Are bike fits worthless for mountain biking?

[TNT1]

Ok.

 

Done.

 

What about all my White Kit, can I use that on a MTB?

 

Or will I be sorry?

 

Ask sauser. I seen him wear white. Of course, you may have to turn to the dark side (your soul, I mean) to make it work.

[The Drongo]

Ask sauser. I seen him wear white. Of course, you may have to turn to the dark side (your soul, I mean) to make it work.

 

Right. Was he the Swiss fella that took off through the farmland?

 

He mighta got away with it if he had been wearing camo rather. All black?......nah! They woulda just shot him.

 

The last part? - Reckon you should make your own juice, and not let the current wife do it for ya.

 

Bye now. Off to fit some Schwalbe Smart Sams to the "Road" bike - no joke! I asked Sauser.

[jimmy hardtail]

In winter I sometimes ride in jeans. Bike fit not applicable

[Bike Fitter]

In general, but unfortunately, this article may actually be right based on what many bike fits are and provide. So if it pisses off some folks maybe it should. However, a proper bike fit is so much more and beyond what is mentioned in this article.

 

So let’s take a look at some of the comments. “A bike fit is extremely overrated for mountain biking.” That indeed is a very unfortunate thought and comment. In fact I would suggest the opposite of that is true.

 

“First, bike fits usually just help you maximize your dysfunctions, which may result in a short term performance gain but does not really make you a better rider.” That is unfortunate if that is the case because the reality is a bike fit addresses much more like a person’s asymmetries. We are asymmetrical and the bike is not (for the most part …maybe one pedal is wider on the drive side….maybe). A bike fit should improve the connection and alignment for optimum function which is to help the cyclist provide optimum performance.

“Second, I strongly believe that seated pedaling is simply bad for the body in the first place and should be minimized, not fortified.” Maybe on some bikes but it certainly can be the more efficient way in some situations.

 

“Lastly, bike fits rarely take the technical skill side of trail riding into account.” Maybe he is right that “rarely” this is taken into account." However, a good bike fit should conduct a thorough interview and absolutely consider the cyclists skills.

 

“If you are performing a bike fit on a rider who does not have a clean Functional Movement Screen (2s on everything with no asymmetries) then you are no better than the doctor who prescribes pills before trying to get the patient to make the lifestyle changes needed to fix the real problem. How can you “fit” anything when someone can’t even touch their toes or perform a half-ass bodyweight squat without falling apart?” First and foremost – “Asymmetry is a rule not the exception,” Richard Jackson PT. The bike may not have asymmetries but the human body is full of asymmetries. Many people ride a bike and if someone cannot touch their toes they may need more help but is it bad they ride a bike? In most cases I suggest it is not bad. But if the person wants to ride a bike it is the bike fitters job to help fit them the best they can based on what this person brings to the table. I have met plenty of cyclist s that cannot touch their toes and ride quite well and do so in comfort and enjoy it while cycling enhances their life in many ways. I would think cycling is still a good thing for most people even if they cannot touch their toes.

 

“The only thing you are fitting is their dysfunctions to the bike. Allowing someone to lean even harder on bad movement so they can go further and faster is not really helping the situation. The fact that no one ever gets a fit that lasts forever should tell your something – since the fit did not fix the underlying problem of bad movement habits the body eventually develops pain in new areas. Fix the movement issue first and then see what needs to be done.” Great point in the no one gets a fits that lasts forever. That should seem obvious. Remember a good bike fit is a snap shot in time. It is how the person is and functions today. Once the person changes then so may the bike fit. Plenty of good bike fits evolve over a period of time. Not all happen once and done.

“A bike fit only “works” as long as you are sitting down – as soon as you stand up all the precious measurements go out the window and you are no longer benefitting from your investment.” This is categorically untrue. In fact a good bike fit (which of course includes the foot/pedal interface as part of the fitting process) would facilitate and improve mechanics while standing…..

 

“Standing up naturally takes care of any “fit” issues as it forces full knee extension, fuller hip extension, a straighter spine and less strain on the neck. Sitting down to pedal places your body in a jacked up position and a fit is simply trying to make the best of a bad situation.” WOW this one is off the charts. The feet are the most important connection to the bike and can have significant effects on the body up the chain. Standing up can actually exacerbate a fit issue not take care of fit issue.

 

“On the trail, standing up more is the mark of a strong, confident rider and it also naturally takes care of “fit” issues.” Interesting in that I never viewed standing up and the mark of a strong and confident rider but maybe it is in the eyes of some.

 

“Trail riding requires a large degree of technical skill, which is something that most bike fits don’t take into account. To maximize your trail riding you want to outfit your bike in a way that will allow for maximum skill and efficiency – which means prioritizing the bike, not the rider.” In general a bike fitter should do his best to make the bike fit the rider and his or her technical skills not the other way around. Of course a proper bike and equipment play into this but selecting that equipment is part of proper bike fit.

 

“On the trail you need to select your tool based on its ability to do what you want on the trail and then fit your body to that tool. Don’t force an inferior tool on yourself when what you really need is some good ol’ mobility and strength work.” It should be obvious the tool or equipment be the proper tool or equipment but it needs to fit the cyclist not the other way around.

 

There is more to review here but I need to try and wrap this up. First and foremost the foot/pedal is bar far the most important part of ALL bike fits. Not once did it mention the feet and their control of the bike. On a mtn bike or trail bike the feet help steer and control the bike. In fact I would say that is more important a factor here then on a road bike. Try something putting your road pedals on your trail bike and use your road shoes. Almost always you will immediately feel the improved control you have of your bike. Yes most clip-in pedal for mtn or trail are small and sloppy fitting. Perhaps this sloppy fit is even part of the issue.

 

There is more to assess and adjust on one shoe then there is to assess and adjust a saddle. Add in both feet because they are often different then you have more adjustments necessary at the feet then the rest of bike. So if a significant part of your bike fit is not covering the feet you are not getting a real bike fit. You are getting a partial bike fit at best.

One of the best mtn/trail bike fitter in the world is Dave Howells of www.bcbikefit.com. He has taken the process to another level making sure the fit, the equipment and skill are addressed in a bike fit. For other foot/pedal info this articel may be of interest http://www.bikefit.com/s-13-road-bikes.aspx#Feet

 

 

Based on the experience of the person who wrote this article it may be true from that perspective. I hope one day he is able to experience a good and proper bike fit which does a good job of addressing the feet. Our experience tells us his perspective will change.

Edited December 29, 2011 by Bike Fitter

[DJR]

Hi Bikefitter

 

Welcome. Your reply above must win the prize for most rational 1st post ever on the Hub. Keep it coming.

[Colin H]

Someone once said that wisdom is knowing what you don't know.

 

For the disbelievers in a proper fitting, think about how fidly we get in sorting out the seat position in our car. Then someone moves it one notch and we pick it up straight away!

[Mojoman]

"There is more to review here but I need to try and wrap this up. First and foremost the foot/pedal is bar far the most important part of ALL bike fits. Not once did it mention the feet and their control of the bike. On a mtn bike or trail bike the feet help steer and control the bike. In fact I would say that is more important a factor here then on a road bike. Try something putting your road pedals on your trail bike and use your road shoes. Almost always you will immediately feel the improved control you have of your bike. Yes most clip-in pedal for mtn or trail are small and sloppy fitting. Perhaps this sloppy fit is even part of the issue. "

 

I don't know about sloppy but why are mountain bike pedals so much smaller than road bike ones?

[Capricorn]

 

[/b]I don't know about sloppy but why are mountain bike pedals so much smaller than road bike ones?

 

this is just me sucking my thumb here, but...

 

MTB shoes have spikes to assist with grip during portage sections, but the shoe still has to clip in without having a ridiculous shim stack to make the cleat reach the pedal. Also, small pedals are less of mud catchers and shed mud easier.

[goya-goya]

"There is more to review here but I need to try and wrap this up. First and foremost the foot/pedal is bar far the most important part of ALL bike fits. Not once did it mention the feet and their control of the bike. On a mtn bike or trail bike the feet help steer and control the bike. In fact I would say that is more important a factor here then on a road bike. Try something putting your road pedals on your trail bike and use your road shoes. Almost always you will immediately feel the improved control you have of your bike. Yes most clip-in pedal for mtn or trail are small and sloppy fitting. Perhaps this sloppy fit is even part of the issue. "

 

I don't know about sloppy but why are mountain bike pedals so much smaller than road bike ones?

 

Dude... your avatar is unnerving!!! I almost slapped my screen "stikkend" thinking it was a miggie

[Captain Fastbastard Mayhem]

Dude... your avatar is unnerving!!! I almost slapped my screen "stikkend" thinking it was a miggie

You're not the first...

[rob_mtb]

Ah, but you see then there are some of us who do not throw copious amounts of money at the sport but do it bare bones just for the enjoyment of it. I still ride with takkies on, much to the disgust of all and sundry who insist I MUST gets cleats. Yeah, so I am losing a few percent in efficiency but does that really matter when I am just doing it for fun? I am not trying to win any races.

 

No doubt a few of you will say that being opposed to this just stems from jealousy that you cannot afford it. I can but I seriously feel the R400 can be put to better use elsewhere. But then again I am not pounding out 100s of kilometres every week...

 

Now, no one who has suggested I pay for a bike fit has ever taken this usage pattern or my lack of cleats etc into account when insisting I MUST get a bike fit done. So again I will say that it is not the no brainer that so many are insisting. To me it differs very little from the newbie pumping huge money into the latest shoes/bike/gear because they want to be faster. Just get out there and ride I say.

 

 

 

I'm still seriously interested in how this bike fit, with possible 4mm adjustments to my saddle height, is going to prevent me from crashing. Or more accurately, how not getting one done is going to dramatically increase my chances of having said wipeout.

 

And, if we aren't talking about a bike shop, do these "experts" advertise their services? I have a few friends that I bounce ideas off but as with this forum each one seems to have their own opinion on things. I really fail to see how this differs so dramatically from anything I read online. Here too you find opinions. It is for you to be intelligent enough to realise which advice is worth taking and which to ignore.

 

I can honestly say that I do not for one second believe that not getting a bike fit done will make my mountain biking experience vastly more dangerous.

hang on, so someone who openly claims to know nothing and is a newbie, is so sure that a pro bike fit isn't going to improve his ride? I think being closed minded will curb your skills madly, and make you a real PITA at braais.

[TNT1]

I setup my mtb with exactly the same measurements as my road bike, and then just dropped the saddle a teeny bit to accommodate the nature of the trail. Works for me.

[Capricorn]

rob: the bike fit = skills? Always thought skills cant be bought?

Bike fit is about cycling efficiency for a given type of cycling. DH for instance with it's highly variable terrain, a bike fit is almost utterly useless beyond setting teh obvious of setting up the cockpit so that the rider is comfy riding. That's it.

For what bike james was saying, as a trail rider, where the terrain is highly variable, a bike fit will produce highly diminished returns because a bike fit by definition assumes a stationary position on the saddle. if you spend seconds in your saddle, it's not gonna be of benefit to be professionaly fitted.

[goya-goya]

I have ridden trails in JHB, PTA, DBN, CPT, SABI, FREESTATE AND OTHER PLACES... and I can promise you that I have not seen one person ride as presented by the people who say a bike fit will not help!... yea sure... when the trails get knarly... we all gunn it... but there are never trails that present standing up as the only option for more than 30% of the ride (the percentage assumption is mine... not a fact) unless you only go downhill...

 

I did a 80km KZN Outsurance Inanda ride in November... That race had about 60km of single track in the 80km!!! serious XC singletrack - awesome!... I flew in from JHB and had to setup my bike... Like an idiot I did not fasten my seat tube enough... seat dropped by 2 cm.... by the time I realized it... I had already had the most agonizing cramps...

 

What I am trying to say is that - for me and more most of everyone I have ever seen riding anywhere - even if you sit for 1 hour in a total riding time of 4 hours... it is gonna help you...

 

Let me reserve the few people who are supremely fit by way of cross training where this will have no effect... (read up on how muscles work)

 

But hey if no setup works for you, then sweeeet! enjoy your ride... for me on da ah-va hand Darren... I could not do without it...

 

Its a new year... Enjoy the ride!