Pathetic bridge needs removal at Tokai

[GoLefty!!]

Wow' date=' some serious views on a fairly innocent mod to the trail!

 

[/quote']
Clearly not a fairly innocent mod gauging by responses on the forum. Made a point of going down The Faerie Garden this afternoon, despite being totally knackered at that point, to see what the fuss was all about. I must say that I was shocked to see the size of the bridge. While it does make it easier to ride in both directions ..... well that's just the problem... it's easier to ride. I'm not enhancing my skills at all by riding it, whilst I would definitely be testing my skills the way it was before.

 

Back to Tokai and the bridge...

The bottom sections of Tokai caters for entry level riders who do not necessarily can or want to climb to the higher levels.

So it's trails will be less technical in nature.

The Black Forest trail being the exception.

 

I don't buy this one. If I can ride up the loooooooong jeep track to get to level 2 on my Unicycle' date=' then surely some nubie on 2 wheels can do it. I've been riding up to at least level 2 (Vasbyt), and nowadays to at least level 4 (Mamba), since my first ride in Tokai. I'm close to 40, and quite overweight and I still make the effort to ride up the steep jeep track.... on 1 wheel nogal !!! If you're to lazy to ride up the hill then stay out of the forest..... and similarly if you don't feel like putting in some effort to increase your skills, then go and ride a stationary bike in the Gym.

 

The intention is certainly not to dumb down any trails, rather to bring them in line with the greater plan.

 

It's great that there is a "greater plan", which in my opinion is needed and also needs to be constantly reviewed. Do you have details of the "greater plan" ? It would be nice to see what else is envisioned. At the moment I am disappointed that a number of changes have been made to make the trails easier to ride, and if the plan only includes this then I would be so upset. I pay just like any nubie does and would also like to have my skills tested. Are there plans to make more technical sections ? That I don't have to ride to the Mast to get to... seeing as how the nubies need to ride some of the lower trails ?

As for getting involved in the trail building I would definitely like to help and get involved. My involvement would be to make technical trails for MUni as that is what my passion is, and if AMARider and Muerant would like to cater for MUni ... then I'm there.

 

 

 

ok I'm going to comment here:

 

"not enhancing my skills..."

 

the trails do not exist for just one persons or two people or even 10 peoples personal enjoyment. The mountain is under the managment of Table Mountain National Parks (TNMP) and therfore the trails exist for around 2500 regular users personal enjoyment of the MTB trails and those 2500 include all ages, sexes, ethnic groups and riding abilities and styles.

It's a big task to cater for such diversity in so small an area.

 

So may  I suggest that all consider what they post before hitting reply and ask yourself: "Am I, [insert your name here] being a selfish d88s by bitching about 3m of trail when there is over 20km of it available to me?"

 

[Iwan Kemp]

Read most of this yesterday, but decided not to comment till I see for myself what and where this is all about.

 

Maybe I'm being selfish, but here goes.

 

I agree that they are dumbing down Tokai. GoLefty I see the other side of the coin. If there's 20km more worth of trail why dumb down 3m ASWELL? Surely the bulk of riding in Tokai is easy enough for people out on their first ride.

 

Why take a NATURAL section and build a bridge so unskilled, not realy willing to learn riders can cross it?

1. Pick up your bike and walk across if you realy can't clear it

2. Ride another piece of trail altogether

3. Go and freaking practise it until you get it right

 

My riding slipped and fell quite badly there. Was off the bike for two weeks. Our first ride we headed straight there and practised until we could clear it at speed. And I'm not overly-skilled rider.

 

Also people, a winding wooden bridge does not maketh North Shore. Yes there are lots of wooden bridges and paths and jumps out North Shore way...but that's not the same as building a 10m piece of bridge 1m off the ground. That's not North Shore.

 

There was a tricky seriously rocky section in Boomslang that was quite fun to ride. Meurant and his team filled it up and blocked off the section they couldn't fill. Why? It's 3m worth of tricky section in a a very long piece of single track. Sure you guys don't wanna ride road or Koeberg every weekend? Or even Jonkers.

 

I'm all for XC racers and unskilled riders. Two years ago I also just got started. But that doesn't mean we need to dumb down natural trail for the sake of them.

 

Anyway. Let the flaming begin.

[Iwan Kemp]

OUBIEONE: You guys are like parents or the government: you do alsorts of (maybe) well-intentioned stuff, but doesn't tell anyone about it.

SHARE YOUR PLAN. Then atleast mtb'ers, hikers and riders will know what is happening where and why it is happening. Otherwise you are gona get flammed every time something happens in Tokai.

Will it kill you to get a couple of mtb'ers together and ask them? Surely you have the email ads of all the Wild Card holders. Drop us an email saying what the plans are then we can stop bitching and get on with it.

[Tumbleweed]

don't know the bridge in quuestion, but in a recent-ish issue of bike contained a good article on trailbuilding. when it came to "stunts" or tricky sections, the writers suggested building an alternative for the lesser skilled riders.  

[Mellow]

 

thanks to the guys and gals building and maintaining our trails!! really feel strong about it and a great deal of gratitude towards them.

 

i would've said 'no' to that bridge if it was still in question. seems

however that more people can now effortlessly enjoy a free run on that trail. maybe a chicken/hero run to come ? Poll: 'Yes' to bridge as an alternative...

 

laughing at your mates(some times others) and talking about technical challanges and close calls is a big part of mtb'ing - the more the better. where the track does not provide a big enough challange you make it up with speed.

 

 

 

Mellow2009-04-14 23:27:43

[Hairy]

BTS ... Firstly you should take your medication ... you know the nausea pills and those little blue pills to help you with your anger management.

 

 

 

Great now we can talk.

 

 

 

This is one section of trail that has been modified to prevent further negative environmental impact. Not very hard to accept as a good thing.

 

 

 

I also miss the previous section and the first time that I cleared the river in both directions was rather ... well ... cool. But protecting the trails and environment as an overall entity if far more important.

 

 

 

I am off to hug some trees.

 

 

 

Kindest and Sincerest Regards

 

Hairy

[splat]

Wow, if BTS gets so wound up and aggressive and abbrasive about one little bridge in the whole network of Tokai singletrack, I would hate to see his reaction to something important!

 

I would say, 'get over it', but that would require building a bridge...

[Myra]

Wow' date=' some serious views on a fairly innocent mod to the trail!

 

[/quote']
Clearly not a fairly innocent mod gauging by responses on the forum. Made a point of going down The Faerie Garden this afternoon, despite being totally knackered at that point, to see what the fuss was all about. I must say that I was shocked to see the size of the bridge. While it does make it easier to ride in both directions ..... well that's just the problem... it's easier to ride. I'm not enhancing my skills at all by riding it, whilst I would definitely be testing my skills the way it was before.

 

Back to Tokai and the bridge...

The bottom sections of Tokai caters for entry level riders who do not necessarily can or want to climb to the higher levels.

So it's trails will be less technical in nature.

The Black Forest trail being the exception.

 

I don't buy this one. If I can ride up the loooooooong jeep track to get to level 2 on my Unicycle' date=' then surely some nubie on 2 wheels can do it. I've been riding up to at least level 2 (Vasbyt), and nowadays to at least level 4 (Mamba), since my first ride in Tokai. I'm close to 40, and quite overweight and I still make the effort to ride up the steep jeep track.... on 1 wheel nogal !!! If you're to lazy to ride up the hill then stay out of the forest..... and similarly if you don't feel like putting in some effort to increase your skills, then go and ride a stationary bike in the Gym.

 

The intention is certainly not to dumb down any trails, rather to bring them in line with the greater plan.

 

It's great that there is a "greater plan", which in my opinion is needed and also needs to be constantly reviewed. Do you have details of the "greater plan" ? It would be nice to see what else is envisioned. At the moment I am disappointed that a number of changes have been made to make the trails easier to ride, and if the plan only includes this then I would be so upset. I pay just like any nubie does and would also like to have my skills tested. Are there plans to make more technical sections ? That I don't have to ride to the Mast to get to... seeing as how the nubies need to ride some of the lower trails ?

As for getting involved in the trail building I would definitely like to help and get involved. My involvement would be to make technical trails for MUni as that is what my passion is, and if AMARider and Muerant would like to cater for MUni ... then I'm there.

 

OMG.  How selfish can one be?

[Dirt*girl™]

 I am soooo glad this would never happen where I?m from. Sheeeezzz?. <?: prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

[Iwan Kemp]

This is one section of trail that has been modified to prevent further negative environmental impact. Not very hard to accept as a good thing.

That's why I say put out an email saying just that. Problem solved. Communicate people.

[JohnnyReggae]

 

ok I'm going to comment here:

 

"not enhancing my skills..."

 

the trails do not exist for just one persons or two people or even 10 peoples personal enjoyment. The mountain is under the managment of Table Mountain National Parks (TNMP) and therfore the trails exist for around 2500 regular users personal enjoyment of the MTB trails and those 2500 include all ages' date=' sexes, ethnic groups and riding abilities and styles.

It's a big task to cater for such diversity in so small an area.

 

So may  I suggest that all consider what they post before hitting reply and ask yourself: "Am I, [insert your name here'] being a selfish d88s by bitching about 3m of trail when there is over 20km of it available to me?"

 

Agreed totally. I'm not the only one using the trails, and they are not there purely for my own enjoyment. My issue is that the trails are being made easier to ride for a smaller subset of people using the trails. What about the people who spend time out there, and pay every time to use the trails.... in the end more so that the weekend warrior. So I'm being selfish because some people are to lazy to ride up a jeep track, or couldn't be bothered to work on their skills..... and I have to keep going higher and higher just to find something technical to ride. Who is being unreasonable here ?

 

If you read one of my previous posts I complained specifically about a very small downhill section that has been totally dumbed down, when there is an easier alternative already. I've taken time and effort with quite a few bails to get my skills to a point that I could easily ride it, knowing that if I didn't feel like doing that section I could take the easier loop around it. So why dumb that section down ? Who are you catering for ? Seeing as there was already an easier alternative ? Then tell me again that I'm being selfish.

 

[JohnnyReggae]

 

OMG.  How selfish can one be?

See my previous post....

 

[MintSauce]

 

Read most of this yesterday' date=' but decided not to comment till I see for myself what and where this is all about.

 

Maybe I'm being selfish, but here goes.

 

I agree that they are dumbing down Tokai. GoLefty I see the other side of the coin. If there's 20km more worth of trail why dumb down 3m ASWELL? Surely the bulk of riding in Tokai is easy enough for people out on their first ride.

 

Why take a NATURAL section and build a bridge so unskilled, not realy willing to learn riders can cross it?

1. Pick up your bike and walk across if you realy can't clear it

2. Ride another piece of trail altogether

3. Go and freaking practise it until you get it right

 

My riding slipped and fell quite badly there. Was off the bike for two weeks. Our first ride we headed straight there and practised until we could clear it at speed. And I'm not overly-skilled rider.

 

Also people, a winding wooden bridge does not maketh North Shore. Yes there are lots of wooden bridges and paths and jumps out North Shore way...but that's not the same as building a 10m piece of bridge 1m off the ground. That's not North Shore.

 

There was a tricky seriously rocky section in Boomslang that was quite fun to ride. Meurant and his team filled it up and blocked off the section they couldn't fill. Why? It's 3m worth of tricky section in a a very long piece of single track. Sure you guys don't wanna ride road or Koeberg every weekend? Or even Jonkers.

 

I'm all for XC racers and unskilled riders. Two years ago I also just got started. But that doesn't mean we need to dumb down natural trail for the sake of them.

 

Anyway. Let the flaming begin.

[/quote']

 

 

Well said.

 

 

seems

however that more people can now effortlessly enjoy a free run on that trail

 

 

 

'MTB' and 'effortless' to not go together

 

 

 

 

 

blah blah etc etc

 

OMG.  How selfish can one be?

 

The same could be said of those wanting the trails to be dumbed down. Really now....how much effort is it to climb off your bike and walk 3m 'over' and obstacle?

 

My question is....is the effort saved from the lazy, funriders worth the cost of the enjoyment the skilled riders have lost?

 

Is it fair to take enjoyment from those riders who in all likelyhood visit the trails more often and ride for longer in order to make a trail rideable to a select few weekend warriors?

 

 

 

 

[Red Zone]

The bottom line is that the Fairy Garden, is a green route for beginners. The bridge is pretty easy, but makes the entire fairy garden ridable for beginners. Lets remember that before the Fairy Garden was built, there was no singltrack suitable for beginers! It is not intented to be technical, but rather an easy flowing section of trail. The bridge will stay because the trail builders understand where the Fairy Garden sits in the package of trails in Tokai.

 

Secondly there is an ecological and erosion prevention funtion to the bridge, it keeps people who couldnt handle the sleeper bridge out of the river.

[Iwan Kemp]

Yeah JR, I feel the same. Why dumb down the techy section right next to a chicken run.

There's PLENTY of XC/weight weenie/beginners/social riders trail as it is. Seems like most racers / weight weenies / weiners come down the jeep track in any case.

[Dirt*girl™]

The right thing to do..if you are catering for all level of MTB-ers?.is to make easier alternatives?without compromising the more technical parts of the track. The bridge should have been put up as a chicken run?..not replace the lines riders were using. Pfff don?t hide behind erosion?.if they are worried about that, I can name sooo many more places that needs attention.  <?: prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />