Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted June 25, 2014 Share You didn't have to say anything you know. My opinion is still entering turn will help but it would need to be adjusted fairly soon, mid corner will hamper.Lol. Dude, one thing about me is that I admit when I am wrong. and your assertion here is 100% true BogusOne 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted June 25, 2014 Share "Don't listen to Mayhem" - Banna, 25 June 2014 Bahahahaha! As soon as I saw the notification of your reply I knew exactly what I'd see when logging in again. "Don't listen to Mayhem" - Banna, 25 June 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banna Posted June 25, 2014 Share Bahahahaha! As soon as I saw the notification of your reply I knew exactly what I'd see when logging in again.Haha! No worries boet. You have my blessings to keep the "Listen to Mayhem" bit intact. Captain Fastbastard Mayhem 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoLefty!! Posted June 25, 2014 Share Okay... humble pie time for me. Scuppered by my own experiment. Turning the bars away from the direction of your turn, mid corner, DOES shorten your wheelbase. What it doesn't do is aid counter steering as the wheels orientation resists the turn and you will fall your gat off. So. Fabian46, you were right, mostly, and I was mostly wrong. So how far out of line was the rear wheel to shorten the wheelbase....? and what was the lean angle and how did you measure the "effective head angle" Edited June 25, 2014 by GoLefty!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted June 25, 2014 Share So how far out of line was the rear wheel to shorten the wheelbase....?Not a lot at all. basically, bike on its side (45 deg) and you "counter steer" (pull left handlebar towards you if turning right and vice versa) and the more you turn the bars, the further back (towards the rear of the bike) the contact patch moves, reducing the effective wheelbase. won't work when you're upright for the reason you said before - rotating around the head tube. But as soon as the wheel is tilted, it's a different story. At the same time, your head tube to contact patch measurement reduces as well. RockCoach 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoLefty!! Posted June 25, 2014 Share its a test that also does not work while you're actually riding the bike... I see what you did there and its just wrong because at those extreme lean angle the bike is no longer riding. I have actually ridden a bike and tried that at slow speed. That Danny McAskill level of skill. take the bike and at reasoable lean angle, say 15 to 20 degree, hold the front wheel rigidly and swing the rear o the gravel. Then go measure the distance of any point on the arc to the the point where the front wheel was anchored. You may want to try this with a can of referee's cream... Edited June 25, 2014 by GoLefty!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted June 25, 2014 Share its a test that also does not work while you're actually riding the bike... I see what you did there and its just wrong because at those extreme lean angle the bike is no longer riding. I have actually ridden a bike and tried that at slow speed. That Danny McAskill level of skill. take the bike and at reasoable lean angle, say 15 to 20 degree, hold the front wheel rigidly and swing the rear o the gravel. Then go measure the distance of any point on the arc to the the point where the front wheel was anchored. You may want to try this with a can of referee's cream...Yeah, I know. which is why I said I was scuppered by my own experiment. In the experiment it DOES shorten the wheelbase, but it won't go through to real world unless you lean like Marques. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(Deon) Posted June 25, 2014 Share Oh, is it cream?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoLefty!! Posted June 25, 2014 Share Yeah, I know. which is why I said I was scuppered by my own experiment. In the experiment it DOES shorten the wheelbase, but it won't go through to real world unless you lean like Marques. Ok but even if your experiment shows that within a certain condition it does shorten the wheelbase at an extreme lean angle you basically arguing semantics because the purpose of the experiment was too determine whether there is a benefit to countersteer. The angle of lean in your experiment require to satisfy your hypothesis is impractical meaning that the experiment is flawed and the hypothesis does not hold true. Laying the bike flat on it side and turning the bars is not really of any use to anyone other than someone trying to the fit the bike into the load bed of a bakkie... You're also no longer exploiting the contact patch of the tyre but rather the side walls....hmmmmm Edited June 25, 2014 by GoLefty!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Fastbastard Mayhem Posted June 25, 2014 Share Ok but even if your experiment shows that within a certain condition it does shorten the wheelbase at an extreme lean angle you basically arguing semantics because the purpose of the experiment was too determine whether there is a benefit to countersteer. The angle of lean in your experiment require to satisfy your hypothesis is impractical meaning that the experiment is flawed and the hypothesis does not hold true. Laying the bike flat on it side and turning the bars is not really of any use to anyone other than someone trying to the fit the bike into the load bed of a bakkie... You're also no longer exploiting the contact patch of the tyre but rather the side walls....hmmmmm Exactly. Also part of why I said I was scuppered by my own experiment Lol. What a dumbass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nathrix Posted June 27, 2014 Share Not everybody caught onto the 29er thing in the beginning... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fandacious Posted June 27, 2014 Share Not everybody caught onto the 29er thing in the beginning... they're riding on the road?? rouxtjie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoLefty!! Posted June 27, 2014 Share jo'burg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nathrix Posted June 27, 2014 Share they're riding on the road?? Best place for a 26" and 650b, excellent in the tight twisty turns dodging traffic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sakkiebomskok Posted June 27, 2014 Share 29ers are for old people, might as well buy a roadbike sorry roadies...dirt is for racing, tarmac is for getting there Edited June 27, 2014 by sakkiebomskok nathrix 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigCCW Posted June 27, 2014 Share 29ers are for old people might as well buy a roadbike Careful you may get all the roadies in on this debate, then we will really have trouble sakkiebomskok 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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