Do you think parents love their kids if...

[dirtrider]

Only if the seatbelt fit the cop . Most of them can not even get into the front seat of the car ! It is really very heart warming to see how perfect we all on the hub are . No wait that came out wrong , it makes me wanna puke !! A F#@#king 3 year old that smells of tobaco smoke ?? WTF have they locked him into a smoking room for a few days ? My 2 year old sit in the front seat , ride on the bike with me and come into my pub where I smoke 30 smokes a day , BTW she also eats red meat , Kentucy and lots of sweets . Report me to welfare !!

[Topwine]

 

Imo, it's the other things that make a good loving parent. I've been lucky not to be in an accident, even after 500000km of driving. So the seatbelt issue is small in relation to the real problems of parenting!

 

PS I'd also buy a car seat and use it 95+% of the time when I have kids one day

 

I'd like you to revisit this post, once you actually have kids one day. Me thinks, (if you are the kind of parent you describe above) that the 95% will turn into 100 % , because all those other things you want to do with your kids will mean nothing if you lose them during that 5 % of time...

[Topwine]

It is a big issue because children do not have choices when it comes to decisions their parents make. And hopefully discussing this openly will help us all see another side of things. If we all sat back and accepted that bad parenting was ok then we would be failing as a society. Society work well when it acts as a whole, but when it stops worrying about the needs and cares of those who cannot protect themselves it fails.

 

I still cannot understand how a person can say they care for their child if they willingly do not provide them with safety. And if you do not care, do you truly love your child like you should?

 

I think you are a bit naive in thinking "discussing" will change behavior. Humans are glorified monkeys. Monkey see, monkey do. People change behavior if they have the social incentive to do so.

[baie-sukkel]

You forgot to metion - smoking with kids in the car. Ever smelt a 3 year old that reeks of ciggies? Ever heard them cough?

 

 

DITTO !!

[bikemonster]

Normal parents love their children.

 

Some parents evaluate risks differently to others.

 

When I was casting around for a bike seat for son of bikemonster, when he was tiny, a post on the US Bicycling mag forums got responses telling me that putting him in a "kid catapult" was marginally less dangerous than letting him play on a dual carriageway. I did it anyway.

 

Now he's bigger, one of his favourite things to do is drive with me in my '62 MG, which doesn't have seatbelts.

 

One of his other favourite things is to ride shotgun with me when I do track days.

 

I am well aware of the dangers of both of these activities, but I have decided that the joy to be had outweighs the dangers.

 

And everybody, absolutely everybody, does things, and lets their kids do things, that somebody else thinks is unconscionably dangerous.

 

So let's have a little less of the sanctimonious hand wringing, shall we?

[Topwine]

To maybe illustrate my point further...

 

It's not only about not wearing seat belts because kids think its uncool, or their peers don't wear them. It's about a lot of other things we as kids did or did not do (or were allowed not to) and in the current generation we as parents battle with the change in perception or social norm.

 

Take video games and movies for instance. I "compromised" with my youngest (4 years old ) the other day (to the objection of my wife) and let him watch the whole Star Wars series with his older brothers. My wife and I noticed an immediate behavior change to more violent actions. Anyone think this is good? Even though everyone else is letting their children play very violent video games and watching violent movies? Me thinks not. I have cancelled my DSTV since and spend the extra time on my bike with my kids and other outdoor activities with them. I now download via the internet what I think is appropriate to watch by them.

 

You can add alcohol, drugs, uncontrolled sleepovers, whatever you want to this example. Just because everyone else is doing something, does not mean you have to throw away your brain as well.

[Lucky Luke.]

Like somebody else said, I don't think love comes into it. Some people are just not very well equipped to perpetuate their corner of the gene pool. It's not about the love, it's about how you externalise it in a practical sense by using your pip.

[Topwine]

Normal parents love their children.

 

Some parents evaluate risks differently to others.

 

 

One of his other favourite things is to ride shotgun with me when I do track days.

 

I am well aware of the dangers of both of these activities, but I have decided that the joy to be had outweighs the dangers.

 

 

While not judging you, have you considered if an accident where to happen and your son got mangled in the process. One day later when your son is more rational and start to think for himself, he asks you why you let him ride shotgun with you. Will you answer, "son because I loved you" ? You think he will believe you or think you were just being selfish?

 

Ps. I struggle with these issues every day having 3 adventurous boys.

[bikemonster]

While not judging you, have you considered if an accident where to happen and your son got mangled in the process.

 

Like I said, everybody weighs up the risks and decides what they are happy to deal with.

 

In my case the following things entered into the equation:

1 - I've been motor racing for a few years, so I figure I know what I'm doing.

2 - We went out in a group where the rules of engagement (no overtaking between brake point and corner exit) were such that I figured the major cause of danger was me, not hooligans out to prove how fast they were.

 

As Bilbo Baggins said, "it's a dangerous business stepping outside your front door".

[Topwine]

Like I said, everybody weighs up the risks and decides what they are happy to deal with.

 

In my case the following things entered into the equation:

1 - I've been motor racing for a few years, so I figure I know what I'm doing.

 

 

Yes, that's true, but then also most accidents happen because people misjudged those risks, or not perceived there to be any risk at all ...

 

How many of those years were spent racing with a small boy alongside you ?

[bikemonster]

How many of those years were spent racing with a small boy alongside you ?

 

I am a small boy!

 

A track day is a very different proposition from racing wheel to wheel.

 

In many ways I honestly believe that driving on our roads is more dangerous than taking part in a track day.

 

And riding a bicycle on the roads, as most of us here do, is prolly more dangerous than either.

[Topwine]

Funny, I just read a very good article on parenting:

 

Why Chinese Mothers Are Superior

 

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704111504576059713528698754.html?KEYWORDS=china+parents

 

A lot of people wonder how Chinese parents raise such stereotypically successful kids. They wonder what these parents do to produce so many math whizzes and music prodigies, what it's like inside the family, and whether they could do it too. Well, I can tell them, because I've done it. Here are some things my daughters, Sophia and Louisa, were never allowed to do:

 

• attend a sleepover

 

• have a playdate

 

• be in a school play

 

• complain about not being in a school play

 

• watch TV or play computer games

 

• choose their own extracurricular activities

 

• get any grade less than an A

 

• not be the No. 1 student in every subject except gym and drama

 

• play any instrument other than the piano or violin

 

• not play the piano or violin.

 

I'm using the term "Chinese mother" loosely. I know some Korean, Indian, Jamaican, Irish and Ghanaian parents who qualify too. Conversely, I know some mothers of Chinese heritage, almost always born in the West, who are not Chinese mothers, by choice or otherwise. I'm also using the term "Western parents" loosely. Western parents come in all varieties.

 

Read more: http://www.businessinsider.com/chinese-parents-2011-1?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+clusterstock+%28ClusterStock%29#ixzz1AY5L4NuA

[bikemonster]

At this point, it seems appropriate to digress into some poetry. This is "This Be The Verse", by Philip Larkin, one of the greatest poets of the 20th Century.

 

Be warned, it uses strong language. If strong language offends you, well, tough.

 

 

They **** you up, your mum and dad.

They may not mean to, but they do.

They fill you with the faults they had

And add some extra, just for you.

 

But they were fcuked up in their turn

By fools in old-style hats and coats,

Who half the time were soppy-stern

And half at one another's throats.

 

Man hands on misery to man.

It deepens like a coastal shelf.

Get out as early as you can,

And don't have any kids yourself.

Edited January 9, 2011 by bikemonster

[GrumpyOldGuy]

Well, I wont get into the seatbelt debate but I just watched in absolute morbid fasination a show on Reality tv called "Half ton Dad" followed closely by "Half ton Son" - actually they were not related but the son got to weigh 430 odd kilograms because his mother simply fed him all day, "out of love" she says.

 

As the doctor said "thats not love, you are killing him".

 

Has anyone else seen the show, its incredible that someone can just get to that size, the "Dad" weighed in at at a hefty 450kg's and had not been able to get out of bed for 4 years.........!!

[TNT1]

So where are we on the love that these morons have for their offspring, when they may or may not buckle them in, but then speed, fail to stop at streets, red lights, and otherwise drive as if they are rushing to the scene of the accident?

Edited January 9, 2011 by TNT1

[chris_w_65]

Well, I wont get into the seatbelt debate but I just watched in absolute morbid fasination a show on Reality tv called "Half ton Dad" followed closely by "Half ton Son" - actually they were not related but the son got to weigh 430 odd kilograms because his mother simply fed him all day, "out of love" she says.

 

As the doctor said "thats not love, you are killing him".

 

Has anyone else seen the show, its incredible that someone can just get to that size, the "Dad" weighed in at at a hefty 450kg's and had not been able to get out of bed for 4 years.........!!

 

I am hoping you really mean pounds