Emergency lube

[Joe Low]

Back again to see that this is still running / limping along.

 

BigH - hair wax, soft wax you put in your ummm hair to give it a bit of a lift. From the Body Shop it's a bit expensive to be smearing on my bike.

 

Scotty - I was alone in my room with only my bike for company when the full horror of the chain's condition struck me - covered in what looks like drying tar and grit.  It was dark and you were long gone over the mountain by then.

 

JR - Tiger balm - I like it, whether it works or not, I like it.

 

So along with the majority 2 voters, i went with sun lotion spray, it left a greasy film and reduced my guilty feelings a little.

 

Using chamois cream has the definite whiff of desperation about it.... ok more desperation than the other options.

 

Tomorrow I might clean and regrease it properly.

 

[Johan Bornman]

Hi JB your statements seems too subjective for me' date=' I would really appreciate some facts and data to back the following up... as my lecturers used to say

Diesel is not (a good lubricant)! depends on the application?

It splatters off very quickly! data please for the application... we're talking about "Road bike Chains"

Diesel is certainly not a better lubricant than motor oil! facts please based on the application "Road Bike Chains"

Low viscoscity has no advantages, since thicker oil penetrates through capillary action... Explain yourself, does Diesel not have capillary action or does it have less?

how much quicker will it "fly off and evaporate"

what SAE oil are you comparing it to?[/quote']

 

Pom, here goes.

 

Diesel isn't suitable for drivechains because it is too thin and it splatters off. Evidence of this can be found by way of lots of black splatters on your clean rims. In this application you want a balance between tackiness and flow. Diesel and paraffin are on the light end of the spectrum. If the oil has some tackifyer additives, like bar chain oil (chainsaw oil), then you'll see that the oil is thrown off the chain in long toffee-like strings, also landing on your rim, but in little lines, not dots.

 

Diesel works well in fuel injectors because it is in a closed system and essentially a deal-loss system to the parts that need lubrication. In other words, it is smeared once and then burnt, only to be replaced. It can't splatter anywhere. In applications where it has to be re-used, diesel doesn't shape. I doubt the molecules will survive constant shear in say, a sump. Under circumstances where splatter doesn't matter and there is a plentiful supply, water is also an OK lubricant. I mentioned the example of riding in the rain where plenty of water flushes the chain. After the rain it flies off and dries out and the chain makes a noise.

 

Low viscocity. Low viscocity oil is needed for smaller working parts, like sewing machines and it will work to an extent in bicycle chains. But there is better stuff and that is the thicker stuff like motor oil. I said low viscocity has no advantage, meaning that motor oil is already thin enough to penetrate within two or three revolutions of the crank, there is no need to find something that floods it quicker. Quick enough is quick enough. Diesel will penetrate through capillary action too (of course), but that's not its avantage, since the motor oil does the same very well. It is therefore not an advantage. Both sides have the same weapon.

 

How much quicker will it fly off? Much quicker. You can do three or four hundred kilometers with a motor oiiled chain. I estimate 80 or so with a diesel chain. It is easy to test. Ride it until it squeaks.

 

What SAE? Doesn't really matter. It is much of a muchness for this low-tech application. I haven't tried any of the 5W60 stuff on chains but SAE 40, 20W40, all those are, as far as the chain cares, the same.

 

 

 

Johan Bornman2010-06-08 09:30:33

[gummibear]

If you are in a car use oil off the dipstick.

[Johan Bornman]

How does one oil a chain? If you read the instructions on the expensive oils, they tell you to apply liberally and then wipe the excess. This is a stupid method.

 

Chains need far less oil than most people imagine. Find yourself a dropper of sorts and fill that with your preferred oil.  Now, how the dropper against a chain roller and allow one truncated drop to flow onto the roller. Note, not an entire drop dropped from height, but a small one with the nozzle in contact with the roller.

 

Now go to every second roller until you are back to the beginning. Cycle the crank a couple of times and you'l see that the entire chain is oiled where it matters - inside, not outside. Oil on the sideplates to nothing. You want it inside. There should be no excess.

[Shebeen]

 

Low viscocity. Low viscocity oil is needed for smaller working parts' date=' like sewing machines and it will work to an extent in bicycle chains. But there is better stuff and that is the thicker stuff like motor oil.  

[/quote']

the freedom challenge race director wasn't familiar with lubricants when he scouted the route in 2004. after 600km this became a bit of an issue, so he found some sewing machine oil in cradock and the next 1700km were fine.

 

well thats how the third hand version of the story goes.

[dee_biker]

I don't see KY in the list????!???

[Johan Bornman]

 

Low viscocity. Low viscocity oil is needed for smaller working parts' date=' like sewing machines and it will work to an extent in bicycle chains. But there is better stuff and that is the thicker stuff like motor oil.  

[/quote']

the freedom challenge race director wasn't familiar with lubricants when he scouted the route in 2004. after 600km this became a bit of an issue, so he found some sewing machine oil in cradock and the next 1700km were fine.

 

well thats how the third hand version of the story goes.

 

I'm sure there is some truth in it. Just about any oil works and if it is too thin, you simply apply more often. I would imagine he took the tannie se oliebotteltjie with him.

 

Guys like that inspire me. They don't allow little oversights become a hurdle.

 

 

[Johan Bornman]

I don't see KY in the list????!???

 

Go play in the blue nipples thread.

 

If you hang around here long enough you'll see just how silly the old KY and nipple and balls jokes really are. Trust me, we've seen them here in every conceivable permutation.

[johannrissik]

This is getting anal which is probably why someone dropped the KY hint.

[mtb_Josh]

 

?

 

Low viscocity. Low viscocity oil is needed for smaller working parts' date=' like sewing machines and it will work to an extent in bicycle chains. But there is better stuff and that is the thicker stuff like motor oil.??

[/quote']

 

the freedom challenge race director wasn't familiar with lubricants when he scouted the route in 2004. after 600km this became a bit of an issue, so he found some sewing machine oil in cradock and the next 1700km were fine.

 

?

 

well thats how the third hand version of the story goes.

 

 

 

I've used sewing machine oil before. I ran out of lube and I use sewing machine oil for my paintball marker, so I thought I'd try a bit on my chain. Worked quite well actually!

[Pom1]

I am sorry not in a million years will you convince me that Thicker oil is better or any oil come to that for both MTB and Road...

The contact areas are primarily the chain roller inner surfaces and outer. By using thicker oil or any oil that sticks to the chain it does the following;

1; Yes it may retain itself inside the roller surfaces longer

2: however, eventuallly due to the non captive area of the outer contact surfaces Gear cog and roller it eventually wears off, as does all lubes

3; In the process of wearing off (here is the concern) oil picks up dust particles and forms a paste (similar to that what we use to lap valves in) and wears the Cassette and Chain rings out pronto! (it is OK if you are riding at snails pace as one does on the Freedom challenge) but at race pace 250w + wear takes place far quicker and chain suck is far more prevalant.

4; If you want to Lube with Oil do so it will last longer but ride at low watts to reduce the wear on your drievtrain

5: if you want to race I would strongly reccomend a dry lube as it is less prone to picking up dust, and therefore will extend your DT life.

p.s. the above really is only specifically intended for MTB users, Roadies... well the oil, personally is too messy and generally there is far more longevity in a road drive train than a MTB (measured in KM)

[Johan Bornman]

I am sorry not in a million years will you convince me that Thicker oil is better or any oil come to that for both MTB and Road...

The contact areas are primarily the chain roller inner surfaces and outer. By using thicker oil or any oil that sticks to the chain it does the following;

1; Yes it may retain itself inside the roller surfaces longer

2: however' date=' eventuallly due to the non captive area of the outer contact surfaces Gear cog and roller it eventually wears off, as does all lubes

3; In the process of wearing off (here is the concern) oil picks up dust particles and forms a paste (similar to that what we use to lap valves in) and wears the Cassette and Chain rings out pronto! (it is OK if you are riding at snails pace as one does on the Freedom challenge) but at race pace 250w + wear takes place far quicker and chain suck is far more prevalant.

4; If you want to Lube with Oil do so it will last longer but ride at low watts to reduce the wear on your drievtrain

5: if you want to race I would strongly reccomend a dry lube as it is less prone to picking up dust, and therefore will extend your DT life.

p.s. the above really is only specifically intended for MTB users, Roadies... well the oil, personally is too messy and generally there is far more longevity in a road drive train than a MTB (measured in KM)

[/quote']

 

I wont be around that long and I don't really care what people use as chain lubrication. This thing always explodes into a debate with the energy of a religious fight.

 

However, oil on the rollers and cog pressure faces is not as important as oil inside the pins where the sideplates articulate against them. That's where chain wear happens - on the pins and sideplates.

 

This dry lube thing will not go away. Other than graphite, I don't know what dry lube means.

 

[MJ the Expat]

Which is worse:

1. A dry chain

2. A chain with sticky oil attracting alot of dust/sand which acts like sandpaper on our gears.

[Guest Big H]

Kom nou kinners hou dadelik op stout wees!!!!!!!!!!

[Shebeen]

 

Low viscocity. Low viscocity oil is needed for smaller working parts' date=' like sewing machines and it will work to an extent in bicycle chains. But there is better stuff and that is the thicker stuff like motor oil.  

[/quote']

the freedom challenge race director wasn't familiar with lubricants when he scouted the route in 2004. after 600km this became a bit of an issue, so he found some sewing machine oil in cradock and the next 1700km were fine.

 

well thats how the third hand version of the story goes.

 

I'm sure there is some truth in it. Just about any oil works and if it is too thin, you simply apply more often. I would imagine he took the tannie se oliebotteltjie with him.

 

Guys like that inspire me. They don't allow little oversights become a hurdle.

 

 

 

this is after he got onto a 'makro' bike in pmb not having really ridden since schooldays. not such a cool idea. 1st night stop was at his brother's farm, so he did some affirmative shopping in the farm garage and rode to paarl. and gave himself a 24hour time penalty for swapping bikes.

 

plenty of stories like these, the 2005 event was won on a giant rincon.

 

gets kinda funny these days when people freak out about not having the right multi pivot full susser for the race and he rolls his eyes.

 

okee dokee, that's my freedom challenge* plug for the day. race starts next monday and it's going to be a CRACKER!

 

*sponsored by Squirt of course

 

[Pom1]

Chain wear (source wikiapedia / sheldon brown)

Chain wear, or chain stretch, becomes an issue with extensive cycling. Although the overall effect is often called "stretch", chains generally wear through attrition of the bushings (or half-bushings, in the Sedis design) and not by elongation of the sideplates. The tension created by pedaling is insufficient to cause the latter.

 

Maintenance:

Liquid lubricants penetrate to the inside of the links and are not easily displaced, but quickly attract dirt. "Dry" lubricants, often containing wax or Teflon, are transported by an evaporating solvent, and stay cleaner in use. The cardinal rule for long chain life is never to lubricate a dirty chain, as this washes abrasive particles into the rollers.^[3] Chains should be cleaned before lubrication. The chain should be wiped dry after the lubricant has had enough time to penetrate the links.

 

Hope this clarifies a few issues JB!