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A bit of perspective when its comes to trail grading
It is almost impossible to get a consistent grading if you are basing your trail grading on the IMBA system, which the bulk of trail gradings on SA trails are based on, as there is no SA trail grading system currently in place.
The IMBA system is subjective, not cast in stone, open to different interpretations and very short in terms of particular and concise detail when it comes to the often used word in their system....."obstacles"
Their system also requires a "Panel" to officiate the grading system, but it doesn't detail the requirements, skills, knowledge, qualifications, riding ability, etc of each panel member. In other words, you could have a bunch of newbies grading the B Spot at Bloemendal as a Black route, or conversely a bunch of enduro riders grading it as a Green route.
There are too many loopholes, not enough certainties and too much scope for subjective interpretation in the IMBA system for it to be consistent and cast in stone. In other words, its meant to be a guide, not a regulation
This said, this is the very reason that the TMTBC always err on the side of caution when grading their trails, as it gives their members, who are predominantly Blue riders, a conservative GUIDE as to what lies ahead. Remember that they are only concerned as to what happens on their trails and the safety of their vast membership, that's why their grading system on trails like the Cobra and the new Black Rhino is a little cautious.
If it ever comes down to a legal claim, which no doubt there will be one day, then its imperative that trail grading and signage always errs on the side of caution
No one is ever going to win when it comes to trail grading, so lets stop all the stress and argument by viewing trail grading as just a rough guide and go forth and enjoy yourself, no matter what type of rider you are....
Good videos. Going to watch those over and over again to get a handle on the course! Hate getting held up in those rock gardens because I didn't carry the momentum from further up.
You okes do realise that the footage and commentary on these videos are courtesy of the legendary "Muishond" himself.......
On the topic of the state of the trails, just remember that this time of the year, just before the first winter rains, all trails in the Cape Town area and surrounds are at their worst in terms of wear and tear, with little or no meaningful maintenance possible during the Spring and Summer and the sheer volumes of traffic that pound these trails, especially the TMTBC trails, with their over 7000 members and visitors that ride these trails on a frequent basis.
As per usual, I am sure all TMTBC trails will receive their annual winter maintenance once ground conditions are suitable
Bod! No man! Read between the rugged lines. Thermopoesiles is just a passionate mtber. He stands for progression. Sure he is uncensored. But I can assure you. There is no ill intent. Him and Patrick get along well IRL. Despite what it may look like on paper. That's just what it is. Too much inferred emotion in what is read. Too much online offendedness.
V18... appreciate what you say bud, but I don't think anyone
can defend Thermophage and his continued criticism of the TMTBC and the way he goes about it. Not constructive, He has never ever lodged a formal complaint to the TMTBC..... he prefers to attack the club via this forum, behind his keyboard. Thats what pisses me and most of the 7000 members of the club off.
He has never requested a meeting with either the committee or the trail trail builder to air his grievances, he just keeps on mouthing his grievances toxicably on this forum.
Another shout out to him..... Thermophage... please contact the club.... They would love to listen to you!!
This is now tiresome. How would I provide proof that I talked to any of the marshalls or committee members or Patrick himself?
Hoogies tomorrow morning 08:00 if you wanna chat in person.
As for trail maintenance ... yes I have used it, looong ago about Majik.
So, seeing as you clearly know who I am...who are you then? It's only fair to share.
But you hate the TMTBC trails so much.... pray tell why are you then riding Hoogekraal tomorrow ?????? Don't forget the honesty box then as you now " don't part with your money to the TMTBC..."
And let not forget the regrettable and totally unjustified verbal abuse that Thermophage has spewed forth upon the TMTBC on this forum for the past few years....
This is now tiresome. How would I provide proof that I talked to any of the marshalls or committee members or Patrick himself?
Hoogies tomorrow morning 08:00 if you wanna chat in person.
As for trail maintenance ... yes I have used it, looong ago about Majik.
So, seeing as you clearly know who I am...who are you then? It's only fair to share.
Stop worrying about who I am.... rather start worrying about the garbage that you post. Rather start thinking about it,,,,, carefully!
He has. Personally. On numerous occasions. As well as directly with the committee, via previous AGM's and in person on rides... the website is not the only portal for discussion and requests.
And now, as you've outed yourself as a TBMTB committee member, why the aggression? Why not just take it on board and have a discussion, instead of calling him a doooos and attacking his and others' views & concerns?
Firstly, I am not a TMTBC committee member. Secondly I can vouch that Thermophage has never ever, ever, ever approached the TMTBC officially with any of his requests, either verbally, in writing or with whatever format.
If I am am wrong, please provide me proof thereof... I would be glad to be proven wrong.
Remember the case of the three stories.... mine, yours and the truth...
So, If we are going to start a discussion, lets do it on an even keel... I am more than happy to participate!
@rockguy - absolutely. In terms of your question, that mailer nailed it.
The attacks, though - that is disheartening, though expected. In these "woke" times, it seems as if there's no room for the middle ground. As soon as you question one thing, you're "against" something and are "the enemy"
It's not good for constructive discussion, and it only serves to drive the wedge deeper. What could have been taken on as a constructive comment (a wish for more progressive trail, a la the XCO track but on a larger scale, and not necessarily as big either) is seen as an attack on "our club" and any semblance of dissatisfaction or an alternative / improvement to the current norm is torn to shreds by those who think the club can do no wrong.
"How dare he!"
he dares quite within his right, actually.
Anyway. Time for beer / tequila, and a long ride at Hoogies tomorrow. Cos yes, even though sometimes we want more, we like riding at the end of the day.
Once again... the comment is "rather engage the club directly on any issues you may have" and if you are not happy then go mad here
Yet everyone here is of the opinion that the club does not listen. How can they listen if you don't contact them.
As stated, ad nauseam, if you have an issue with the club, their policies, their vision, their fees, take it up with them directly on the many platforms available. If you get no response thereafter, then by all means bleat on this forum
And yip we all agree..... less *** talking and more riding.... the better
I got over talking to them directly a while ago thanks.
Also, I don't see how any rational person would consider criticism/feedback of this nature as being a "https://www.google.co.za/search?q=translate+box+to+afrikaans&oq=translate+box+to+afrikaans&aqs=chrome..69i57j0j69i64l2.5440j1j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8" (make sure to click the 1 More Translation button)
Anyway, the hope is really to get people talking. It is hopeless to talk to the club as a single person. Getting people thinking about what else is possible is more important as this point.
Going through the records, there is not one single trail maintenance/ build request from yourself on this matter. Once again, if you have any trail maintenance/build request, please feel free to log it and more importantly discuss it with the trail builder...
OK final 2c. Don't wanna have you posting so much today that your post count gets into the "I cna now sell stuff on the hub" category.
But the short of it is wholly yes. Not only on this forum, but via marshals, directly to committee members, builders, etc.
Anyway, have a rad weekend, go ride your bike and make sure you smile and chase a mate or get chased!
My final 2c to you
If you have a crit of the TMTBC, stop making a box of yourself on this forum with wild, woolly and unsubstantiated comments. Rather engage them on all the forums available. The Committee is progressive with many "E" riders on board and the trail builder is very much gravity orientated.
If your queries are not sorted to your satisfaction at this level, please feel free to go mad on this forum...
The all mountain line...few off camber rocky lines, the descent next to the climb to supertubes (seldom ridden) pretty much only off-camber turns. Come now you missed a few.
Ja... maybe a few..... but not the gazilions of berms
i'm on board with Thermo and Chavo. Some sanctimonious responses that evangelize the TMTBC and it's trails, but totally missing the opportunity to constructively engage with someone that is expressing a suggestion for a small change/addition. Instead, the thought is taken the wrong way and a potentially good discussion turns into a personal attack. Very Trump-like. wtf is up with all this sensitivity.
Its clear that you are only hearing one side of a three sided story. There is a huge difference between between engaging the TMTBC constructively on any trail suggestions as to dissing them openly on a forum like the Bikehub. The TMTBC has a specific "Trail Maintenance/building request" thread on its website. Every single trail maintenance/ building request gets back to its trail builder and he replies immediately
I take it no one on this thread has taken the responsibility to engage constructively with the TBMTBC on this platform??
Nice ad hominem, Bod. Fact of the matter is that Thermophage has valid concerns and views, but the club doesn't listen to "the pinners" who are looking for progressive trail.
Except for the new XCO track, which is great. But that's a small percentage of what could be amazing trail, if Patrick was just allowed to build something more than berms.
He has some valid concerns, but I think his anti venom of the TMTBC is so so skewered, that it affects his judgement. Lets take Contermanss into perspective... take away nothing from Rob Starke, who we all rate as a serious trail builder... and rider!!
He alludes to this as "different from the TMTBC trails as aits a different trail builder"... correct!
So he waxes lyrical about the Contermans trails as there are" lots of off camber corners and variety"..... I think in that statement he means no momotinous berms as he so much detests
Once again let me state that riding Contermans is a pleasure.... yet lets digress
Mast down mainline: 0 off camber and many berms albeit a bit rocky
Revised: 0 off camber, many berms albeit a bit rocky
Freeride: 0 off camber, many berms not rocky at all
Supertubes: 0 off camber, gazillions of fun berms
the Kloof: 0 off camber, more fun berms
Cheeky Corners: 0 off camber, more gazillions of fun berms
Happy Hops: Nada off camber, trazillions of fun berms
Tree Charge: FINALLY... 2 off camber corners and not many berms
So, being a regular rider of Conties, its clear..... the place is a berm fest.... and rightfully so as its so enjoyable
Just dont know whats so different to Contermans as to the rest of the TMTBC trails. Berm after berm
Thank god I love all these trails and the diversity they give you..
Wow ... once again, someone who doesn't read well...
Nobody is asking for steep gnarr....
This belief that Tygerberg area does not have steep or big hills...Now I am not sure where that came from, but it's a blatant lie to anyone who has not got blinkers on. Hoogies is very very steep, as is Meerendal, Hillcrest and Bloemendal (Conties is on it's own in this discussion as the primary decider on the trail is not TBMTBC).
That is a sorry story I'm sick of hearing for years now.
Already we have personally identified quite a few places where alternate lines could be cut branching off existing trails, only to be told certain people on the committee think it's "too dangerous"...Hmm, what about going down Bloemendaaler at 40km/hr? Surely that's also (much more) dangerous?
And I wouldn't confuse different scenery with trail type variety.
Relatively smooth trail after smooth trail joined by berm after berm. Yes it's fun, but the trail gets monotonous after a while.
Let's not get started on the big "e" word. There's seemingly about as much confusion and emotion as to what enduro means as there is about how many genders people can identify as these days. Suffice to say, "enduro" is not a type of riding. It's just trail riding...where you get timed.
Anyway, would be simpler to explain in person sometime I guess if we ever met up. The club no doubt had done great things, but ... they are not listening to many many many people asking for years now. So...no longer renewing a membership because of this (and because I moved house from on Majik) and will ride there occasionally still under a day permit (AFAIK the day permit money goes to the farmers and not the club?)....a vote with ones wallet goes a lot further.
To end..."I could go on and on, but wont"
Did you ever stop to contemplate as to why no-one listens to you??
It amazes me as to how people don't understand what the ethos and success about the TMTBC is about.
To put it into perspective, the TMTBC is arguably the biggest mountain bike club in the world.... yes the world, with over 7000 paid up members!!
Now surely there has to be some form of reason behind that success
So imagine if they had to cater for the 150 or so peeps that sign up for the 3 EWC events during the year, or the 50 or so peeps that pitch up for the very few D/H races on the Western Province calendar. Yes, they would be keeping 150 hard core riders happy every year. Unfortunately that is not going to sustain the land owners costs, trail building costs and maintenance costs of 150km of trails on offer on the network at the moment, as well of the needs of every other type of format of mountain biking. Its a no brainer, the club will die
So what they have done is provide a huge amount of variety (contrary to Thermophages opinion), from the park like set up at Bloemendal, to the pure riding beauty in nature of Hillcrest, to the more hard core riding of UPPER Contermans (yes, Contermans is part of the TMTBC trail network), to the real challenge of a proper day in the saddle at Hoogekraal/ Welvergenoegd/Fair Cape to the green and easy ride at Meerendal, to the big jump lines at Bloemendal, to the pump tracks at Bloemendal, to the Skills Park at Hoogekraal,... there is so much for everyone and that what makes the club arguably the biggest in the world.... the variety, the fact that these trails are on your doorstep, the fact that these trails are really well built and cater for all.... not just 150 odd Enduro riders
The Tygerberg Hills do not have the landscape and elevations of Jonkershoek , Table Mountain or Tokai. They have land offered to them by the generosity of local land owners, predominantly vineyards and smallish hills.... they do not have the elevation, rocks and the gnar that the 150 odd enduro riders seek and even if they did, it would not be sustainable... this club is what it is because of the way they have gone about it with what they have on offer.. providing variety to all.... and then some!
Lets not mention the fact that they have kept WPXCO and EWC alive this year with their generous sponsorships of both formats. Its well documented the EWC was dying at the end of 2017, yet not a word of thanks from those on this thread who criticize. Apparently, this sponsorship will continue into 2019. Surely the minority of those that don't appreciate the TBMTC should recognise this, especially if they partook in these events this year.
I could go on and on, but wont. To me, those that diss this club and what it has achieved, do not understand the essence of mountain biking in this country...
5
Let me clarify the trail running issue on TMTBC trails. There are only two trail centres that allow trail running on their property
1 Meerendal. There is supposed to be a running specific trail, but trail runners seem to run as and where they please, but the land owners are not too phased about it so chill and relax if you bump into one on the trail
2 Bloemendal lower. Lower Bloemendal only (to the South of Tygervalley Rd). Trail running only on the dirt roads and NOT any single track at all
That is it!!
No trail running at Upper Bloemendal, lower Bloemendal single track, Hillcrest, Contermanskloof, Hoogekraal, Welvergenoegd, Fair Cape or ANY of the Corridors. If you see any trail runners on these trails please feel free to take them out...
On the snake issue, taking into account that I do spend a lot of time on these trails, experience has taught me that the mornings are generally ok and there is definitely more activity from 3.00pm to 5.00pm. In summer, I stick to riding in the mornings....
4
Soil Searching: Karkloof trail builder Hylton Turvey
in Share Your Ride & Travels
Posted
Nice vid Fanie!
Hylton Turvey..... the silent assassin!!
What a gentleman, what a visionary, what a trail builder, what a human being..... and he rides a Kenevo!
See you soon