Hunting - yes or no?

[Long Wheel Base]

Sounds like a plan. 

 

Now, where's a mad scientist waiting to release a super-virus when you need one? 

Have you watched last ship?

[Chris_]

This is a silly thought, but..

 

I wonder how many ellies there were roaming our lands say 10,000 years ago, before humans really kicked off. The way these guys seem to multiply and dominate makes me wonder if they were of impala-esque quantity back in the day. Or I suppose there were equally many many more predators - thats probably more likely...  

[Warthog]

Agree, relocation is the only other viable option. The problem with relocation is:

- cost

- is there a reserve, park etc. wiling to buy/accept them (the whole family unit/s)

- it creates a lot of stress on the animals. Moving whole family units as one does help in this regard as far as I'm aware, but it is still stressful

 

But like I said before, still preferable to culling to me.

 

Unfortunately there are no easy answers (P.S. I take back my comment regarding getting better management. It was meant as a joke but it is uncalled for).

 

I have worked in reserves in South Africa and Botswana, so I know how difficult conservation management can be. Botswana is also now considering culling again due to the size and growth of the elephant population.

 

We were in Bots few years back. South Gate, Moremi, Kwai etc. We literally saw hundreds and hundreds of elephant, but eish, they can really mess up a place...

 

Remember one specific time, ifirc it was just before Kwai, where we drove for kilo's and kilo's through just nothing. It was like a space landscape, with no vegetation at all apart from dead tree stumps....

[Piston ZA]

We were in Bots few years back. South Gate, Moremi, Kwai etc. We literally saw hundreds and hundreds of elephant, but eish, they can really mess up a place...

 

Remember one specific time, ifirc it was just before Kwai, where we drove for kilo's and kilo's through just nothing. It was like a space landscape, with no vegetation at all apart from dead tree stumps....

It is an issue, but once again there are alternatives to culling. This came up on my FB this morning, a proposal for green belts/conservation corridors that could re-establish traditional migratory routes (not just for elephants, but other ungulates too).

 

I'm not sure where this proposal comes from exactly, but these are the alternatives that should be considered before culling. 

[Mousea]

It is an issue, but once again there are alternatives to culling. This came up on my FB this morning, a proposal for green belts/conservation corridors that could re-establish traditional migratory routes (not just for elephants, but other ungulates too).

 

I'm not sure where this proposal comes from exactly, but these are the alternatives that should be considered before culling. 

In an Ideal world this would be perfect.

BUT this is would create huge conflict between Man and Animal.

And alas the Animal will come second yet again.

[Odinson]

It is an issue, but once again there are alternatives to culling. This came up on my FB this morning, a proposal for green belts/conservation corridors that could re-establish traditional migratory routes (not just for elephants, but other ungulates too).

 

I'm not sure where this proposal comes from exactly, but these are the alternatives that should be considered before culling. 

 

I like this idea. Allow the animals to follow natural migratory paths. 

[Piston ZA]

In an Ideal world this would be perfect.

BUT this is would create huge conflict between Man and Animal.

And alas the Animal will come second yet again.

It probably would, and most likely with the traditional cattle farmers. However, considering that tourism is now a bigger contributor to the economy than cattle (and second only to mining), it could still work if you involved them somehow in the growing tourism industry.

 

It won't be an overnight fix, and would take lots of hard work.

 

Also consider that Botswana's diamond reserves are only estimated to last for another 20 - 30 years, you would want to strengthen your tourism industry.

[Chris_]

In an Ideal world this would be perfect.

BUT this is would create huge conflict between Man and Animal.

And alas the Animal will come second yet again.

 

The Kgalagadi Transfrontier Park was created to help local people as well as animals wasn't it? I haven't been there in a million years but has that worked well for all concerned?

[leeubok]

Agree, relocation is the only other viable option. The problem with relocation is:

- cost

- is there a reserve, park etc. wiling to buy/accept them (the whole family unit/s)

- it creates a lot of stress on the animals. Moving whole family units as one does help in this regard as far as I'm aware, but it is still stressful

 

But like I said before, still preferable to culling to me.

 

Unfortunately there are no easy answers (P.S. I take back my comment regarding getting better management. It was meant as a joke but it is uncalled for).

 

I have worked in reserves in South Africa and Botswana, so I know how difficult conservation management can be. Botswana is also now considering culling again due to the size and growth of the elephant population.

 

KZN relocated 54 elephants to Mozambique last year. Zinave has re-opened and they are busy stocking it. I know they also took ellies from Venetia-Limpopo. Private donors made this possible. There was talk of them taking more animals this year, but apparently Moz now wants to sort out all of their free roaming ellies first before taking more from SA. 

 

This is the capture team that's doing the relocations: https://www.conservationsolutions.co.za/

 

Elephants are extremely difficult to manage. A lot of the private game farms want to give their Ellies away, but nobody wants them and there's just no space left for them

[leeubok]

It is an issue, but once again there are alternatives to culling. This came up on my FB this morning, a proposal for green belts/conservation corridors that could re-establish traditional migratory routes (not just for elephants, but other ungulates too).

 

I'm not sure where this proposal comes from exactly, but these are the alternatives that should be considered before culling. 

The concept of creating corridors has been around for ages. Even here in SA we have tons of plans and maps to create corridors to link conservation areas and allow animals to "migrate". But as Mousea pointed out, people are in the way. There is unfortunately no way under the sun you're going to displace people now for the sake of conservation.. So all of these plans remain pie in the sky dreams, unfortunately..

[Piston ZA]

The concept of creating corridors has been around for ages. Even here in SA we have tons of plans and maps to create corridors to link conservation areas and allow animals to "migrate". But as Mousea pointed out, people are in the way. There is unfortunately no way under the sun you're going to displace people now for the sake of conservation.. So all of these plans remain pie in the sky dreams, unfortunately..

In SA it may be a problem, but much less so in Bots. Most of those areas proposed for corridors in Botswana are sparsely populated, so displacement of people is less of an issue. 

[leeubok]

In SA it may be a problem, but much less so in Bots. Most of those areas proposed for corridors in Botswana are sparsely populated, so displacement of people is less of an issue. 

You're probably right. In many other African parks there are tons of people living inside the protected areas, and it still works (more or less). They have other issues though. A colleague of mine came back from a park in Kenya last year, and told me about their budget to run the park. The entire budget consist of staff salaries. There is NO money left for fencing, fuel, cars, firearms etc.. So yeah, they can create corridors all they want, but they'll need funding to manage those areas. Maybe I can refer back to my OP here, as a way to generate funds...

[Piston ZA]

Opinion piece on the elephant situation in Botswana and the current hunting ban. It's a very complex issue, but it looks like the government is generally making the right calls with regards to further research, and expanding discussion on the problem. It's a lot easier for us keyboard warriors to make the decisions.

 

https://africageographic.com/blog/opinion-human-wildlife-conflict-specialist-botswana-found-voice-will-listen/

[Patchelicious]

Opinion piece on the elephant situation in Botswana and the current hunting ban. It's a very complex issue, but it looks like the government is generally making the right calls with regards to further research, and expanding discussion on the problem. It's a lot easier for us keyboard warriors to make the decisions.

 

https://africageographic.com/blog/opinion-human-wildlife-conflict-specialist-botswana-found-voice-will-listen/

Those guys have generally had a better grasp on the topic than most other countries.

[Long Wheel Base]

Mate of mine went hunting this weekend in Lydenburg. Shot a 54.5"  kudu bull. You don't realise how big it is until you see it up close.

[gummibear]

I really feel like some Kudu biltong