Recovery shakes, protein shakes, I'm just getting more confused.

[JGR]

Aah, so this is going to be turned into a mayo vs powered milk debate.... I stated my experience and never advocated mayo. Also think that after starting the day of with oats & honey I'm allowed to break the rules at lunch a bit?

 

Also humans cook food to break it down so we can digest it.... basic biology. Fire & cooking wasn't invented because of a mystical 'cool' factor!

relax there big guy .......

 

No one turned into into a vs debate. I used the only solid food item you mentioned as a reference. You also go onto mention it is cheating and it is reward and tastes good so by your own admission not the best thing. Agreed that it does taste good - but this is about recovery not tasty bits.

 

Cooking food isnt basic biology ...and humans arent the only ones to let food decompose or change state before eating it. What is a fact is that when food is cooked it loses a lot of its nutritional value.

 

p.s. remind me who invented fire?

Edited October 8, 2012 by JGR

[TNT1]

relax there big guy .......

 

No one turned into into a vs debate. I used the only solid food item you mentioned as a reference. You also go onto mention it is cheating and it is reward and tastes good so by your own admission not the best thing. Agreed that it does taste good - but this is about recovery not tasty bits.

 

Cooking food isnt basic biology ...and humans arent the only ones to let food decompose or change state before eating it. What is a fact is that when food is cooked it loses a lot of its nutritional value.

 

What is also a fact is that your body tells you what it needs in this situation.

 

So robo wanting that sammich means his body lets him know what it needs. This other guy saying how he can't eat anything he has to chew for an hour after a hard effort, is also his body speaking to him. Answering that message with some crap that bypasses it is not the correct answer.

[JGR]

What is also a fact is that your body tells you what it needs in this situation.

 

So robo wanting that sammich means his body lets him know what it needs. This other guy saying how he can't eat anything he has to chew for an hour after a hard effort, is also his body speaking to him. Answering that message with some crap that bypasses it is not the correct answer.

Perhaps you should head your own advice. I said relax im NOt turning this into a debate of the two as he suggested.

 

A fact?

 

The crap bypass was created by him ....

 

"Also humans cook food to break it down so we can digest it.... basic biology. Fire & cooking wasn't invented because of a mystical 'cool' factor!"

 

 

p.s i was me that said organs hurt .... if you bothered to read it all.

 

As Robo said it was reward, which is fine, eat away, as i also said. I pointed out the pros and cons as i see them

Edited October 8, 2012 by JGR

[RaymondC]

I know some top end euro pros they all use shakes and trust me they eat loads of food! They simply said the "shake" provides more nutrition and your body absorbs it quicker than normal food. But please remember a shake should not replace one of your main daily meals.

[TNT1]

Perhaps you should head your own advice. I said relax im NOt turning this into a debate of the two as he suggested.

 

A fact?

 

The crap bypass was created by him ....

 

"Also humans cook food to break it down so we can digest it.... basic biology. Fire & cooking wasn't invented because of a mystical 'cool' factor!"

 

 

p.s i was me that said organs hurt .... if you bothered to read it all.

 

As Robo said it was reward, which is fine, eat away, as i also said. I pointed out the pros and cons as i see them

 

I'm way confused after that.

 

And not about nutrition, about communication in English.

[arendoog]

if you train hard .More than 2h at a time .you will lose muscle afterwards if you dont replenish quicky .It takes too long for a meal to digest .By that time you have broken down muscle and then start buiding again .If you take stuff with peptopro for example ,your muscles recover faster and you keep what you have just trained for so hard .

[JGR]

I'm way confused after that.

 

And not about nutrition, about communication in English.

Which part did you struggle with? The quote was Robo so you will need to ask him about .....

['Dale]

For multi-day racing, shakes are crucial.

 

I use choc milk, branch chain amino acids and some L glutamine as recovery, alongside good food.

[TNT1]

Which part did you struggle with?

 

The part where I got told to heed my own advice, when I never really discussed my dietary habits here (edit: meaning, how do you know what advice in the context of this thread I may or may not follow?), had me reeling.

The knock-out came when you said "i was me"(sic).

 

I sure as hell hope that you was, and always will be, you.

Edited October 8, 2012 by TNT1

[JGR]

The part where I got told to heed my own advice, when I never really discussed my dietary habits here, had me reeling.

The knock-out came when you said "i was me"(sic).

 

I sure as hell hope that you was, and always will be, you.

"Answering that message with some crap that bypasses it is not the correct answer".....perhaps you should heed that advice you are so quick to dish out.

 

You are very correct you havent discussed dietry habbits which is the point of this thread isnt it?

 

Ok - if you didnt figure it out 'i' was meant to read 'it' or if you had bother to read properly initially you would have seen i wrote it.

[Agteros]

if you train hard .More than 2h at a time .you will lose muscle afterwards if you dont replenish quicky .It takes too long for a meal to digest .By that time you have broken down muscle and then start buiding again .If you take stuff with peptopro for example ,your muscles recover faster and you keep what you have just trained for so hard .

I agree, and disagree. At what point during exercise does your body start to eat it itself? (catabolise muscle) The whole simplistic thing of sugars during, and protein immediately after exercise does not make sense, especially with a long duration event! Surely you cannot go out on a bike ride for 5 hours, not expecting to sacrifice body muscle, and then prevent it from ever happening with a quick dash of protein the moment you stop?

 

Sure, some foods are too 'heavy', and some people are not tolerant to certain food/groups. I'm pretty convinced that for the majority of us there is some kind of real food which can be used during and after exercise!

[Agteros]

relax there big guy .......

 

No one turned into into a vs debate. I used the only solid food item you mentioned as a reference. You also go onto mention it is cheating and it is reward and tastes good so by your own admission not the best thing. Agreed that it does taste good - but this is about recovery not tasty bits.

 

Cooking food isnt basic biology ...and humans arent the only ones to let food decompose or change state before eating it. What is a fact is that when food is cooked it loses a lot of its nutritional value.

 

p.s. remind me who invented fire?

dunno hey... that is getting very philosophical if you want to be anal about it. However! I'm pretty sure you understand what I was saying about fire (hint: and figuring how to start one yourself, and how to use it for cooking)

[JGR]

I agree, and disagree. At what point during exercise does your body start to eat it itself? (catabolise muscle) The whole simplistic thing of sugars during, and protein immediately after exercise does not make sense, especially with a long duration event! Surely you cannot go out on a bike ride for 5 hours, not expecting to sacrifice body muscle, and then prevent it from ever happening with a quick dash of protein the moment you stop?

 

Sure, some foods are too 'heavy', and some people are not tolerant to certain food/groups. I'm pretty convinced that for the majority of us there is some kind of real food which can be used during and after exercise!

I think it would depend a lot on what you started with in the tank (on the day and from the previous day). I know for weight lose it is suggseted you train in the morning on an empty stomach to achieve exactly that.

[Agteros]

I know some top end euro pros they all use shakes and trust me they eat loads of food! They simply said the "shake" provides more nutrition and your body absorbs it quicker than normal food. But please remember a shake should not replace one of your main daily meals.

I know a dietician who suggests using whole foods

I also know of a 'monkey' who would undoubtedly suggest using bananas

 

Question to you: Is best advice/practice for a top end euro pro by default best advice/practice to a hubber?

[Cycling Major]

I haven't read the all the replies so if it has been mentioned sorry for the repeat.

 

Protein shakes are a great way to put back all the nutrients that was lost or burnt up during training. You can never in your whole like eat enough to get the protein that is in one shake...

 

Another thing is that your muscles cannot develop without protein or even grow so without protein (From food or shake) you are basically breaking yourself down!!!

 

Another thing that people don't know is that carbs can only be converted into energy with protein. So if you are on a lekka carbo loading session without protein, your carbs will be useless as they convert very very slowly...

 

I also do a daily dose of protein shakes. It keeps me from eating something that will put on the pounds but is also great for helping muscles to recover and also get stronger...

 

Just my 2c!

[JGR]

dunno hey... that is getting very philosophical if you want to be anal about it. However! I'm pretty sure you understand what I was saying about fire (hint: and figuring how to start one yourself, and how to use it for cooking)

I get what you are saying as i hope you get what I am. Its not philosophical its scientific. I didnt attack your chicken mayo but it was the solid food example available and used in this thread. The thread was to dicuss which im happy to do but please enough with the sarcasim it detracts from the topic and makes us say silly things like cooking food is biology.

 

Yes I know how to start a fire and cook with it. You also realise cooking over a fire is probably the most unhealthy way of cooking. I think steam is the best way to go.

 

From your previous example you body will start to 'eat itself' hence putting in nutrients that will be quickly absorbed to replenish the stock that is being eaten.

 

After a long session i also feel like popping a beer and sitting on the couch but im sure you would agree a recovery shake a strenching would make me feel better the next day