Kimmage Interviews Froome

[Thug]

So what have I learnt about cycling after starting this thread.......

 

Rouxtjie won't approve if apply for a TUE to ride the Spruit to compensate for my lack of cycling ability and grey hair.

 

and that's about it.

[urbanroyal]

I think PK needs a P K...

[nochain]

 

 

An interesting sub-thread this question and it can become quite philosophical regarding where you draw the line. Should people with a low haematocrit be able to supplement it to get to the level of the "normal" guys? It's not the athlete's fault he didn't get the best genes. Isn't the point of athletics to ascertain who is the best (I guess in terms of nature and nurture) without any added supplements or anything? If you say asthma sufferers are allowed to perhaps take something "normal" athletes can't, is that not in effect levelling the playing field which is contradictory to the best man wins? So many questions!

Very interesting indeed the real problem here is people want to all draw there own lines based on what they think is right or wrong.

Take this example,lets say Contador has a bit of a leg length issue....nothing big...2mm on the one side.But because of this he gets many injuries and can't train as hard as Froome so he is at an disadvantage.So they give him a insert and he is good to go...no more tendonitis...wins the tour which he would never have done without the corrective action.

If it is about genes...he should not be allowed then to do this?

So we start checking for shoe inserts now?

 

Many guys on here should rather start watching bowls I think because if you have a problem with a finishing bottle and some chest medication once every couple of years you should not follow any sport at all.

 

[nochain]

Ok I see now someone has already used the shoe insert example.

[Tumbleweed]

Lance only had one ball so his testosterone levels were lower than others, so fairs fair he can level the playing field by taking some? Is that about right?

 

Nope, the remaining testicle will compensate for the lost one.

[Tumbleweed]

I believe that there are clean cyclists (there is one in particular that I would lay my head on a block for) but some dope. You can't tar everyone with the same brush.

 

I think I know who you're talking about, and I'll second that.

[Squier]

I think I know who you're talking about, and I'll second that.

 

Must be Cuddles! If he is doping, he needs to find a new doctor!

[VicanZA]

So it's out then, I don't dope..don't know how long I can stay clean, it's hard keeping up on bread and water.

[rouxtjie]

So what have I learnt about cycling after starting this thread.......

 

Rouxtjie won't approve if apply for a TUE to ride the Spruit to compensate for my lack of cycling ability and grey hair.

 

and that's about it.

Sure you have a TUE for your Salusa 45 thug.....well i hope you do.

 

In closing I am a bit surprised by some people's tolerance levels wrt this...considering cycling's tainted history and all that. The TUE thing imo is a way...and excuse the pun, a "masking agent" for worms underneath. There is no doubt legit cases, but it seems to be abused and spoils it for everyone....the whole leveling of the playing field chestnut that everyone and their brother is using is a weak argument that doesnt hold water.

 

For us weekend warriors no one cares...me in the least of what people are taking / doing to themselves to better their performance. But at elite level where big money changes hands there should really be a no tolerance approach otherwise we just putting makeup on the monkey...if its too hot in the kitchen get out, you simply werent made to compete at this level....this obviously applies to in competition only.

Edited July 2, 2014 by rouxtjie

[Mackem]

Funny that for all SKY beat the "clean drum" they have not signed up to become a member of the MPCC?

[SwissVan]

 

In closing I am a bit surprised by some people's tolerance levels wrt this...considering cycling's tainted history and all that. The TUE thing imo is a way...and excuse the pun, a "masking agent" for worms underneath. There is no doubt legit cases, but it seems to be abused and spoils it for everyone....the whole leveling of the playing field chestnut that everyone and their brother is using is a weak argument that doesnt hold water.

 

For us weekend warriors no one cares...me in the least of what people are taking / doing to themselves to better their performance. But at elite level where big money changes hands there should really be a no tolerance approach otherwise we just putting makeup on the monkey...if its too hot in the kitchen get out, you simply werent made to compete at this level....this obviously applies to in competition only.

Agree 100% with your first para, and maybe they should do back ground checks and not just accept what the current Doctors say (including past medical history) to see if the person is legit or just abusing it?

[Wyatt Earp]

....this obviously applies to in competition only.

 

Sheesh bra, we would have no competitors .

[rouxtjie]

Sheesh bra, we would have no competitors .

I hear your argument sheriff and in the same breath this is powerpoint land I am living in...it will never happen. It would be nice if all the greys can become black or white. The in competition reference was to argue that if your are sick enough for a TUE surely you are sick enough not to race. If you think about doping in cycling its almost always something that gives you and advantage in the cardio vascular department(EPO / blood doping) or recovery / muscles(testosterone derivatives) or weight(clem / aicar). If a TUE is written for a drug that would benefit these departments or is known to mask drugs that will influence these alarm bells should go off.

[Wyatt Earp]

I hear your argument sheriff and in the same breath this is powerpoint land I am living in...it will never happen. It would be nice if all the greys can become black or white. The in competition reference was to argue that if your are sick enough for a TUE surely you are sick enough not to race. If you think about doping in cycling its almost always something that gives you and advantage in the cardio vascular department(EPO / blood doping) or recovery / muscles(testosterone derivatives) or weight(clem / aicar). If a TUE is written for a drug that would benefit these departments or is known to mask drugs that will influence these alarm bells should go off.

 

However we are talking about an asthma pump, and said pump is on the list for various reasons, and that makes it a bad thing to have.

 

I fet exercise induced asthma ,have a pump but hardly ever use it.

I take it with me when I might need it, I recall doing Rhodes the one year and forgot the pump in the tent, they wanted to airlift me from the Tiffendel water point back down (I git tired of waiting and suffered my way back down)

 

Saying that, the onset of the respiratory issues start with one of two things with me, spine out of alignment and the ribs inflame and I struggle to breathe, second issue is when I have bad allergies.

Saying that, I hardly ever use the thing.

 

But back to what we are discussing, not 1 human is without any issue, every single one of us has a defect or problem of some sorts.

I will use a certain local master as an example, he has one leg shorter than the other, quite a bit actually ,he rides with a built up shoe and he is killer strong, won numerous titles over the years.

 

He is a great inspiration to many, so we all look at him and go "in the face of the problem he has, we admire that" What if he needed to apply to ride with a built up shoe ?

Suddenly it becomes and issue to some, he now has an advantage (regardless of the defect from birth)

 

I have used the example of contact lenses, yes it's a petty one however the same logic applies.

In the end of the day, we have to be careful of not going overboard and blurring the lines too much.

Froome using an Asthma pump gives him no advantage but it does put him on equal standing with those who weren't born with the same defect.

[rouxtjie]

However we are talking about an asthma pump, and said pump is on the list for various reasons, and that makes it a bad thing to have.

 

I fet exercise induced asthma ,have a pump but hardly ever use it.

I take it with me when I might need it, I recall doing Rhodes the one year and forgot the pump in the tent, they wanted to airlift me from the Tiffendel water point back down (I git tired of waiting and suffered my way back down)

 

Saying that, the onset of the respiratory issues start with one of two things with me, spine out of alignment and the ribs inflame and I struggle to breathe, second issue is when I have bad allergies.

Saying that, I hardly ever use the thing.

 

But back to what we are discussing, not 1 human is without any issue, every single one of us has a defect or problem of some sorts.

I will use a certain local master as an example, he has one leg shorter than the other, quite a bit actually ,he rides with a built up shoe and he is killer strong, won numerous titles over the years.

 

He is a great inspiration to many, so we all look at him and go "in the face of the problem he has, we admire that" What if he needed to apply to ride with a built up shoe ?

Suddenly it becomes and issue to some, he now has an advantage (regardless of the defect from birth)

 

I have used the example of contact lenses, yes it's a petty one however the same logic applies.

In the end of the day, we have to be careful of not going overboard and blurring the lines too much.

Froome using an Asthma pump gives him no advantage but it does put him on equal standing with those who weren't born with the same defect.

Your examples of the guy with the foot or contact lenses still remains fair given the athlete receives treatment. The contact lenses or inserts have little to no impact on the main "skillset / attributes required" to perform or win at an elite level. Dopers gained advantage in the departments listed in a previous post. Those are the problem children so to speak and again it would be nice if there was a zero tolerance view there because of the abuse we know exists. But where do you draw the line...where is enough...enough.

 

wrt to froomes asthma pump one has to ask if he then really is the best of the best considering his birth defect. a birth defect which medication influences the cardio system, if I took medication that will up my power output and retain muscle mass whilst cutting fat(some testo flavour) because I have low testosterone levels in my body(valid medical condition) does this make it fair to the guy that i beat by 1 second in the tdf because I have a TUE....who is the better athlete.

[Dawdle]

Anybody reading all about this at the Clinic on Cycling news forum, also a colourful discussion about the Fround's interview. I thought aliens don't need outside assistance.

Seriously, on last year's TdF, a red flag was raised when Sky ostensibly cheated, giving Froome goo, or finishing additive, on the climb, when he apparently bonked. Paid the fine, admitting to breaking the rules, hey but we need to win. The peleton struggled on, abiding by the rules. This is when I started to lose respect for the Sky Train and their marketing of clean cycling. Cheating is cheating.