Tzaneen Tour

[realityevent]

Hi epoh , spinnekop & every one else that would like to complain about the Tzanee Tour.

My name is Jaques vd Schyff & Myself & Debbie Katzke orgenized this event.

User Names...wonderfull things, you can say what you want if you dont have the nuts.........

Keep this in mind: " This is the first event that was held, that was a tour, Road & MTB. " I did signage till 3 every morning and Road signage from 5 in the morning............ I was the organizer and did not see one start or finish and not because of poor management but because I wanted to ensure we had no problems on the road.

 

Firstly, there was prize Money big H. Although we decided that if there was less than 200 riders there would be none......

O there was about 120 riders in total.

Poor organizing??????????????????????

This race was a 3 day tour in MTB and Road bike. Two people organized & developed this event. No profit was made or was the reason for this event { would have loved it though } 3 things were important to, get the families involved, to ensure the guys get the best routes possible and safety. I think we did this.

One thing I realised this week-end, Road Bike in SA is a dying sport and you guys will only be able to do the races that really are set in stone , because you are right epoh I wont hoat a road bike event again.

The only people that bitch are the roadies.....about everything, you guys act like spoiled little brats.

But its fine, I will be hosting MTB events, and we have supurb routes and veneus, and it's true what they say, " you really do need balls to do MTB..."

Cyclists talk among each other.. so do Organizers & guess what? some of the top race guys have decided to go just into MTB.

So guess what boys, fork out R 350 000.00 for a event and organise your own races, or shut up and help develop SA Road Cycling!!!!

 

One more thing. This Tour was offered to a number of Organizers and no had the balls to do it.... Enjoy your cycling Dudes.

 

[Jules]

Hi Jacques,

 

 

 

Thanks for your post. I think sometimes riders don't realise how much work goes into organising a tour.

 

 

 

But at the same time, I believe in the saying: "If you're going to do a job, do it properly."

 

 

 

And I must say that there were certain aspects of the reality tour that did not meet the expectations I have of a good bike race.

 

 

 

I'll give two examples: How about a race programme? It's a simple thing, but there was no piece of paper telling me what time races started, how long they were, where the water points were, when and where race briefings and prize giving were to take place etc etc etc.

 

 

 

Also, at the finish of stage two I was parched and there was nothing to drink. This for an event that was sponsored by Powerade!!!!!

 

 

 

I did the Panorama tour earlier this year, and (without wishing to be nasty) while I enjoyed your race, the organisation did not hold a candle to that event.

 

 

 

Also, you say you did not make a profit. I don't know if I speak for other cyclists when I say this, but as a die-hard capitalist, I would expect organisers to make a profit. I don't expect you guys to do it for charity. I just want value for my money. I was happy to pay the R1000-odd entry fee, but I wanted a race programme and drinks when I finished my ride, among other things.

 

 

 

Anyway, like I said in a previous post: apart from its faults, I enjoyed the tour.

 

 

 

 

[jkid]

the tour was great! i really take my hat off to you for organizing everything! the roads were great! apart from the car accident on route on the first road stage, which of cause is out of your control. dont even bother reading all the bad press about the tour! even if there is any. I THINK IT WAS A GREAT TOUR and weekend away with the family!

[epoh]

Click on my nick and you will see my details. I am not hiding behind a name. But in any case my name is Stieler van Eeden and PM me if you want my contact number as well.

 

Jacques, I spoke to you after Stage 1 and gave you a few pointers to improve the event based on my experience from having participated in other tours. And I am also aware your main focus is on other type of events that are much bigger than this and that you are very good at what you do.

 

But please see my criticism in a positive light.

 

I did not criticize the race itself (we on the road cycling). If you read my post I gave you 10/10 for the marshalling, road safety, water points etc. In my mind you could not have done better there, everyone was at his post. The metro police, ambulance everything was very visible and well coordinated. In my books and you also pointed it out safety is the most important thing in a race and you made every effort to put the riders? safety first. So for what counted the most points you guys did an excellent job.

 

What I mean by race organisation is the following. I guess after having done some other tours my expectations were too high with regards to the softer things that we often take for granted;

 

    * The communication to the riders were very poor. There was no proper race program to follow? Everything was ad-hoc. And I think the problem here is that people have done other tours and expect it to be done in the same way which is not always going to be the case. I for one am guilty of comparing this event to others. But if you are planning to have a tour in a particular way make sure you communicate it clearly to your audience so that they know what to expect.

 

    * People also made analogies with the "Tropical" tour which was organised and presented in its own particular fashion. That tour had some issues of its own and beforehand people were not interested because some probably thought it was the same guys organising it. I think it should be made clear that you guys have got nothing to do with the previous organisers. Personally, I can?t compare this tour with the Tropical tour because it was before I started cycling.

 

    * No proper introduction at the race briefing. Your first words were telling us where we are starting the prologue the next day. It seemed like you lost your train of thought after the MIC broke. How about doing a proper introduction and introducing your team of people.. give a bit of background about how the event came about...and also very important.. welcome the cyclists. People pay attention to those kinds of things.

 

    * What about the refund for the people that paid R1200, no clear communication regarding that either. Every time I inquired the lady (older lady) told me at prize giving they are going to tell us what to do. I only saw one prize giving at the end but no mention regarding the refund. Now R270 is not such a big deal but out of principle I want it settled because the written communication I received from the organizers said they would.

 

    * Your web site. Your web site did not read very well and a lot of the maps and profiles were enlarged to the extend that they were not very visible. People that do not know that area of the country very well want to be very clear on what they are letting themselves in. Pimp that web site. Put as much information as you can on there.

 

    * Sell it, I felt you guys could have done better and probably got more cyclists by selling it more actively to the community. Look at some of the other events, even minor ones they start planning and sending out communication to riders almost a year in advance. And this is not advertising you necessarily have to pay for. There are ways to do it.

 

    * It was also at the end of the month when Moria is at its peak and traffic back to JHB is not fun. I know my way around this one so it did not bother me. A lot of people from JHB probably don't even know what that star on their maids clothes are but make them aware beforehand of the big trek if the event is going to be held at the end of the month. The last thing you want to do is sit in cues to get home for 500km after having done a tough tour.

 

    * There was no clear communication regarding who is in what jersey, the jerseys were handed out informally by the race commissar's. Usually this is done in a more formal way. This is also the opportunity the sponsors use to get publicity.

 

 

But in the greater scheme of things the fun I had far more outweighed the issues I noted above. I really enjoyed it and it is very very sad that it won?t be back next year as I love that part of the world and the roads are perfect for racing. I understand that you were tight on resources and after reading your post and giving it some thought you did the right thing by focusing what you had on the actual racing itself. A job well done, by faaaaaar safer than most races in jhb.

 

In the end thanks for an awesome race, it would not have been possible without you and your team. It is one thing to bitch and it is another thing to make a difference. I want to see this race be even more successful next year so if you decide to do it again next year I will assist you for free with your web site to help document everything properly and get the word out how awesome this race is.

 

All the best with the rock concert and lastly I apologise for not qualifying the comments I made in my first post.

 

Stieler

 

epoh2007-07-02 14:57:11

[chucky]

i enjoyed the tour and took it as a training ride and certainly did not complain,but things are about to change,it is far to go and cost a fair bit of  money,petrol ,accomdation ,etc,but i certainly dont like the organizers tone and certainly wont do any of his events mtb or road,it is clients like me you are targeting.Further more i had forgotten about the refund as promised but now will insist on it,i will get hold of you personally,or i will get my lawyers to do so .Your attitude sticks.

[chucky]

Oh by the way i have also sponsored an event ,and things arent always about making money,sometimes we do it to put something back into the sport,i take real offence to your comments.MARK THIJS

[EdoardoBianchi]

Nicely handled guys.

 

EPOH, thanks for your report, pics and comments

 

Jacques I think I speak for the wider cycling community when I say: Thanks for the effort put into the event, especially in light of a critique-prone crowd. I for one will make the effort to ride next year (if you do decide to host another road event) 

[Cruxpearl]

Dear Jaques, <?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

 

With an attitude like that, I'm afraid you won't be hosting very many successful cycling events in the future either, Neither Road nor MTB!!!

I'm one of the people that was critical of the Tzaneen Tour Entry Price, and justifiably so.

I very much enjoyed the last Tzaneen Tropical Tour, and for one rated it as one of the top three races on the racing calendar.

Huge was the disappointment when the Tzaneen tour was back on the calendar, but at three times the price of the previous editions. At R 1200.00 or even reduced to R 930.00 a rider, the Entry Fee WILL NOT FLOAT, as you have learnt at you own considerable expense.

When we tried to bring that point to your attention however, you chose to ignore that and your replies were arrogant, dismissive and impetuous!!!

The math is pretty simple, at R 1200.00 per rider you barely managed to get 40 riders to enter. (120 Riders!!!! What do you also think cyclist can?t count either???)

Halve the price to R 600.00 per rider and you would have had a minimum of 120 - 150 Riders enter guaranteed and would have had a much better chance of getting 200 riders to the line.

At R 1200.00 per rider and your arrogant attitude??? NO CHANCE!!!!

You want to get families involved, that?s great and that?s how I want to be involved in cycling too, but at R 1000 per person with a cycling family of 3 (or a TCS cycling family of 8) plus accommodation and toll fee?s, petrol, traveling, etc, etc you ARE NOT going to get families involved.

Did you think that cyclist are all that gullible and easy to part with their money without expecting value for money???

What makes you think that roadies do not ride MTB as well either??? There are only so many active cyclist in the country, road or MTB, and a lot of them ride both road and MTB, and we speak to one another as well, and now we also know that RealityEvents is only in it for the Money and is actually the one that behaves like a spoilt brat because very little people could eventually afford the high cost of the tour that was going to be your cash cow!!!!!!!

By the Way? What have you done for cycling, or to develop cycling in <?:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />South Africaon>??

 

I?m sorry EduardoBianchi, you unfortunately do not speak for the wider cycling community in this regard, as everyone that I have spoken to about the Tzaneen Tour felt pretty much that the cost was excessive and that the Tzaneen Tour would not get the necessary numbers together at that price to make it viable, otherwise there would have been in excess of 200 riders

 

Oh! By the way? Cruxpearl is called Carel Smith and my email address is carel@tcsn.co.za (all very easily accessible on my nick as well) and Cell no is 083 325 1575

 

Oh Yes, one last thing? you are very much mistaken if you really believe that road cycling is a dying sport? maybe bitter because the roadies didn?t support your event, but it is most certainly not dying!!!

 

I for one really really hope that it would be possible to sort out the logistics and organization to be able to host this grear event at a reasonable cost of R 500 ? R 600 per rider, as I still think it is a great venue to have a GREAT 3 day stage race, and would very very much like to enter our club members and be there en masse, but it has to make some financial sense!!!!

 

Kind Regards

Cruxpearl

Carel Smith 

[realityevent]

Hi Bro

Sorry if I was a bit nippy last night, but I had no sleep yet and seeing that it was my first race I took your post a bit bad.

There are a lot of things I did not know yet, even though I went to a lot of events to get the info right.

I'm going to change the concept of the races a bit for the future and have stage races as training sessions to other events.

These races will not be as hyped up as other events, but I think it will benefit you guys greatly.

But I think for our next few events I would like to meet with you guys and we decide how a race should be held and what we want from these events.

 

Thanks for the info

[Gary Rabie]

I for one and my team will never particiapte in a race orgainsed by reality events ever again. Lack of prize money, pisspoor traffic control (Alex got hit by a car going through an intersection), exorbitant entry fee, shocking quality of food for breakfast and dinner. Need I say more. Hope you enjoy the profit you made from the Tour seeing as you paid f**kall prize money. Another organiser making a fast buck at the expense of cyclists. Shame on you.

[Gary Rabie]

i enjoyed the tour and took it as a training ride and certainly did not complain' date='but things are about to change,it is far to go and cost a fair bit of  money,petrol ,accomdation ,etc,but i certainly dont like the organizers tone and certainly wont do any of his events mtb or road,it is clients like me you are targeting.Further more i had forgotten about the refund as promised but now will insist on it,i will get hold of you personally,or i will get my lawyers to do so .Your attitude sticks.[/quote']

 

Well ridden at the tour Mark. Good luck getting hold this cat. After the prize giving Alex spoke to the organiser about the prize money he promised the day before. He said wait a second, got in his car and drove off. Shaun Davel had the same problem with the organiser.

 

Only happens once.

[Hendrik Petoors]

Arme Jacques, jy het nog baie om te leer. Dit lyk my jy het sommer die event aangebied sonder om enige marknavorsing te doen. Dit dui op redelike swak besigheid skills. Nou blameer jy roadies vir jou failure. Sies kerel het jy geen maniere nie. Eerstens moes jy geweet het die Albatros van 'n paar wonderlike Tzaneen Tropical Tours hang om jou nek. Dan ook die failure van die laaste TTT waar die kategorie wenners nooit hulle prysgeld ontvang het nie. Die ergste was dat een van die vorige aanbieders ook Jacques genoem was. Jy sou dalk meer sukses behaal het as jy jouself Poepol genoem het. Word groot kerel en aanvaar verantwoordelikheid. Jy besef dit dalk nog nie maar die fietsry gemeenskap is 'n baie geslote gemeenskap.... of hulle nou "roadies" of "bergies" is.... jy het jouself met 'n 210 grein hollowpoint 44 Magnum totaal en al in die voet geskiet met jou unprovoked attack op die fietsrygemeenskap. Jy SAL van nou af net big time uitlose want fietsryers vergeet wel maar hulle vergewe nooit nie. Soos met die aanbied van die futiele event het jy obviously nie mooi gedink nie ne???????

[Rakker]

realityevent, I suggest you make an effort of getting all the suggestions you can and transform this event into one of the best in the country. I am glad to see you lean more to the "let's hear what you guys say and do it better" side now, as there is really a need for tours like this. (Please please please do it again.)

 

I also have a huge soft spot for the Tzaneen area as I grew up there and was so disgusted when hubby decided not to go as none of his team members went. I believe that we will be there next year if you just take note of 20% of the suggestions made by people on the Hub.

 

Remember that the people on the Hub are mostly passionate cyclists who wouldn't do anything to kill the sport, so take their criticism as an attempt to help you organise a great event that will be of benifit to cycling in South Africa (and you as an organiser).

 

And lastly: Never underestimate the power of the Hub. Use it to your benifit!

[ewep]

Reality, your idea of chatting to guys like Crux is excellent.  And listen to what Rakker has to say.  I think that is probably the BEST summary you'll get about the whole sad story!

[ewep]

I for one would have loved to do the tour, but, and I'm not going into everything again, the "word of mouth" was not right.  Now, if reality comes on and asks WHAT can I do I am willing to just about guarantee you that he will have an increase in participants.

Cruxpearl2007-07-03 05:52:33

[Spinnekop]

<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Hi epoh , spinnekop & every one else that would like to complain about the Tzanee Tour.

My name is Jaques vd Schyff & Myself & Debbie Katzke orgenized this event.[/quote']

 

We know who you are.  We did our homework before taking you on, on a public forum.  I suggest you do the same.

 

You should stop see all the posts on your race as complaints.  It is not.  You have a GOLDMINE and if you treat this as constructive criticism, maybe you will better this event to make it something great!! 

 

I loved this tour.  Did it a couple of times.  Lived in Giyani on a farm.  This is my home country and I know the road better than you. 
I really looked forward in doing this race again.  I got engaged during this tour.  Had to ask the bunch permission and advice on stage 1....<?:namespace prefix = v ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" /> .  Thus far they were not wrong to give their consent......

The point I try to make is that this race has sentimental values + it is 'n stunning venue to host awesome racing......you stuff it up or try get rich quickly....I WILL BE PISSED.

 

 

User Names...wonderful things, you can say what you want if you don?t have the nuts.........[/quote']

 

Maybe mine is bigger than yours.  But this is not a show and tell contest.  Nor is it a site where you can come through nuts around the place.

Out of respect for the ladies and future young cyclists visiting this forum, I suggest, as a race organizer, you keep it above the belt.....

Everyone knows who I am.  If you like to find out, click on my username and find out.  PM me.  Whatever.  But first do your homework!! 

 

Keep this in mind: " This is the first event that was held, that was a tour, Road & MTB. " I did signage till 3 every morning and Road signage from 5 in the morning............ I was the organizer and did not see one start or finish and not because of poor management but because I wanted to ensure we had no problems on the road.[/quote']

 

Blah...blahhh... blah....It comes with the territory.  You want to organize a race, you have to do stuff like this to make is successful.  You don't like it, don't do it.  Someone else will though.  Or to put it in your language bro, if you are a hooker, don't expect to be taken out for dinner and shampaign!

 

 

Firstly, there was prize Money big H. Although we decided that if there was less than 200 riders there would be none......[/quote']

 

Who's the arrogant BRO now??? Not even 90% of Gauteng races attract 200 entrants!!!!  So you put in a clause that basically says "We will not pay any prize money".  Maybe the locals were gullible enough to think there will be more than 200 but you will not fool the cycling community that is in the know....

 

O there was about 120 riders in total.

Poor organizing??????????????????????[/quote']

No.  Not in your wildest dreams Bro.  And not poor organizing.  PISS poor organizing I think HiQ called it.  (So by the way, HiQ is one of our top teams in SA with some of the best cyclists for trainers)

 

Your MTB was supposed to be 50, 80, 40 (I have the Cyclelab printout)
You did not pay the farmers to go through their land as agreed and had to shortened the second stage to 40.  That is half!!!  With 90% jeep track.

 

Now I don't know what lame ass MTB'ers you had on your tour (No offence boys) but the ones I usually deal with will knock you up silly for making them ride jeep track and half a stage.  MTB'ers are tough and want to be treated so.

 

One thing I realised this week-end, Road Bike in SA is a dying sport and you guys will only be able to do the races that really are set in stone , [/quote']

 

The Tzaneen tour was once upon a time set in stone.  You charge R1200 entry and you throw the stone into the ocean. 

 

 

because you are right epoh I wont hoat a road bike event again.[/quote']

 

Thank goodness.  Maybe someone with enough integrity to LISTEN to the cyclists will then host this and make a success of it.....because like I said....this can be a success!!!

 

The only people that bitch are the roadies.....about everything, you guys act like spoiled little brats.[/quote']

 

Hey Bro.  One day when you take time to know me, you can have the right to insult me.  Let us not get personal.  The pointers up to this point was not towards you (Then I would have made poor thought out remarks about your manhood being too small like you are doing), it is pointed towards the race and how you can make it better!!

 

But its fine, I will be hosting MTB events, and we have supurb routes and veneus, and it's true what they say, " you really do need balls to do MTB..."

Cyclists talk among each other.. so do Organizers & guess what? some of the top race guys have decided to go just into MTB.[/quote']

 

Good for you.  Good for them.  Again....maybe my balls are bigger than you think.  Maybe my brains are bigger than what you think....Think what you may.  With that attitude you will not make a success of life. 

 

One more thing. This Tour was offered to a number of Organizers and no had the balls to do it.... Enjoy your cycling Dudes.

 

[/quote']

 

Always do enjoy my cycling.  Small balls and all. 

Did you ever think that maybe it is not the big balls that make a success of something.....??? 

 

Just a few thoughts on your poor reply.

I have a sad feeling in my hart.  Like when your dog dies. 

Not only have I lost a race I love in a part of the world that I hold dear to my heart but I lost respect for you.