ASG - An open letter, a good response, insights about race situation in SA

[Patchelicious]

While I agree that races are not cheap, and the expectations have grown to stupidly high levels by the paying rider BUT Perhaps a suggestion Mr OP...try putting on a race yourself it is not as easy as it looks and sounds and the cost of putting on events is extremely high...My 2c

You missed his point completely.

['Dale]

Look..... a flying pig......

Hehehe

True too true

[Tumbleweed]

Look..... a flying pig......

 

Did cops ever use Alouettes? 

 

https://community.bikehub.co.za/topic/104971-asg-helicopter-piloted-by-asg-boss/?hl=alouette&do=findComment&comment=1433412

[Ryinc]

While I agree that races are not cheap, and the expectations have grown to stupidly high levels by the paying rider BUT Perhaps a suggestion Mr OP...try putting on a race yourself it is not as easy as it looks and sounds and the cost of putting on events is extremely high...My 2c

This is a weak argument:

1. I clearly said that i don't believe it is easy to run events profitably and don't begrudge them making a healthy profit. However when party A runs a very similar quality event (sustainably) and charges say 70% of company B or company C runs a vastly superior event for similar costs as B, that raises questions about B's pricing, especially when B has a semi monopoly going.

2. I don't think electronic timing, and results within 48 hours are "stupidly high" expectations for a premium price event especially when the organiser explicitly committed themselves to these themselves. My expectations are also based on the quality of other providers of events (same as any other market)

3. Your argument that i should try run my own event is analogous to arguing that i should try building my own car because i think it is poor business practice and unfair treatment of customers that VW cheated on emissions scores, but manufacturing cars is more difficult and expensive than people think and so this is acceptable.

 

As stated in my letter i am grateful that ASG arranges the events, as at least there are events and many of their ideas are constructive e.g. introducing stage road racing again. For the most part i enjoy their races (e.g satellite classic this month was great). Do i have any ounce of brand loyalty to them despite being a "customer" for multiple years. Not an ounce because the culture of the business (to me) feels that it is profit at absolutely all costs. Thats quite an unhealthy place for a business to be if you ask me.

[Baaisikilist]

This is a weak argument:

1. I clearly said that i don't believe it is easy to run events profitably and don't begrudge them making a healthy profit. However when party A runs a very similar quality event (sustainably) and charges say 70% of company B or company C runs a vastly superior event for similar costs as B, that raises questions about B's pricing, especially when B has a semi monopoly going.

2. I don't think electronic timing, and results within 48 hours are "stupidly high" expectations for a premium price event especially when the organiser explicitly committed themselves to these themselves. My expectations are also based on the quality of other providers of events (same as any other market)

3. Your argument that i should try run my own event is analogous to arguing that i should try building my own car because i think it is poor business practice and unfair treatment of customers that VW cheated on emissions scores, but manufacturing cars is more difficult and expensive than people think and so this is acceptable.

 

As stated in my letter i am grateful that ASG arranges the events, as at least there are events and many of their ideas are constructive e.g. introducing stage road racing again. For the most part i enjoy their races (e.g satellite classic this month was great). Do i have any ounce of brand loyalty to them despite being a "customer" for multiple years. Not an ounce because the culture of the business (to me) feels that it is profit at absolutely all costs. Thats quite an unhealthy place for a business to be if you ask me.

DAMN, this guy's good...!

[ASG]

Thank you for your letter. It contains the most heartfelt and honest comments I have read in all my years following the Hub, understanding, of course, that the Hub is essentially a venting forum.

 

Against this backdrop your letter was like a breath of fresh air and you richly deserve a response.

 

Thanks for supporting us for so many years.

 

ASG took over the management of these mass participation road events because they were simply not going to continue if we didn’t assume the financial responsibility for their presentation.

 

We felt that we would get a measure of commercial value out of the marketing while at the same time doing a service to the sport by ensuring that these road events continue. Four years down the line, we’re feeling very differently.

 

Not only do these events still run at a substantial financial loss to us, even with external sponsorship, but they present a greater challenge every year to keep our riders (customers) happy in difficult traffic and road management circumstances.  ASG Sport Solutions, the import/distribution company (who ironically stand to lose most from poor brand representation) ironically has been funding the lion share of these losses over the past 3-4 years.

 

Cycling now also falls within the event’s act and most municipalities have become compliant this year, which has drastically increased costs. Road events are now pre-luded by at least 5 JOC meetings. This has further increased the financial burden on these events with various service suppliers all having to attend these meetings every time.

 

Although respondents on our post event surveys on our road races have given us an average 8 out of 10 thus far (and this includes the survey after the timing challenges on the Tour of Good Hope), we feel that these events are damaging our brand image and if we carry our current sentiments into next year, we won’t present them again.

 

The races you refer to – Carnival City Macsteel Classic and Race for Victory – have the same challenges, but they are run by non-profit organisations. These organisations only present one race a year and draw on lots of volunteers from schools, churches and rotary organisations who do things as a once off.  They don’t have to run a business and still they struggle to make these events finish out of the red financially.

 

You’re welcome to reference both the organisers of these events with whom we’re regular contact. They, in fact, assist us with the organisation – a lot of you would have seen Merv’s friendly marshalling face on the road at our events.

 

The Lost City Classic isn’t an ASG event, but the long time organiser there, Johan du Toit, has also approached us to take over the running of the event because he’s out of ideas on how to try and ensure that the Cancer Association benefits well enough out of the event.

 

Regarding the Sondela SuperClassic, I took the decision to do manual timing because the numbers on the event (370) didn’t justify Race Tec doing timing.

 

This year we have been influenced by ineffective CSA management of the race calendar, negatively impacting on three of our events.  First up was the Walkerville Classic, which clashed with the Magalies Monster, then came the Satellite Classic, which was placed on the same weekend as the Amashova.

And then, to crown it all off, they placed the Radio Pretoria Classic on the same day as the Sondela SuperClassic - a first year event in the place of a Classic that we have built up over three years to 850 riders last year.

The Sondela SuperClassic traditionally attracted 80% of its entrants from Pretoria. With another race, which is well organised by the Jacaranda Club in Pretoria on the same day, it was obviously going to affect the numbers drastically.

 

Let’s be honest, the Sondela Classic is as nice race in a nice environment, but it’s very similar to any other safe and well run road race. So if you have the option not to have to drive 200km to do the event when you have an alternative, you won’t.

 

But we still pushed through with the organisation. We have never cancelled an event because we don’t want to let riders down. At Sondela there were a total of 370 riders.

 

The results are published and we are happy to refund all riders who feel they didn’t get a good service in the absence of RaceTec. Please send me a personal mail and I will ensure your entry fee gets refunded (wynand@asgworld.co.za)

 

Manual timing is not an uncommon occurrence and our ASG crew competently do manual timing at a few of our events where it doesn’t make sense to do Race Tec timing.

 

Remember that in the Tour de Boland timing was done by Western Province officials and not our crew.  The Tour of Good Hope 2016 will have electronic timing - we committed to this from the outset.

 

Results will be shared with Race Tec and form part of the ASG seeding index.

 

Regarding the value offering at our events. The simple answer is that our entry fee increases this year were to try and limit the losses on the events.  It's hard to swallow all these comments about 'all about money and making profit' when anyone that's try to put a race together and truly understands the cost involved will tell you differently in no time.

 

I don’t think the entry deal at Sondela was bad. The long distance entry was R335, but it included a High 5 racing bottle with product valued at R130 as well as some other smaller goodie bag stuff. We don’t get these free of charge although heavily subsidised from HIGH5 (via ASG Sport Solutions - our sister company).  This is done in order to provide some kind of ‘added value’ at a race that is already more expensive to present simply from a location point of view.

 

Thank you again for supporting our events for such a long time.

From the honest tone of your letter, it’s clear that you are someone who appreciates the late nights and long hours our crew endure to successfully deliver these events year upon-year.

 

Your comments are valid and I hope that this explanation has put things in perspective from our side.

 

Regards

[Tumbleweed]

Nicely couched response :-)

 

These dudes just won the Internet today.

[Bloukrans]

Nicely couched response :-) These dudes just won the Internet today.

This is so unlike the Hub - no blood on the floor!

 

Well done to the OP and ASG for the matured posts!

 

See you on Friday!

[Skubarra]

 

The races you refer to – Carnival City Macsteel Classic and Race for Victory – have the same challenges, but they are run by non-profit organisations. These organisations only present one race a year and draw on lots of volunteers from schools, churches and rotary organisations who do things as a once off.  They don’t have to run a business and still they struggle to make these events finish out of the red financially.

 

Never thought I would defend ASG but...

 

I have mentioned this on the Durbie Dash thread but there I saw first hand how much volunteers were used who gave their time free of charge. Without them it just would not have been possible to host the event at a profit. (And hubbers, me included, are quick on social media to harshly criticize when things go wrong)

 

Made me wonder how hard it must be for an events company who have to pay everybody involved to make a profit out of hosting an event. There are certainly far easier ways to make money!

[Bloukrans]

Never thought I would defend ASG but...

 

I have mentioned this on the Durbie Dash thread but there I saw first hand how much volunteers were used who gave their time free of charge. Without them it just would not have been possible to host the event at a profit. (And hubbers, me included, are quick on social media to harshly criticize when things go wrong)

 

Made me wonder how hard it must be for an events company who have to pay everybody involved to make a profit out of hosting an event. There are certainly far easier ways to make money!

Agree - and a "thank you" to the marshalls on the route goes a long way.

 

On my way to car on Saturday, told the one marshall that it was good organised event and parking was lekker  - got a big smile from him!

[Ryinc]

Thank you for a comprehensive, well thought out and reasoned response. There are many points that made me think differently.

 

I think it was the wrong call to pull racetec timing, but i think your offer to refund anyone that feels they did not get what they paid for is a customer friendly response that is step further than what could otherwise be reasonably be expected. A measure of a company is not whether they mess up but how they respond.

 

I hope that your company is able to make fair and solid profits, but without the customer sentiments expressed in my open letter.

 

 

Thanks again for your time, i will change the title of the thread appropriately too.

[Iwan Kemp]

Thank you for your letter. 

 

...

 

Thank you for a comprehensive, well thought out and reasoned response.

 

...

 

Well done OP for being fair, straight and honest in your first. Well done ASG for replying in detail and hearing the guy out on an open forum. Then well done for the OP for being willing to listen.

 

Shows it can be done in public with going to the pits. 

[So Is Es]

I feel for ASG having organised events for 12 years not cycling, even world cup events on 3 occasions which where all funded by our own company with very little sponsorship from government or outside sponsorship.

[Guest notmyname]

Great stuff both parties

[Tumbleweed]

I feel for ASG having organised events for 12 years not cycling, even world cup events on 3 occasions which where all funded by our own company with very little sponsorship from government or outside sponsorship.

 

Simply...it is not a cheap sport. 

[Patchelicious]

Well done Wynand on a great response.

 

I chatted to Heinrich earlier and we discussed many of the points you have addressed here.

 

Well done on how you handled this. If you keep this open and honest relationship you will win the trust of the community.

 

Again well done.