Guest Smimby Posted December 9, 2014 Share That's what was discussed last year at the AMARider symposium on trail building / maintenance / control. A blanket ban. It just seems that people don't want to listen and going the whole legal route is also not ideal...so once the rider is caught on camera, he is sent a letter stating that he was caught rogue riding and he can appeal...if not a blanket ban. If the process to do this is followed properly, ie not he said she said.....it could work well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Smimby Posted December 9, 2014 Share The sad reality is that it is very hard to enforce. Imagine first having the attendant taking your trail fees go through a mugshot file to see if your face was in it. Then there is the cost of maintaining the database, validation of offences etc. It becomes a separate animal to feed. Cheaper and easier than the legal route...and you don't involve the land owner. Also you can not knock it if you have not tried it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted December 9, 2014 Share The sad reality is that it is very hard to enforce. Imagine first having the attendant taking your trail fees go through a mugshot file to see if your face was in it. Then there is the cost of maintaining the database, validation of offences etc. It becomes a separate animal to feed. AMA were going to host it and control it through a centralised database. Trail centres just send them details of riders who don't adhere to the central tenets, and BAM. A mail goes out to all events & other trail centres, saying XYZ has abused ABC and is hereby included in the suspensions list for 2015/2016. All that needs to happen is an amended T's & C's for the club they belong to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLuvsMtb Posted December 9, 2014 Share Cheaper and easier than the legal route...and you don't involve the land owner. Also you can not knock it if you have not tried itI knew a chap that was banned from Newlands stadium for misconduct. He didn't miss a game for the rest of that season as the ban meant nothing and was almost impossible to enforce (you don't show your ID when you purchase tickets). Its like having points deducted from your drivers license. It only works if you can effectively enforce it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Smimby Posted December 9, 2014 Share I knew a chap that was banned from Newlands stadium for misconduct. He didn't miss a game for the rest of that season as the ban meant nothing and was almost impossible to enforce (you don't show your ID when you purchase tickets). Its like having points deducted from your drivers license. It only works if you can effectively enforce it. Hmm you are comparing thousands of people going into a staduim to 3 riders rocking up at meerendal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLuvsMtb Posted December 9, 2014 Share AMA were going to host it and control it through a centralised database. Trail centres just send them details of riders who don't adhere to the central tenets, and BAM. A mail goes out to all events & other trail centres, saying XYZ has abused ABC and is hereby included in the suspensions list for 2015/2016. All that needs to happen is an amended T's & C's for the club they belong to. Good on AMA to look at ways to become relevant again in the SA mtb context. I am afraid that they were sitting on their hands for too long to now get buy-in from trail owners. If it comes off we will all be better off, but AMA policing then just becomes another trail tax that law abiding riders have to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLuvsMtb Posted December 9, 2014 Share Hmm you are comparing thousands of people going into a staduim to 3 riders rocking up at meerendal?I think Meerendal gets more than 3 riders a day... and then the guy controlling access is the security guard who gets paid R10 / hour to sit there, and at Hoogekraal there is an honesty box, and when you get to welvanpas there is a waitress at the coffee shop that takes your trail fees, not Blayne Sheperd. At best you can hope to ban these guys at events, but then they rock up under a friend's details and ride anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Smimby Posted December 9, 2014 Share Good on AMA to look at ways to become relevant again in the SA mtb context. I am afraid that they were sitting on their hands for too long to now get buy-in from trail owners. If it comes off we will all be better off, but AMA policing then just becomes another trail tax that law abiding riders have to pay. Why are you so negative about everything? People come here and try to give solutions / options but you just shoot it all down. Now you even shooting down what AMA tried, maybe take a deep breath of CPT air and try and look at things with a fresh open mind #just saying Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JGR Posted December 9, 2014 Share you would think people working in an office like this should be able to understand basic lawWhat about an office like this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLuvsMtb Posted December 9, 2014 Share Why are you so negative about everything? People come here and try to give solutions / options but you just shoot it all down. Now you even shooting down what AMA tried, maybe take a deep breath of CPT air and try and look at things with a fresh open mind #just sayingSorry, but I cannot sing kum-ba-ja about these types of proposals. I have to question on how this would actually work and who would end up paying for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Headshot Posted December 9, 2014 Share I always pay the gate fee at Hoogekraal or Contermans. On one occasion at Hoogies a member asked us if we had paid in a bit of an accusatorial fashion. Of course we said, which he accepted but we had no proof that we had. At least at Conties you fill out a ticket and put that in with your money. the same system at the other venues would be good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted December 9, 2014 Share Sorry, but I cannot sing kum-ba-ja about these types of proposals. I have to question on how this would actually work and who would end up paying for this. No payment afaik. Just a centralised database. It wouldn't take much, and would be up to the individual trail centres / events to police once they have info on rogue riders and people just flouting the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted December 9, 2014 Share I always pay the gate fee at Hoogekraal or Contermans. On one occasion at Hoogies a member asked us if we had paid in a bit of an accusatorial fashion. Of course we said, which he accepted but we had no proof that we had. At least at Conties you fill out a ticket and put that in with your money. the same system at the other venues would be good.I still think that SnapScan is a fantastic way for this to be done. Scan on entry, pay, you get an SMS / payment receipt and BAM. There's your proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disylizzy Posted December 9, 2014 Share Sorry, but I cannot sing kum-ba-ja about these types of proposals. I have to question on how this would actually work and who would end up paying for this. You can implement it with race entries - more specifically races that you need to pre-enter in. That would easily be able to be controlled. I mean what if you want to do Joberg2C, or Sani2C, or Attakwas, or, or, or... you won't be able to... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Disylizzy Posted December 9, 2014 Share I always pay the gate fee at Hoogekraal or Contermans. On one occasion at Hoogies a member asked us if we had paid in a bit of an accusatorial fashion. Of course we said, which he accepted but we had no proof that we had. At least at Conties you fill out a ticket and put that in with your money. the same system at the other venues would be good. A new day permit will be implemented for people to ride on TMBC trails. With a board shown. Similar to what Bottelary do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GLuvsMtb Posted December 9, 2014 Share No payment afaik. Just a centralised database. It wouldn't take much, and would be up to the individual trail centres / events to police once they have info on rogue riders and people just flouting the rules. ... and in the small print it say that the trail has to be affiliated to AMA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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