LCHF - Low Carb High Fat Diet Ver 2

[Leon Besaans]

You need to be fit enough. I'll try post the nutrition requirements for endurance athletes later (Joe Friel & Loren Courdain). Very interesting and important to know what is happening while racing.

 

Jaja, look, been off bike for 13 yrs and only been riding since Feb again, so dont have it in legs yet, but it will come... PLEASE post those nutition requirements...

[Leon Besaans]

If you are struggling to go over 2h30, try slowing it down a tad. Maybe you're just going a little too hard (like I was) and therefore you're not encouraging the fat burning engine, you're actually doing the opposite. So give a slower ride a go and see what happens, just now you find that you can actually go for 4hrs. Another question although relative just so that we have an idea, what is you're average HR on these 2h30 rides?

 

Average HR is around 135 (76% max).... I think I have gone to hard for the last 3 weeks or so, but short term not to worried....

 

 

Edited September 16, 2013 by Leon Besaans

[Helpmytrap]

Jaja, look, been off bike for 13 yrs and only been riding since Feb again, so dont have it in legs yet, but it will come... PLEASE post those nutition requirements...

Ahh, 13 years would explain it. When I was off the bike for just a year and a half it took me about 5 months before I could comfortably do 3hr+ rides again.

 

edit: 75% is on the high side, I usually average 70% on my really hard rides (granted the fitter you are the faster your HR drops/recovers thus lowering the average.) Try to average 60 to 65% max, at first you'll feel as if you're not really moving but once your aerobic engine gets fitter you'll be surprised by just how much speed you've gained for the same effort.

Edited September 16, 2013 by Helpmytrap

[jcza]

Jaja, look, been off bike for 13 yrs and only been riding since Feb again, so dont have it in legs yet, but it will come... PLEASE post those nutition requirements...

 

From the Paleo Diet for Endurance Athletes

[Sniffie]

Been off the bike for two months due to winter/life in general but have Berg 'n Bush in a couple weeks - waiting to see how I perform then! Is going to be reasonably chilled (I hope due to my fitness levels!) so should be able to experiment with eating / not eating and it shouldn't cause too much misery if I get it wrong. Will ride on water and carry some bars for emergency.

Which one are you doing Dave?

[Roux 1]

Spinach, more specifically Spur Spinach: What do they put into it? A simple recipe for spinach is some potato's, water, salt, maybe cream. I took some home and added to my omelette the following morning.

 

BG(resting) was 6,9mmol/L, the highest in a long time. :eek:

 

There must be some sugar added of some kind. It just showed me...anything is possible in a restaurant kitchen. I remember many moons I worked at Spur as a waiter. The cook told me::: if you want to be save order from the grill..

[Helpmytrap]

Spinach, more specifically Spur Spinach: What do they put into it? A simple recipe for spinach is some potato's, water, salt, maybe cream. I took some home and added to my omelette the following morning.

 

BG(resting) was 6,9mmol/L, the highest in a long time. :eek:

 

There must be some sugar added of some kind. It just showed me...anything is possible in a restaurant kitchen. I remember many moons I worked at Spur as a waiter. The cook told me::: if you want to be save order from the grill..

My spinach recipe is spinach, cream, garlic and a bit of cheese. Tastes really good.

I'd question any franchise food though, they'll put anything in it to keep you coming back for more.

[P.A.K.]

I'm convinced that all spur's veggies have got sugar or some variation in it

[tombeej]

Reading some recent posts to this thread (re. sudden enthusiastic adoption of high GI carbs during intense exercise), and that snippet from 'The Paleo diet for athletes, a big word of caution about taking in these carbs right from the start of an exercise. Even worse, taking them before the ride. Might not end up with a very positive outcome...

[Roux 1]

Some insightful posts as of late.. specific regarding carb consumption at high intensities and high volumes.

 

Some facts from my experiences as of late.

• BG(resting) is different from BG(active i.e. after high intensity) -- BG(active) stays low <5,5mmol/L even when apple and banana is eaten.
  
• My legs can not do sustained high intensity effort and sessions on low carb intake < 50g/day.
  
• The same goes for high volume training. I can ride for 7hours on nuts, droewors, pepotprpo, water. (tested it), but over a period of 12 weeks of high volume with very low carbs it made my legs tired.
  
• Thus:: clever carb intake is necessary during exercise or before certain efforts. As some of you also experienced and posted on.
  
• Weight loss: for me it confirms again that prolonged endurance does not make you loose weight. Sleep, short exercise sessions with weights, core exercises, less coffee and stress and LCHF/Paleo eating habits does>>
  

[Roux 1]

Reading some recent posts to this thread (re. sudden enthusiastic adoption of high GI carbs during intense exercise), and that snippet from 'The Paleo diet for athletes, a big word of caution about taking in these carbs right from the start of an exercise. Even worse, taking them before the ride. Might not end up with a very positive outcome...

 

Some more info please.. caution is the word agreed.. Like USN and 32gi not for me.

[davetapson]

Which one are you doing Dave?

Descent.

 

Had to look at the site to see which one is was and I see it's 11, 12, 13 th Oct. Damn, but I've cut this one fine!!

[davetapson]

Spinach, more specifically Spur Spinach: What do they put into it? A simple recipe for spinach is some potato's, water, salt, maybe cream. I took some home and added to my omelette the following morning.

 

BG(resting) was 6,9mmol/L, the highest in a long time. :eek:

 

There must be some sugar added of some kind. It just showed me...anything is possible in a restaurant kitchen. I remember many moons I worked at Spur as a waiter. The cook told me::: if you want to be save order from the grill..

 

Simple observation for all food (Spur spinach, curries, ready meals whatever) - if it is DELICIOUS it is FULL of sugar.

 

It's a bugger. We have a local curry house that makes the most delicious curries ever. I try not to think of the comment above.

[davetapson]

Reading some recent posts to this thread (re. sudden enthusiastic adoption of high GI carbs during intense exercise), and that snippet from 'The Paleo diet for athletes, a big word of caution about taking in these carbs right from the start of an exercise. Even worse, taking them before the ride. Might not end up with a very positive outcome...

 

Yeh - always interested me that the instructions on high energy juices / bars say to take an hour or 45 mins before exercise. To my mind that means you will be in full insulin triggered BG dip just as you start? Friel AFAIR says that the earliest that you should start ingesting carbs is as the race starts.

 

Me, I reckon I'd probably wait an hour or so or what I normally do which is to wait and see and then take carbs if I am flagging. But I'm adapting over time and I suspect that if I'm not going balls to the wall then I will need less and less carb as time goes by.

 

Which doesn't mean that I don't like HM's comment about eating everything in sight during a proper race. I suspect tho that it might switch you into carb burning too early in the race if not done with some circumspection. In real life I'd choose to burn fat as long as possible and only switch to carb burning when I start struggling.

 

I'm interested to see how Friel's views change. He was a Paleo proponent, and all his books reflect that. However, now that he has gone LCHF he may well modify his changes. All of his recent comments are so guarded and wrapped in defensiveness I don't think it will happen in a hurry.

[tombeej]

On Sunday morning, just before heading out on the road, for some reason I decided to eat the banana I'd put into my back pocket for later. Then the missus delayed me for about 15 min for some house admin. Eventually I could leave, but luckily I had the presence of mind to stuff my back pocket with dried fruit, etc. Because my BG was already spiking and there's only one logical outcome to that: the inevitable mini crash, the old raging hunger on the bike that must be continually fuelled. And that’s exactly what happened. I was ravenous all morning, couldn't get enough of the food in my pocket, after 70km started looking at road kill in a mouthwatering new way, and when I got home, absolutely had to raid the fridge.

 

So I get that our bodies can process high GI carbs very efficiently when we are exercising hard, but from my own humble viewpoint, please consider when to start consuming them. Like Dave says, I’d start about 30min into the ride, when your own glycogen stores are still relatively full, but far enough into the ride that there's no risk of possible backlash.

[tombeej]

While I choose to eat real, whole, nutritionally dense food as a rule (no processed factory made GU for me), as I understand it the speed at which the body absorbs these injections of glucose can be measured literally in a couple of mins (esp. if swallowed with water). Combined with the fact that you've got about 90min of glycogen stores before the rate of depletion starts, at a rapidly increasing rate. So there's lots of time to settle properly in the session/race before turning to these foods.

 

Normally I don't need any food on a 80 - 100km ride, if just riding at a comfortable tempo. But by making the mistake of eating a single banana 15min before a ride, if I hadn't taken those extra carbs on board I wouldn't have made it past 50km. Just saying...