you into the lean and you rail out of it. One day I'll hopefully be able to do that!

 

as basics go, its not necessary. At all. When you lean the bike, the frontwheel does not turn counter the direction of the corner. It may flop over as a consequence of the shift in weight onto the outside pedal, but you can shift weight, lean bike over, turn the corner very successfully and at silly speed, without a single arcsecond of counter steering or flopping over of the front wheel.

 

Kinematics of turning a corner does not require countersteer. The physics doesn't lie. I'm not saying you can't countersteer and corner, i'm saying its not necessary at any speed and for any reason other than a misguided concept.

 

or as i mentioned earlier, maybe i'm not advanced enough for this flick thing.

Edited March 14, 2014 by Capricorn

[beanz]

The brakes are for scrubbing speed. The flick is for looking cool!

Edited March 14, 2014 by beanz