Strava Suffer Score vs TrainerRoad TSS

[Spirog]

I'm putting together a new training program based primarily on a TrainerRoad plan.

 

However, the TR plan is exclusively for indoor training and I obviously want to get some outdoor rides into the program as well.

 

This morning, I did a Sufferfest video on TrainerRoad. Strava gave me a Suffer Score of 61 points, while TR gave me a TSS of 56. 

 

Does anyone have any idea how these numbers relate to each other?

 

Obviously when I'm training indoors, it's not an issue as I have both the TR and Sufferfest scores available.

 

However, when I ride outdoors and only have a Strava Suffer Score, I'd like to be able to relate it back to the TR TSS to get some accurate feedback on my training program.

 

 

[Oufy MTB (Roadie)]

Not to hijack the thread, but what does this graph mean on Strava. I don't even know if 37 is good or bad

[Spirog]

Not to hijack the thread, but what does this graph mean on Strava. I don't even know if 37 is good or bad

The number itself on the Fitness & Freshness graph doesn't really matter. What you're looking at is a trend. Are you getting fitter and are you more or less tired while doing that?

[IdeJongh]

I'm putting together a new training program based primarily on a TrainerRoad plan.

 

However, the TR plan is exclusively for indoor training and I obviously want to get some outdoor rides into the program as well.

 

This morning, I did a Sufferfest video on TrainerRoad. Strava gave me a Suffer Score of 61 points, while TR gave me a TSS of 56. 

 

Does anyone have any idea how these numbers relate to each other?

 

Obviously when I'm training indoors, it's not an issue as I have both the TR and Sufferfest scores available.

 

However, when I ride outdoors and only have a Strava Suffer Score, I'd like to be able to relate it back to the TR TSS to get some accurate feedback on my training program.

 

Suffer score on Strava is based on the time you spent in various HR zones, marginally correlates to TSS.  Another way is to use the est. power calced in strava (based on body and bike weight) and calculate your own TSS.  Again this will only be an estimate, because many other variables (terrain, wind, etc) are not accounted for in this method.  But all in all it does add value.  I trained like that last year and worked for me

[rouxtjie]

Suffer score on Strava is based on the time you spent in various HR zones, marginally correlates to TSS.  Another way is to use the est. power calced in strava (based on body and bike weight) and calculate your own TSS.  Again this will only be an estimate, because many other variables (terrain, wind, etc) are not accounted for in this method.  But all in all it does add value.  I trained like that last year and worked for me

this

[IdeJongh]

Not to hijack the thread, but what does this graph mean on Strava. I don't even know if 37 is good or bad

 

There are many factors.  It's a value of current fitness, but the 'reactivity' of the graph is based on your FTP, or HR zones...AND a rider at 50 with an FTP of 250 is much stronger than a rider at 55 with an FTP at 210.

 

SO....if you keep ticking the graph upward, managing your form levels in the low negatives, and then get your form above 0 right before a race you should be good to go.

 

Law of diminishing returns apply quickly, to get tick the graph higher you need more and more training load.

[Jay_B]

What was said previously... use the est. avg power from strava and calculate your TSS. Its not 100% accurate and if anything is slightly conservative which isnt such a bad thing either.

 

I use Trainer Road as well during the week and then ride on the road during the weekend, most of their plans have a 3 hour session on weekends so just read the details of what intervals are included for that session and incorporate them on your ride.

[Spirog]

Suffer score on Strava is based on the time you spent in various HR zones, marginally correlates to TSS.  Another way is to use the est. power calced in strava (based on body and bike weight) and calculate your own TSS.  Again this will only be an estimate, because many other variables (terrain, wind, etc) are not accounted for in this method.  But all in all it does add value.  I trained like that last year and worked for me

What is the formula for calculating TSS from estimated power? In words of one syllable please. 

[Rudi Pollard]

The fitness and freshness graph on Strava does not mean anything to me as it calculates the graph using only bike rides. I do a lot of cross training which is not included in the graph.

[IdeJongh]

What is the formula for calculating TSS from estimated power? In words of one syllable please. 

 

TSS = (sec x NP x IF)/(FTP x 3600) x 100

 

sec = Time of workout in seconds

NP = normalized power (strava weighted avg est)

IF = intensity factor (NP / FTP)

FTP = your current FTP

 

and Bob's your uncle

[TrevorDeRuise]

I'm putting together a new training program based primarily on a TrainerRoad plan.

 

However, the TR plan is exclusively for indoor training and I obviously want to get some outdoor rides into the program as well.

 

This morning, I did a Sufferfest video on TrainerRoad. Strava gave me a Suffer Score of 61 points, while TR gave me a TSS of 56. 

 

Does anyone have any idea how these numbers relate to each other?

 

Obviously when I'm training indoors, it's not an issue as I have both the TR and Sufferfest scores available.

 

However, when I ride outdoors and only have a Strava Suffer Score, I'd like to be able to relate it back to the TR TSS to get some accurate feedback on my training program.

Do you by chance have a power meter? If so, you can upload your outdoor rides to something like the free version of Training Peaks and it will give you TSS data. Otherwise, utilizing HR is the next best way to go. As you've already seen, the Suffer Score on Strava isn't 100% in line with TSS, but it can provide a good estimate of training stress from a ride.

 

Here's a good article on incorporating outdoor rides into your TR training: Outdoor Workout Substitutions Q&A

[Spirog]

Do you by chance have a power meter? 

I'm just starting to think about investing in a power meter. I'm sure I'll find some excuse soon...

[Today's Plan]

Firstly ensure your HR Threshold is set correctly and the same in both program's otherwise will differ. If using power meter ensure your FTP is tested recently and are the same in all programs:

 

You can use Today's Plan analytic's for R90 per month or R900 (way cheaper than Training Peaks) Also there's a 15% HUB discount code on offer for 15% off training plans and analytic's!

 

https://whats.todaysplan.com.au/my-services/premium

 

What is a T-score?:

 

This value is a calculated score used to objectively measure rides completed with power data. The formula takes into account both the ride intensity and duration. If you are working to a plan, then a session will have a target T-Score – in which case you need to ride to both the specified duration and intensity to reach the desired goal. Generally speaking, a T-Score of 30 would be an easy hour recovery ride, 120 would be a solid 2 hour training ride, and 300 would be a massive Sunday epic. 

 

In Today's Plan  we use a T-score:

 

Our T-Score algorithm is similar to that of TSS, but there are some differences. It’s unlikely they will ever match up exactly.

Although the T-Score algorithm uses the well published algorithm of (secs * adjusted power * if) / (threshold power * 3600) / 100 – the devil is in the details of how to accumulate values.

To calculate adjusted power, you need to take 30s windows of power values. You then calculate an adjusted average for each 30s window. But what happens when there is missing values in that window?

ie a power meter has not logged a value, a head unit has not accumulated a value, affect of pause, affect of coasting, some head units only log values every 2s (or more), power meters can stop logging for small periods of time etc etc

We have our own algorithm for how we accumulate values within each 30s window – and this will be different to Garmin, TrainingPeaks, Strava etc

A common cause for a difference is if the rider has a Garmin headunit and it is configured to include 0’s in the power calculations, or if the Garmin headunit was in Smart Recording mode. In this case the TSS value recored within the Garmin .FIT file will be significantly higher then the T-Score calculation. In some cases, other systems will use the Garmin FIT summary records without recalculating.

 

https://whats.todaysplan.com.au/help/should-the-t-score-match-trainingpeaks-com-garmin-tss

 

Give us a shout via our help line at www.todaysplan.co.za and can help you further!